Cav, Without question , the 6 Million Dollar mistake played a part in this. Dave's story about having to pay to retain quality leadership , basically fell on deaf ears. Many are of the opinion that "Quality" was never there to begin with, hince our present condition. He followed up by stating that he has brought in at least 35% new faces to see us out of this...he said that at least another 10% of upper management would change too. The other issues that slanted the tide of "No" , were the Retro issues....and the payment of $1.25 Million to a Union (IAM) , that many of it's members have simply lost all faith in. We do afterall pay monthly dues for thier supposed negotiation skills. Why does a failing carrier such as we are labled have to subsidize negotiations? The last issue was people being of the mindset...that a vote either way , spelled doom to thier continued employment regardless , So why go down , laying down? I was , as previously stated in other threads..."Willing" to do what I thought was beneficial to the supposed greater good. I have had more than a few second thougts on that rational since then. I can say without fail...that my life and financial well being has been ruined since I was "Hi-Jacked" into the IAM....I had "No Vote" ,"No Say" on the subject...I was acreeded into a "Like it or not?" situation. Frankly now...I hope the judge tosses the IAM into the Pautomac River.....and then maybe? , some simblance of my life can return to normal. I won't be holding my breath in the interum.