$305 Million 2Q Profit

[Career Reserve]

Pitbull, I can see your point, but here is a counterpoint:
Without the West in the picture there would be no profit sharing for the East right? I assume there was none for the East in 2004 or 2005?


True. But when we were stripped of our Pension, benefits, pay (last pay cut was 21%) and seniority (if on Reserve) then this should have been a negotiated point on behalf of the West out of the Company's pocket and not a fellow f/a's pocket.

 

[EricLv2Fish]

I see. Thanks for the breakdown. Without knowing more detail I would say the blame falls on the representation of the employees.

 

[PITbull]

I see. Thanks for the breakdown. Without knowing more detail I would say the blame falls on the representation of the employees.

Blame falls not only on the AFA reps but also Dougie and team who would place this burden on the EAst MEC and the East f/as.

The operation; nor the contracts have merged! Why should the East share that provision with what still is a completely and separate contract?????

 

[EricLv2Fish]

Blame falls not only on the AFA reps but also Dougie and team who would place this burden on the EAst MEC and the East f/as.

The operation; nor the contracts have merged! Why should the East share that provision with what still is a completely and separate contract?????

Because the profits were generated by the combined company? I guess we could go round and round on this issue. I certainely see your point Pitbull. Perhaps by the time 2006 ends there will be a combined contract? If so it may help clear some very muddy water.

 

[PITbull]

Eric,

That just won't happen. The Company and the MECs are way too far apart.

Dougie owed it to the East to honor their contractual provision, cause I would bet my last buck that the East MEC did not volunteer to do this. But Dougie doesn't think on that level...arrogance and detachement prevail.

And more importantly, Dougie should have provided a "profit sharing" for his employees until a transition agreement is reached. The idea is for the transition agreement to negotiate a bigger pool to include the West, and since it appears that the company is pulling in hundreds of millions in profits, they should increase the pool to encompass the 12,000 west employees. This should not come from the East pool.

 

[barbeetantrums]

Kinda off topic, BUT, I believe Dougie, said they increased the rates for rampers in PHX??? also at the express carriers there have been some increases to desk jobs (dispatchers and such) Dougie has held true though, he will pay market rates, when those rates can't retain or attract the people, he'll raise the rates. (I believe Ornstein made this comment awhile ago) So oh well.

On the PHX ramp, rampers making less than $9/hr were raised to $9/hr. There was no increase across the board. This only applied to PHX. LAS, LAX and the other stations did not see this increase. LAS is as desperate for employees as PHX.

 

[HPearlyretiree]

On the PHX ramp, rampers making less than $9/hr were raised to $9/hr. There was no increase across the board. This only applied to PHX. LAS, LAX and the other stations did not see this increase. LAS is as desperate for employees as PHX.

What do SW rampers make starting in PHX?

 

[SKY HIGH]

I can agree with most of what you posted (for once).

But, you missed the main point of the issue of why I even brought the obvious up. Dougie is only willing to negotiate a transition agreement that is completely "cost neutral". Meaning, he will operate the airline separately.

sky high states: Bob, this is why we bring up the past. Move on, you say? NOT until "someone" realizes that WE ALREADY (round 1)GAVE.....(round 2)GAVE....AND (round 3)GAVE!!!!!!!!!

this is getting fricken ridiculous already!

 

[sharktooth]

On the PHX ramp, rampers making less than $9/hr were raised to $9/hr. There was no increase across the board. This only applied to PHX. LAS, LAX and the other stations did not see this increase. LAS is as desperate for employees as PHX.

barbee,

What does SWA pay their rampers at PHX(realizing that there may not be a one-for-one, job-2-job, correspondence.)

I hear some 100 rampers did not show in PHL one day. Does that mean the remaining will get a raise?

Is it possible to work in PHL for less than $9 an hour, less than $18,000 a year, less if part time and still live in something other than a cardboard box?

 

[ilg30/7]

Blame falls not only on the AFA reps but also Dougie and team who would place this burden on the EAst MEC and the East f/as.

The operation; nor the contracts have merged! Why should the East share that provision with what still is a completely and separate contract?????

Because it is taking a percentage of the profits of the combined operation, not a percentage of the profits of the East operation. Doing so would validate your whole "seperate contracts, seperate operations" argument, but result in a lower overall amount to be devided among the East f/a's. I do not agree that the East f/a's are entitled to a percentage of the combined company's profits to be distributed among only the East f/a's.

 

[PITbull]

Because itis taking a percentage of the profits of the combined operation, not a percentage of the profits of the East operation. Doing so would validate your whole "seperate contracts, seperate operations" argument, but result in a lower overall amount to be devided among the East f/a's. I do not agree that the East f/a's are entitled to a percentage of the combined company's profits to be distributed among only the East f/a's.

Well, sparky, wouldn't it make sense that Dougie, boy wonder, provide a % of profit sharing for thsoe 3,000 f/as? Specifically because the total operation of the West accounts for 12,000 employees total vs. 23,000 on the East. PLUS, and paramount point is that profits sharing is in the EAST contract provision; not the West.

