American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[Tim Nelson]

This is what P. Rez seems to cling to:



Some things never change, apparently. This is from Kev at NWA in 2006, no one at NW wanted the loser IAMNPF.

Josh

The iam pension is unsustainable but members arent being educated by the leaders. All that mr baskett says is that its in the green zone. The motor city iam pension is in the green zone as well after suspending and cutting pensions. Google it.

Green zone means NOTHING. What is significant is what is keeping it green?
The $2 billion it shedded in 2014 boosted it from underfunded up to 108%. So was the plan healthy since it was overfunded? Of course not because it was artificially supported by eliminating $2 billion of our benefits. The plan is currently at an underfunding burn of $500 million a year. So over 4 years, its gone from overfunding to over $1 billion underfunded and will have to rob more of our benefits.
Im not making a political statement because i wont be able to fix it either from its inherent problems of years of bad investing, interest rates that had assumed rates that were too high, etc.
The problem for lus isnt that Sito is standing up for health care but the problem is that he has the iam $$ pension interest ahead of his members. He helped bring down NWA with it and could bring us down with it.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim:
I think Rez isn’t thinking objectively on the pension, he is taking his matching orders from the international and they obviously want to both maintain the plan but also get LAA TWU into it. I was just in DCA and the IAMNPF has some nice facilities right by DuPont Circle.

Josh

We need to focus on the 401k and structure. If a pilot on a 777 makes $340 hour x hours, and a 16% 401k, and has it structured insomuch where the profit sharing and total compensation is included then we need 16% for total compensation as well and not just on 40 hours which would be a joke.

 

[Tim Nelson]

It is also important to note that the 16% 401k was deemed a fair tradeoff with the healthcare through BINDING arbitration.
The 9% offer is just unacceptable.

The Power of Saying No!

 

[Tim Nelson]

CremaDiLimone,

Of course we know the numbers. Let me throw some numbers out there. Gain 1 sick day, get full pay for first sick day, get 3 holidays, get $.55-$.61 shift differential if you fit the hours, get $.70 if a CC, get $.24 raise at top out, get 5% 401k, get up to 4% match 401k if you put in up to 4%, get 6 weeks vacation at 30 years. Here's what else the company wants besides just the insurance: lose 500-700 catering jobs, lose 60-80 mail in LAS and PHX, lose 5.5%-11.5% pension contribution depending on where you are on scale. That's for LUS.

Now for LAA. You gain 5 holidays, 5 sick days, 6 weeks vacation at 30 years, $.11 CC, $.55-$.61 shift differential, $.24 raise, get 5% 401k, get up to 4% 401k match, double time OT. What do they want from you: to fill FT vacancies when they occur with roughly 1000 part time employees, lose deicing.

And for the icing on the company cake, they want several jobs on the "when and where directed" list which would be lavs, water, etc.

I don't have the numbers but this contract offer is cost negative or at best cost neutral. Reminder, the company wants 17% of our jobs between fleet and MX.

Anybody still wonder why we are saying phuck you company?

P. Rez

[/QUOTE]
i hear ya PRez but just to note that 30% of our members are getting half of what you commented on. Considering our 30% PT, and .65?? or 2% its like the company is getting a free ride only contributing up to $840 a year contribution for 5.5 hr part time shifter.

 

[bob@las-AA]

It is also important to note that the 16% 401k was deemed a fair tradeoff with the healthcare through BINDING arbitration.
The 9% offer is just unacceptable.

The Power of Saying No!

The company will always serve to the pleasure of the pilots, that's because the company needs the pilots, along with their skills, training and professionalism. That can not be said about the clerks, Anybody can be a clerk, no experience necessary. we are the lowest paid in the company, because it takes no skill to do what we do. In DFW we even have a new hire that is a twice convicted pedophile. We will never get what the pilots get as far as the 401k so lets put that to rest right now. And to better understand that 9% in my opinion is not what you think it is, its probably 5.5% on gross pay and a 3.5% match on that we elect to contribute.

 

[swamt]

CremaDiLimone,

Of course we know the numbers. Let me throw some numbers out there. Gain 1 sick day, get full pay for first sick day, get 3 holidays, get $.55-$.61 shift differential if you fit the hours, get $.70 if a CC, get $.24 raise at top out, get 5% 401k, get up to 4% match 401k if you put in up to 4%, get 6 weeks vacation at 30 years. Here's what else the company wants besides just the insurance: lose 500-700 catering jobs, lose 60-80 mail in LAS and PHX, lose 5.5%-11.5% pension contribution depending on where you are on scale. That's for LUS.

Now for LAA. You gain 5 holidays, 5 sick days, 6 weeks vacation at 30 years, $.11 CC, $.55-$.61 shift differential, $.24 raise, get 5% 401k, get up to 4% 401k match, double time OT. What do they want from you: to fill FT vacancies when they occur with roughly 1000 part time employees, lose deicing.

And for the icing on the company cake, they want several jobs on the "when and where directed" list which would be lavs, water, etc.

I don't have the numbers but this contract offer is cost negative or at best cost neutral. Reminder, the company wants 17% of our jobs between fleet and MX.

Anybody still wonder why we are saying phuck you company?

P. Rez

[/QUOTE]
Of the 17% jobs split between fleet and MX, what are the splits? If pass cuts say anything the MX side will get larger cuts than the fleet side because fleet runs the nego's...

 

[Vortilon]

Always goes back to 2003, doesn't it.

