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AWA + USAir = Total Mistake

After reading all of the posts under this thead I find it hard to believe that even with a combined contract, fixed seniority lists or whatever that we employees will EVER be able to be one group. This is pathetic, maybe even MORE pathetic than our management that has crushed this company.
We can look at Western/Delta, UA/Pan AM,Piedmont/US,PSA/US, etc. Polorizing? people before you meet them is good for the Jerry Springer Show. The employees of the U did not look very good to DAL. To blame AWA people for the short comings of management(in some cases on a very personal basis) does a disservice? to them as well as US. These are people you will some day have to deal with in a working relationship. Pipe dreams of UAL putting the U back in the bottom half of the majors is only a rumuor?. We have always been US,PIA and PSA. Some had better reputations than others. This is no different.
 
Two different philosophies. USAir: legacy airline, top awards, long term exceedingly well trained/knowledgeable and well paid employees. America West: regional airline, revolving employment door, no indepth training, management who is in way over their heads.


Yes I agree and two years of profit every twenty or so is just fine too!
 
First, it is not disrespectful to talk about airline accidents. Second, I said nothing about the credibility of the pilots. Third, the facts and circumstances of the accidents are irrelevant to the context of the discussion. Lastly, while it's noble for you to defend your fellow pilots unfortunate fate, I think your passion is misplaced since I was only responding to another posters claim that US Airways was "top notch" airline. I pointed out FACTS that say otherwise, nothing more nothing less.

By your logic we should never speak of anything horrifying even if it makes a point. I have heard it all from east people, been called just about everything, been accused of being all kinds of things, all because an arbitrator makes a decision, which I had no control over. You tell me who needs some help. And you have the nerved to tell me I should be ashamed of myself? Right back at yaw.

With that said, I was not trying to offend anyones honor (deceased or not), and if I did I appologize.
no, of course you were not. "deceased or not". yeah, i get it...
you may choose to review the ntsb reports surrounding the accidents you so gleefully invoke to defend a leadership you determine to be capable. in fact, said leadership is not. not even close.
would you be equally capitalizing on the "collateral" loss of your colleagues and customers if those that now sit in prison for blatantly violating the "bottle to throttle" law were not sitting in prison and the worst had happened? of course not! and thank God it did not!!
if there is overlap between windshear, rudder failure, etc. and flying intoxicated, please enlighten me...
the leadership you defend, the leadership you characterize as dealing swa a "black eye", was, admittedly, not too far from a bk filing...and the blackened eye prevailed to post consecutive profits... so, no. your argument collapses. there was no "black eye". not even a bruise.
here are the FACTS: usair was positioned, and recognized, as a worldclass carrier.
here are the post-america worst FACTS: usair is positioned to become a failure, a footprint in the history of american aviation, and solely because of inept leadership.
defend your incapable "leadership" all day like the submissive westie you are. and, while you are at it, keep trashing the memories of the innocent victims of aviation tragedy. that demonstrates a lot of class. as much class as flying intoxicated, actually.
you are as disgusting, disgraceful, and vile as the "leadership" you endorse.
 
You can bury your head in the sand and pretend it didn't happen, but me, I point to facts and the facts say US was not the "top notch" airline Mr. whomever claims it was. Anytime the east wants to stop throwing stones and provoking me, I'll reciprocate.

Note to self: Pick up large bag of stones from garden center on way home from work. Practice aim using mannequin head.
 
How about all the holes you put in the ground during the 90s, was that top notch?


WHOA THERE PORKCHOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If the Westies and Easties want to have another go of my side was better than your side fine, but don't you dare make a comment like that. NOT EVER! Until you actually have to climb into a wreckage and pull out a woman screaming for you to get her husband out, who concidently isn't in the sme part of the wreckage, or had to face pulling parts of bodies out of the North Atlantic that you thought might be survivors you won't know how wrong that comment was. Until you've had to have friends practically carry you out of work because you just spent the past 3 hours crying watching CNN you don't know how hurtful that comment was. Until you've been told that the search for survivors has been called off as it has been declared there were none you cannot know the insult that comment leveled. I won't even get into the liklihood that someone reading this thread lost friends or loved ones in one of those accidents. You sir are beyond compare, what I think of you right now isn't fit for posting. Luckily for you the things I, and many others here, already know you likely will never have to learn so I suggest you accept the wisdom of MY experience in this matter and delete your comments immediately. If you are an example of what West brought to this merger I can say quite honestly thank God I bailed 3 weeks ago.
 