They should be working out their own profit sharing provision speicifically because THEIR contract has been at amendable date since 2004. Then, when Dougie is willing to negotiate a transition agreement provide for a new % as with all the labor groups who find themselves merging with a company they never asked to merge with or share their provision with!

But instead, Dougie was left off the hook and burdened the East f/as whose only monetary provision for a third round of concessions of $154 million yeilded a profit sharing plan!

Can you explain to me what conecessions the West f/as gave from their contract to yeild 14.5% of the 10% annual total profit pie????

So with your logic, one could assume that if LCC merges with yet another airline that maybe a legacy of 50,000 employees, that SAME pie would have to be shared among them too? And wait, that means each f/a will probably get $10 bucks gross pay for a possible net profit from the company of $300 million and the 14.5% of the f/a pie piece.

Way to go!!!! Enough to go to Eckard Drug store and by some Sarris's candy!!! Now that's a treat; definitely worth 3 concession pay cuts, dumping of pension plans, higher benefits, lousy work rules and yes...cleaning planes.

Glad I'm out!

 

[ilg30/7]

Well, sparky, wouldn't it make sense that Dougie, boy wonder, provide a % of profit sharing for thsoe 3,000 f/as? Specifically because the total operation of the West accounts for 12,000 employees total vs. 23,000 on the East. PLUS, and paramount point is that profits sharing is in the EAST contract provision; not the West.

They should be working out their own profit sharing provision speicifically because THEIR contract has been at amendable date since 2004. Then, when Dougie is willing to negotiate a transition agreement provide for a new % as with all the labor groups who find themselves merging with a company they never asked to merge with or share their provision with!

But instead, Dougie was left off the hook and burdened the East f/as whose only monetary provision for a third round of concessions of $154 million yeilded a profit sharing plan!

Can you explain to me what conecessions the West f/as gave from their contract to yeild 14.5% of the 10% annual total profit pie????

So with your logic, one could assume that if LCC merges with yet another airline that maybe a legacy of 50,000 employees, that SAME pie would have to be shared among them too? And wait, that means each f/a will probably get $10 bucks gross pay for a possible net profit from the company of $300 million.

Way to go!!!! Enough to go to Eckard Drug store and by some Sarris's candy!!! Now that's a treat; definitely worth 3 concession pay cuts, dumping of pension plans, higher benefits, lousy work rules and yes...cleaning planes.

Glad I'm out!

Simply put, it is NOT the same pie. If USAirways were to merge with another airline, this one with 50,000 employees, the profit would presumably increase as well. In the current merger, the combined carrier made a greater profit than either of the two former carriers did seperately. Had US East been a stand alone operation, the percentage of profit sharing would have come from a smaller profit. Therefore, the total amount going to the East f/a's would have been less than it is currently.

What the East MEC voted for, according to you, was to take the best practice of the current contracts (profit sharing vs. no profit sharing)and apply it to the entire workgroup during the transition period.

As to the rest of your post, I am quite aware of the sacrifices everybody in the East has made. What form the new contract takes is anybody's guess, but it's going to be difficult to recognize those sacrifices with monetary compensation without completely dividing the workforce between West and East.

 

[PITbull]

Simply put, it is NOT the same pie. If USAirways were to merge with another airline, this one with 50,000 employees, the profit would presumably increase as well. In the current merger, the combined carrier made a greater profit than either of the two former carriers did seperately. Had US East been a stand alone operation, the percentage of profit sharing would have come from a smaller profit. Therefore, the total amount going to the East f/a's would have been less than it is currently.

What the East MEC voted for, according to you, was to take the best practice of the current contracts (profit sharing vs. no profit sharing)and apply it to the entire workgroup during the transition period.

As to the rest of your post, I am quite aware of the sacrifices everybody in the East has made. What form the new contract takes is anybody's guess, but it's going to be difficult to recognize those sacrifices with monetary compensation without completely dividing the workforce between West and East.

I'm talking facts, my friend, not some hypothetical whether East would have made more or less a profit without a merger. Thats your conjecture, purely guessing that West is so profitable as a stand alone. You may have the management, but in the LCC its considered a Wholly-owned currently. The operation on the East is much larger than on the West...yes-no?

In order for your scenario to make any sense, you would have to separate the operation. That shouldn't be that hard to do since the operations have not merged...JUST THE PROFIT SHARING FROM THE EAST CONTRACTS!!!

And since we are making guesses here let me weigh one in...I bet that 85% of the profit CAME FROM THE EAST OPERATION...AS THEY HAVE THE INTERNATIONAL.

 

[Barbell]

And since we are making guesses here let me weigh one in...I bet that 85% of the profit CAME FROM THE EAST OPERATION...AS THEY HAVE THE INTERNATIONAL.

And the extremely high yield Shuttle...

 

[PITbull]

And the extremely high yield Shuttle...

Agreed, ...very high yield and profit maker, indeed!