April/May 2013 Pilot Discussion

[end_of_alpa]

So, where is the West answers to my questions? (sound of crickets, meaning they can't discuss anything on the law because they simply don't know.)

 

[Phoenix]

Sailed over your head didn't it. Those legacy carriers were failing. If it wasn't for the following mergers that happened, they still wouldn't be recalling or hiring and one of them would for sure no longer exist.

Bean

Are you trying to somehow suggest that the pilots of those carriers are greatly disappointed that they never sent an app to AWA? AWA was always what it was and nothing will change that or make its history any better, but APA will prostrate themselves to the sandcastle superiority, after all AWA did save them.

 

[dca319]

More like a few months but hey, only Parker knows for sure.

Few months? I don't recall that - not even close. And look at how long we bounced along in bankruptcy? Considering we were one leg into C7, one would think better to throw those stones.

 

[nevergiveup]

Few months? I don't recall that - not even close. And look at how long we bounced along in bankruptcy? Considering we were one leg into C7, one would think better to throw those stones.

Move, give it a rest!

 

[end_of_alpa]

Few months? I don't recall that - not even close. And look at how long we bounced along in bankruptcy? Considering we were one leg into C7, one would think better to throw those stones.

AWA was a few months from BK when the merger was announced. Ask Parker. Now, can we "move" on???

 

[end_of_alpa]

So, where is the West answers to my questions? (sound of crickets, meaning they can't discuss anything on the law because they simply don't know.)

Chirp, chirp.

 

[traderjake]

Now, can we "move" on???

Not until I finish reading that list of AOL contributers you reposted.

 

[dca319]

AWA was a few months from BK when the merger was announced. Ask Parker. Now, can we "move" on???

And we were in bankruptcy and just about C7. Ask Parker. Still hate your kids?

 

[dca319]

Move, give it a rest!

Give it up.

 

[Beancounter]

So, where is the West answers to my questions? (sound of crickets, meaning they can't discuss anything on the law because they simply don't know.)

Sorry, I missed the question. What was it?

Are you trying to somehow suggest that the pilots of those carriers are greatly disappointed that they never sent an app to AWA? AWA was always what it was and nothing will change that or make its history any better, but APA will prostrate themselves to the sandcastle superiority, after all AWA did save them.

No, not at all. I'm saying that in their condition at that time, I wouldn't have wanted to work there. Merging with AA will help us both. As far as saving them, that honor would go to Doug Parker and his team, if they pull it off. Horton would have put AA right back into bankruptcy and the AA pilots were smart enough to see it.

AWA was a few months from BK when the merger was announced. Ask Parker. Now, can we "move" on???

If you want to say a few months = 1 1/2 to 2 years, then I'd agree.

Bean

 

[dca319]

If you want to say a few months = 1 1/2 to 2 years, then I'd agree.

Bean

At the earliest. I'd even speculate that they'd have merged prior to filing.

 

[Beancounter]

At the earliest. I'd even speculate that they'd have merged prior to filing.

Maybe we could have avoided it alltogether, who knows. When US would have gone under it would have been a boost, but i don't think AWA would have gotten any of the really valuable stuff. Delta and Southwest would have been the big benafactors for sure. Excuse the spelling and grammar, i'm still getting used to a phone with no physical keyboard🙂

Bean

 

[end_of_alpa]

Not until I finish reading that list of AOL contributers you reposted.

Do you need me to "repost" it.....AGAIN!

 

[end_of_alpa]

Sorry, I missed the question. What was it?

No, not at all. I'm saying that in their condition at that time, I wouldn't have wanted to work there. Merging with AA will help us both. As far as saving them, that honor would go to Doug Parker and his team, if they pull it off. Horton would have put AA right back into bankruptcy and the AA pilots were smart enough to see it.

If you want to say a few months = 1 1/2 to 2 years, then I'd agree.

Bean

I know I won't get a West answer because they don't want to reveal their hand (as weak as it is) but here goes. How about comparing the Complaint in Addington I and Addington II and tell me why Harper didn't plead the proper elements of a DFR, which is: "A union breaches its duty of fair representation if it's actions are either "arbitrary, discriminatory, or in bad faith." WHY? None of these elements of DFR are plead and, in fact the ONLY validation of "legitimate union purpose" (catch phrase that has NO legally definable claim in law) is NOT an element. Even in Addington I Harper & Jacobs really didn't get it right when they plead: "The duty of fair representation precluded USAPA from acting arbitrarily, for IMPROPER PURPOSE, or in bad faith." Did they even plead it correctly in Addington I? What say you??? (I really don't expect an answer. You guys simply CANNOT read the core pleadings and critique them. You and yours continue to "cherry pick". Also, read the AwFOL answer to USAPA filings. Talk about bitter: "The other two filings were USAPA’s motion to dismiss the West Pilots’ claim along with their memorandum in support. You can read these filings here and here. We can summarize both this way: (1) not ripe; (2) the DFR is a minor dispute and not a major dispute, meaning that we should be in front of another arbitrator instead of in federal court; and (3) that we fail to state a claim for several reasons. All we care to say about USAPA’s filings is that they present no new or novel arguments; what we read in them is exactly what we have heard all along." Question #3: Why SHOULD USAPA change what has always been the prevailing argument?

 

[Beancounter]

I know I won't get a West answer because they don't want to reveal their hand (as weak as it is) but here goes. How about comparing the Complaint in Addington I and Addington II and tell me why Harper didn't plead the proper elements of a DFR, which is: "A union breaches its duty of fair representation if it's actions are either "arbitrary, discriminatory, or in bad faith." WHY? None of these elements of DFR are plead and, in fact the ONLY validation of "legitimate union purpose" (catch phrase that has NO legally definable claim in law) is NOT an element. Even in Addington I Harper & Jacobs really didn't get it right when they plead: "The duty of fair representation precluded USAPA from acting arbitrarily, for IMPROPER PURPOSE, or in bad faith." Did they even plead it correctly in Addington I? What say you??? (I really don't expect an answer. You guys simply CANNOT read the core pleadings and critique them. You and yours continue to "cherry pick". Also, read the AwFOL answer to USAPA filings. Talk about bitter: "The other two filings were USAPA’s motion to dismiss the West Pilots’ claim along with their memorandum in support. You can read these filings here and here. We can summarize both this way: (1) not ripe; (2) the DFR is a minor dispute and not a major dispute, meaning that we should be in front of another arbitrator instead of in federal court; and (3) that we fail to state a claim for several reasons. All we care to say about USAPA’s filings is that they present no new or novel arguments; what we read in them is exactly what we have heard all along." Question #3: Why SHOULD USAPA change what has always been the prevailing argument?

Do you realize that you lost the first case and only won on appeal, because of ripeness? You're basing your questions I believe on a false asumption. As time passes by your( USAPA's) argument gets weaker and weaker.*

* This is my personal observation and does not represent that of AOL or it's lawyers

If I don't respond right away, it's because I've got to take the kids to swimming and I'm not too good at typing while driving🙂

Bean