Hey Cactus, do us a favor. Look up a pilot, she's probably a captain now, J. Purdy. I believe she was hired in 98 or 99. Ask her about Kate. They were friends. Take note of Ms. Purdy's emotions discussing Kate's death.

then you'll learn why we all take offense to your "careless" disregard for discussing the disasters.

cause sometimes those wounds NEVER go away, and everytime we think about it, it feels like it just happened, again.
 
I believe when the merger went down...USAir..ways had 90 days cash, AWA less than 30 days cash.

Do you really believe that East was going away, before West.

Dougweiser needs to be replaced. He is way over his head, and operationally we're a disaster.

Wake up .....BOD.
 
I lived the aircraft accidents, I lived the WTC and lost many relatives and friends. I lived through the baggage fiasco in Phl, apparently no one told the west the truth about that one.
You see CACTUS...right before the x-mas, many ramp agents put in for retirement. The company never replaced those rampers positions so there was ZERO coverage. Then, the main baggage belt broke at the ticket counter. On top of that the company put all the carribean bags in semis and sent them on their merry way to Pit. Too bad they forgot that there are ZERO flights out of Pit to the carribean! We spent x-mas through the new year clearing out thousands and thousands of unclaimed bags.
Cactus, you come to Phl for one week and I am sure you will high tail out in 2 days. Ask your piers that came during res migration. The management is a mess, we have to train them, can you believe that?

Come on, join the fun!

One flight departure in Phl is like working an 8 hour shift. It doesn't need to be that way like Phlagent states if the company allows us to do our jobs, which they don't and that is their big mistake.
 
Callsign_Cactus,

Normally, I regard your post as being simply childish. However this statement I find seriously offending. As those pilots whom lost their lives in these accidents were my pilots. I, in fact knew some of them personally. You should be ashamed of yourself for making such a statement. Especially in absense of the facts surrounding these tragic events.

To maintain the credibility of these airmen, as well as my company, lets take a look at some of the facts related to these "holes in the ground" you so callously advance:

Boeing 737 accident in LAX-controller cleared our flight to land on a runway in which there was a commuter aircraft in "position" without any aircraft lights illuminated. It was nighttime. And I would challenge anyone whom has ever landed in LA at night to see that aircraft. Pilots were killed, passengers and flight crew killed/badly burned. Hardly our fault. The NTSB agreed.

F-28 in LGA. Aircraft departed gate after being deiced. After a prolonged taxi, crew returned to the gate for another application of deicing fluid. On takeoff roll, super cooled slush from the runway was directed outboard from the aircrafts chime nosewheel. Said slush/water froze to the wings while being accelerated over the lift producing wings during T/O roll. Result, Captain killed, many passengers killed and injured. Fokker was found to be negligent in the crash and deicing procedures were changed industry wide as a result.

Flight 427, 737-400 over PIT. Crew was being vectored for approach at 6000', or 5000' AGL. The aircraft experienced a rudder hardover. The aircraft rolled over into an uncontrollable upset. Result, all crew and passengers were killed. Usairways became the first airline to develop rudder hardover training, and Boeing has since begun to change out it's faulty design industry wide. Since that time, there has been no further rudder events recorded.

Boeing 737 departed runway in LGA due to a rudder trim runaway. You may be too young to get your arms around this one. But the 737 used to have a rudder trim switch that could be activated, and stuck in the full trim position from pilots climbing over the pedestal (accidentally bumping the swith) while getting seated. I believe 4 people lost their lives in this one. Result, Boeing changed all the rudder trim switches industry wide.

And finally, DC-9 in CLT. Winshier. In terms of air traffic control, CLT is divided in half. A strong cell was located within the western half of the airport. The DC-9 inbound from the east was never advised buy either the atis, nor the controller that the cell was there. They were in fact, cleared for a visual approach. The DC-9s windshear detection system is deactivated during flap changes-the precise moment these guys needed it. They encountered what is the strongest micoburst on record. They fought that microburst admirably and bravely-saving a number of lives. Unfortunately, many lives were lost, and the B flight attendant sustained serious burns.

So that ends the lesson sonny boy. I for one think you owe us all an apology for your caulis remark. But more importantly, seek and get some help. Something isn't right with you.


sky high states: <STANDING OVATION>


only stating opinions
 
First, it is not disrespectful to talk about airline accidents. Second, I said nothing about the credibility of the pilots. Third, the facts and circumstances of the accidents are irrelevant to the context of the discussion.

sky high states: WE ALL KNOW WHY YOU USED THOSE ACCIDENTS IN THIS DISCUSSION. What a pathetic way to make a point. On the memory of those lost.


only stating opinions
 
Let's keep this on the topic of the merits/faults of the merger.