Once in BK in 2012, there was also urging for maintenance workers to vote no on their TA and face abrogation of the CBA because it is the only way to get a good deal.

If that's what the maintenance group believes then keep saying no and you'll eventually get all you believe you deserve. Right.

We did it Little's way in 2003, and got our collective stool pushed in for 5 years - which has now been pushed out to almost half my time with the firm. Now you're back to the woulda coulda shoulda agreement of 2012, BTW, that was such a good, fair deal..not. It was yet another shell game that A/C Maintenance got screwed on yet again. As if it isn't bad enough - fighting the company in negotiations - it's their job to try to screw us, AMTs have to deal with the shell game masters at the TWU international picking their favorites during negotiations. Here's a tip, it's never AMTs.

BTW, it's not just what we believe, it's what we know. It was no secret that Little hated A/C Maintenance, and every chance that little shite had, he made sure we were screwed. That POS Ed Kosiatek was no better either.

 

[NYer]

The company will always serve to the pleasure of the pilots, that's because the company needs the pilots, along with their skills, training and professionalism. That can not be said about the clerks, Anybody can be a clerk, no experience necessary. we are the lowest paid in the company, because it takes no skill to do what we do. In DFW we even have a new hire that is a twice convicted pedophile. We will never get what the pilots get as far as the 401k so lets put that to rest right now. And to better understand that 9% in my opinion is not what you think it is, its probably 5.5% on gross pay and a 3.5% match on that we elect to contribute.

The 16% for the pilots stems from their loss of the Plan B (pension) during the BK, which was a lump sum that could pay out as much as $2M.

 

[NYer]

We did it Little's way in 2003, and got our collective stool pushed in for 5 years - which has now been pushed out to almost half my time with the firm. Now you're back to the woulda coulda shoulda agreement of 2012, BTW, that was such a good, fair deal..not. It was yet another shell game that A/C Maintenance got screwed on yet again. As if it isn't bad enough - fighting the company in negotiations - it's their job to try to screw us, AMTs have to deal with the shell game masters at the TWU international picking their favorites during negotiations. Here's a tip, it's never AMTs.

BTW, it's not just what we believe, it's what we know. It was no secret that Little hated A/C Maintenance, and every chance that little shite had, he made sure we were screwed. That POS Ed Kosiatek was no better either.

The problem with your theory is that the NC for the AMT's were AMT Local Presidents and the only Members that voted for the CBA were also AMT's.

You don't like what you ended up with, obviously, but blaming everyone under the sun doesn't change anything.

AMT's blame Fleet, the Line AMT blame the Base AMT, they blame the leadership...they blame everyone but they don't make a change.

 

[Tim Nelson]

The company will always serve to the pleasure of the pilots, that's because the company needs the pilots, along with their skills, training and professionalism. That can not be said about the clerks, Anybody can be a clerk, no experience necessary. we are the lowest paid in the company, because it takes no skill to do what we do. In DFW we even have a new hire that is a twice convicted pedophile. We will never get what the pilots get as far as the 401k so lets put that to rest right now. And to better understand that 9% in my opinion is not what you think it is, its probably 5.5% on gross pay and a 3.5% match on that we elect to contribute.

true but we already have great healthcare so lus really doesnt have to care what parker gave the pilots unless parker wants our health care, right?

 

[Tim Nelson]

The 16% for the pilots stems from their loss of the Plan B (pension) during the BK, which was a lump sum that could pay out as much as $2M.

that could be but the arbitrator mirrored the delta 401k to the exact %.

 

[P. REZ]

Of the 17% jobs split between fleet and MX, what are the splits? If pass cuts say anything the MX side will get larger cuts than the fleet side because fleet runs the nego's...[/QUOTE]

17000 Fleet, 13000 MX. The company proposed cutting 5000 jobs total with most coming in MX.

I'm in negotiations and fleet is with MX all the time and I can say that fleet does not run anything. Sito and Regan were MX.

P. Rez

 

[NYer]

that could be but the arbitrator mirrored the delta 401k to the exact %.

Arbitrator?

 

[Jester]

In DFW we even have a new hire that is a twice convicted pedophile.

I find that difficult to believe given the 50-something question check-off sheet for prior criminal convictions over the past 25 (?) years required upon SIDA badge application or renewal. We have had relatively senior guys in PHX arrested for child porn (but not yet convicted) and were terminated, not to mention, something as "simple" as a DUI without injuries conviction leading to loss of driving privileges, thus revocation of SIDA badge. My experience has been that it does not take much of a criminal conviction of some offense to be denied a SIDA badge-- simple assault, domestic abuse, DUI, petty theft, fraud, forgery, misdemeanor drug possession, etc., I have all seen as being grounds for termination.

 

[bob@las-AA]

I find that difficult to believe given the 50-something question check-off sheet for prior criminal convictions over the past 25 (?) years required upon SIDA badge application or renewal. We have had relatively senior guys in PHX arrested for child porn (but not yet convicted) and were terminated, not to mention, something as "simple" as a DUI without injuries conviction leading to loss of driving privileges, thus revocation of SIDA badge. My experience has been that it does not take much of a criminal conviction of some offense to be denied a SIDA badge-- simple assault, domestic abuse, DUI, petty theft, fraud, forgery, misdemeanor drug possession, etc., I have all seen as being grounds for termination.

Yes sir, this person is employed on the ramp at LAA.