Article re. PIT-LAX

[BoeingBoy]

You're slipping, Clue. I thought somebody would jump on this part.....

WN considers these Premier routes which require and produce high yields in both directions because they limit aircraft utilization - not typical WN strategy.

Jim

 

[jetpiedmont79]

I'm going to say this.... if the DL deal goes down, CVG is going to look a lot like PIT today.

 

[pit_needs_help]

I'm going to say this.... if the DL deal goes down, CVG is going to look a lot like PIT today.

I think CVG will look like CVG and PIT will be even quieter. When PIT was a hub the media and many bitched about fares and USair said you wont have all those non-stops as it was a connecting hub. They were sooooo happy to finally get low-cost service which meant mostly one-stop flights somewhere to connect to somewhere else. Well you got it.

 

[JMM]

I think CVG will look like CVG and PIT will be even quieter. When PIT was a hub the media and many bitched about fares and USair said you wont have all those non-stops as it was a connecting hub. They were sooooo happy to finally get low-cost service which meant mostly one-stop flights somewhere to connect to somewhere else. Well you got it.

Very true the folks in PIT got what they asked for....

 

[BoeingBoy]

Does anybody really think that the folks that use CVG, which has the highest average fares in the country, don't complain about high fares?

Any doubt why US management says CVG will see an increase in flights?

Jim

 

[Travelpro72]

How did PIT get what it "asked" for? The airport was dominated by US which was fine except for the fact that they kept the damn fares so high if forced some to not fly and those that wanted a better fare to travel to surrounding airports. So giving PIT what they wanted meant nixing the hub and slashing fares? They could only have slashed fares by losing the hub? That seems to be what I'm reading in other words. The airport needed more competition and they got it. They didn't ask nor deserve to be treated the way Usairways did. Everyone blames Allegheny county and Pittsburgh for this crap and how they treated Usairways. We as employees have seen the dealings of our past management. HOW HAVE THEY TREATED YOU??????? You think the county found them any better to deal with. I know that our govt in PA is bad but c'mon and be honest here. Just like having the county bid on a new site for the OCC. Yeah right this company has absolutely NOOOOOO intention of placing it there. Folks that are holding on to any hopes of the hub returning DO honestly need to forget it and move on. Though it hurts and is frustrating to see it is what it is. We survive and move on.

 

[ClueByFour]

By this logic, if CLT ever gets real LCC competition, US will dump it (I actually expect this to happen in the event that the merger takes place).

Same thing with CVG--these guys are like CCY--love those monopoly cities.

 

[zethya]

Yeah, that lack of a broad FF program sure stops the 7 or 8 PIT-PHL flights from kicking the teeth in of the legacy carrier with a hub and a focus city on either end. Same thing with the PIT-PHX and PIT-LAS routes. Where do you people come up with this stuff?

Only the Flyertalk crowd (and/or a time/price difference) is going to book a one stop where a nonstop is available. Even I don't do it anymore, but I can usually only get to CLT, ATL, EWR, DTW, and CVG "nonstop."

If WN brought in a morning PIT-LAX and an LAX-PIT leaving at any time but redeye time, it would be a winner. Run two each way, and they'd chase US off the route.

You're missing the point with a purely emotional response. First PIT-PHL is 261 miles - peanuts in FF miles. PIT-LAX on the other hand is almost 9x further - 1856 miles. PIT-LAS is primarily a low yield tourist route and not really relevant to my point. WN's PIT-PHX one flight per day is surely not proof that WN is "kicking anyone's teeth". <"If WN bought in a morning PIT-LAX flight...."> - really? You're speculating at best with that assumption. My speculation is that WN would not compete well for frequent business travelers with US - or any other Legacy on PIT-LAX, or any other long haul non-stop route.

 

[BoeingBoy]

You do realize that FF's get a minimum of 500 miles per segment? So much for 9X the PIT-PHL miles.

Also that WN has 37% of the PIT-PHX market and 39% of the PIT-LAS market in 2Q06 - up from 30%/36% the quarter before.

Jim

 

[ClueByFour]

You're missing the point with a purely emotional response.

No, you are missing the point in a completely irrational way.

First PIT-PHL is 261 miles - peanuts in FF miles. PIT-LAX on the other hand is almost 9x further - 1856 miles.

So what? Your assumption about how people make their traveling decisions is extremely inaccurate.

PIT-LAS is primarily a low yield tourist route and not really relevant to my point. WN's PIT-PHX one flight per day is surely not proof that WN is "kicking anyone's teeth".

Since they have added it, the carrier with a hub on one end and a focus city on the other dropped a frequency. So, either:

1. US can't compete on price. But even if that's not the case:

2. The FF miles, which you so strongly believe will draw traffic away from WN don't matter all that much.

Which is it?

<"If WN bought in a morning PIT-LAX flight...."> - really? You're speculating at best with that assumption. My speculation is that WN would not compete well for frequent business travelers with US - or any other Legacy on PIT-LAX, or any other long haul non-stop route.

Sure, makes you wonder how they make PHL-Coast, BWI-Coast routes work, right?

As for service, in coach it's a wash. Now that the legacies have dumbed their coach products down so much, there is no differentiation (except for UA with E+, and that does not apply here).

As for "speculation" on a morning flight, unless you really want to blow an evening in LA, what does the evening flight buy you? Not much. And before US cut PIT back when I was living there, the morning flights to the coast were much, much fuller than the evening flights, with Thursday being the sole exception.

Finally, your same assumption was made by many when WN entered both PHL and PIT--the "FF benefits" of US would hold them off. Care to comment about how well that worked?

 

[trvlr64]

WN's PIT-PHX one flight per day

And how does this differ from US's only 1 direct morning flight at 7:45am? Yes there's a another direct flight flight at 6:15pm.


Whoopee!?

It's almost apples to apples in this case. I wonder what the loads on the evening flight are? The only people using the evening flight are those going on vacation. Or that business person that wants to waste an entire day traveling before.

There was a time when US had their PIT to PHX flight and HP had their's running within 30 minutes of each other. Same for the LAS flights. Now there is only 1 morning flight. I flew on both, US & HP, and they were always filled. I bet if the "new US" would have spread out the direct flights in the morning they would still be filled.

 

[furloughednow psa]

I'm going to say this.... if the DL deal goes down, CVG is going to look a lot like PIT today.

I think Cvg will increase and pit will drop. Cvg is a much better choice and better located then pit. To much bad blood in pit. Its time to move on. That city and there stupid newspaper have nothing good ever to say about US.

 

[trvlr64]

I think Cvg will increase and pit will drop. Cvg is a much better choice and better located then pit. To much bad blood in pit. Its time to move on. That city and there stupid newspaper have nothing good ever to say about US.

Oh cry me a river. Whenever you are or "were" the largest employer you have to take your hits and your praise. Get over it already. BOO HOO HOO. The newspaper is running a nasty article about US.

Again......get over it already. <_< How often is there a negative article in the PHL paper? I'm sure there are more than you know.

 

[Itestwell]

Oh cry me a river. Whenever you are or "were" the largest employer you have to take your hits and your praise. Get over it already. BOO HOO HOO. The newspaper is running a nasty article about US.

Again......get over it already. <_< How often is there a negative article in the PHL paper? I'm sure there are more than you know.

Oh come on.... Can't we pleeeeease have one more thread about US screwing over the city and the airport in PIT? Please?

 

[trvlr64]

Oh come on.... Can't we pleeeeease have one more thread about US screwing over the city and the airport in PIT? Please?

Tell the people who throw the "stones". We've gotten over US and so should they.