The post in question had been edited, and although it is an emotional topic, let's keep on subject.

Thank you.
 
You know, all I see here is bickering, fighting, namecalling, fingerpointing, etc. etc. etc. But NOBODY has any ideas or opinions which might be helpful in making the best of the situation and making it work. Until each side finally realizes they have to RESPECT the other, there is no hope.

Then again, perhaps that is the master plan-they sit back and watch the fighting and then sell pieces off-they make their money and go home at the end of the day, with total disregard for the employees and customers.

That said, someone mentioned further back the effective competition HP provided against WN. This is true-HP was a step up from WN, and offered a slightly better product, at slightly higher prices. Note the word SLIGHTLY. Since the merger, management has tried to implement the HP formula system wide, and they were too shortsighted to realize that it won't work in the east. In doing so they failed to properly manage the expectations of the east customers, and wasted time trying to compete with the wrong type of airline.

East and West are two completely different animals. For the West, the main competition was WN, and they did a good job competing. In the East, however, WN was never the prime target of competition, although they became A competitor when they came east, particularly in PHL. The problem was that Tempe kept trying to compare themselves to WN in the east, while the true focus should have been on competing with AA, DL , UA, CO, etc. So instead of one upping WN, we are three downing the others, yet in most cases, they charge more than the competition for what everyone agrees is an inferior product.

The first step in righting the ship is to find a way to get labor on the same page. They won't be able to make everyone happy, but you need to boost morale. Give the employees the tools they need (a reservation system which works would be a good first step). Provide adequate staffing levels, and get workrules and shift schedules which are more productive-then you can afford to increase wages--the productivity savings would negate the higher cost of the wage increases.

Once you have happy (or happier) employees with the right tools, then you can work on righting the rest of the ship. Happy employees are more likely to yield happy customers. NOW you can start adjusting schedules, fixing the underlying problems with the operation, and getting back on track.

Another big step will be to finally decide what they want to be-- A full service carrier, with a competitive fare structure and product, or a step up from an LCC, in which case the fares would have to come way down, and I could see eliminating F class altogether, PROVIDED they increase legroom. At least then US would have an identity-right now it is all over the place, and has taken the worst of both models to create the current hybrid.

The right tools to do the job have always been there -- an outstanding route network, some of the best employees in the business, and a loyal customer base. I truly believe that Tempe thinks the HP way is the only way, and they refuse to realize that they have made a mistake and need to try to start over. In that regard, either they are way over their heads, or their plan is to do just what they are doing--nothing - to make it better, so they can sell it off get their payday and go home.

I was US' biggest fan, and to a certain degree I still am. Based on the current state of the operation, however, I can not currently give US the lions share of my business because they cannot be counted on to get me where I need to be RELIABLY, and if/when they fail to do so, I have no confidence that I will be provided with adequate customer service to resolve the issues.

While I have technically moved on, I still plan on flying US when the schedule/pricing dictates, so there is still a chance I will see some of my good friends out there, but until or unless they can get their act together out in Tempe, I will never see a Chairmans Preferred card with my name on it again.

My best to you all.......
 
I believe when the merger went down...USAir..ways had 90 days cash, AWA less than 30 days cash.

Do you really believe that East was going away, before West.

Dougweiser needs to be replaced. He is way over his head, and operationally we're a disaster.

Wake up .....BOD.

No way AWA was about to go away. We were in the black! with hiring in full swing, planes being delivered. If we needed to, we had financing waiting. Alabama was finished with USAir there was no money left to give. And no one else was going to risk any more capital. You guys were done.
 
No way AWA was about to go away. We were in the black! with hiring in full swing, planes being delivered. If we needed to, we had financing waiting. Alabama was finished with USAir there was no money left to give. And no one else was going to risk any more capital. You guys were done.


Um, US paid Alabama to go away. Lakefield had TAG waiting in the wings. and US was making money operationally as well as paying off their debts. One of the biggest investors was so entangled they could not forego a quarter trillion in cash flow.

HP, on the other hand, by your own CEO statements, had 30 days to Zanzibar with no investment opportunities in sight.

But, go with your feelings because that is all you got.
 
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