Bring Back Rakesh
- Thread starter LavMan
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PITbull
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- Dec 29, 2002
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USflyer,
With all we've have just stated, why in hell would we want to join Dave's management team. We would have to go into their union busting classes of intimidation and get "brainwashed" on how to disrespect employees, demoralize them, and make them feel helpless.
Why would we want to join in this? And why would you, pray tell?
With all we've have just stated, why in hell would we want to join Dave's management team. We would have to go into their union busting classes of intimidation and get "brainwashed" on how to disrespect employees, demoralize them, and make them feel helpless.
Why would we want to join in this? And why would you, pray tell?
So what are you doing to improve things then? Please tell me it's more than just chatting on here.PITbull said:
Also, let's get some facts straight: Not everyone in CCY is management. There are lots of good, hard working folks there that are subject to the same pressures you are.
PITbull
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USFlyer,
No disrespect to you. I know of few managers at CCY I respect and just one employee in the legal department. The rest unfortunately, that I have encountered that were old mangement have been "brain washed". Its disqusting to have witnessed this process with folks you once respected. Dave and his team have infected most up there. Or , it could be they are too concerned about their postions to speak out and take a stand. As you know, they are not represented by unions and therefore subject to reprisals.
I have written out on these boards numberous times on what I would do to help the airline on the revenue side and improve the "quaility" of customer service, which I believe is more important than the fare price.
The post "negative Air" has 16 points I bring. Markmywords and I have debated this on numerous occasions, and we had a "meeting of the minds" on many of the points. It would be just a reiteration to do this all over again.
No disrespect to you. I know of few managers at CCY I respect and just one employee in the legal department. The rest unfortunately, that I have encountered that were old mangement have been "brain washed". Its disqusting to have witnessed this process with folks you once respected. Dave and his team have infected most up there. Or , it could be they are too concerned about their postions to speak out and take a stand. As you know, they are not represented by unions and therefore subject to reprisals.
I have written out on these boards numberous times on what I would do to help the airline on the revenue side and improve the "quaility" of customer service, which I believe is more important than the fare price.
The post "negative Air" has 16 points I bring. Markmywords and I have debated this on numerous occasions, and we had a "meeting of the minds" on many of the points. It would be just a reiteration to do this all over again.
Finish or Ignore
Senior
- Aug 30, 2002
- 342
- 1
Replace the word "Dave" in the above post with Wolf/Gangwal and it fits like a glove. Earlier in this thread Gangwal was defended as someone that was just taking advantage of their contract. I bet Dave is doing that too. You have posted some credible posts in the past. That credibility is going away fast when you defend Steve Wolf and Rakesh Gangwal just to bash Dave.PITbull said:
U
UAL_TECH
Guest
PineyBob said:
Excellent point Bob!!!
The Dutta/Gangwall/Wolfe team are still in the wings.
Take Care,
UAL_TECH
PITbull
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- Dec 29, 2002
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Agent,
When it comes to Dave and team, it doesn't matter what we had or didn't, and who was here before. I will make no excuses for the effort to merge United and U by Wolf. At the time MOST OF US THOUGHT THIS WAS GOOD CAUSE MOST OF US HAD STOCK THROUGH OUR 401K PLANS. Not only that, but USAirways made lots of profits during Gangwal tenure at U. Gangwal has stated he would have never have done these things to the mployees or put them through these kinds of things for any type of business plan. He said that.
I never knew Wolf and never spoke to him. Don't know what was in his head. But, I have a respect for Gangwal. Why? Because he had 6 years to attempt to demoralize the work force into submission to feed corporate greed, and HE DID NOT.
There is NO EXCUSE for this management team. They have this company costs down so very low, and they still can't make money? They have destroyed any possible trust with this mangement because they just can't be consistant and honor any of our agreements in any way. NO BUSINESS OPERATES THIS WAY AND SUCCEEDS WITH LABOR UNREST for the long term. Their arrogance in thinking they have accomplished the greatest restructuring in airline history (their words) will be their demise.
I have spent months on these boards making statments I live, eat, sleep, and drink. When I speak about Gangwal, THESE ARE NOT "FLIPPED" REMARKS.
I speak from what I know to be true. Management knows it; that's why they despise my very existence on these boards and up close and personal.
PS: Bob,
There is something you obviously, and desperately don't have a clue on. I will enlgihten you now....
Gangwal never made a dime on the USAirways stock. He never cashed any in. HIS WORDS; NOT MINE. He told us this past March. He only took his lump sum retirement, through all these years. And you know if he did, it would have been reported through the SEC filings. Check it out.
When it comes to Dave and team, it doesn't matter what we had or didn't, and who was here before. I will make no excuses for the effort to merge United and U by Wolf. At the time MOST OF US THOUGHT THIS WAS GOOD CAUSE MOST OF US HAD STOCK THROUGH OUR 401K PLANS. Not only that, but USAirways made lots of profits during Gangwal tenure at U. Gangwal has stated he would have never have done these things to the mployees or put them through these kinds of things for any type of business plan. He said that.
I never knew Wolf and never spoke to him. Don't know what was in his head. But, I have a respect for Gangwal. Why? Because he had 6 years to attempt to demoralize the work force into submission to feed corporate greed, and HE DID NOT.
There is NO EXCUSE for this management team. They have this company costs down so very low, and they still can't make money? They have destroyed any possible trust with this mangement because they just can't be consistant and honor any of our agreements in any way. NO BUSINESS OPERATES THIS WAY AND SUCCEEDS WITH LABOR UNREST for the long term. Their arrogance in thinking they have accomplished the greatest restructuring in airline history (their words) will be their demise.
I have spent months on these boards making statments I live, eat, sleep, and drink. When I speak about Gangwal, THESE ARE NOT "FLIPPED" REMARKS.
I speak from what I know to be true. Management knows it; that's why they despise my very existence on these boards and up close and personal.
PS: Bob,
There is something you obviously, and desperately don't have a clue on. I will enlgihten you now....
Gangwal never made a dime on the USAirways stock. He never cashed any in. HIS WORDS; NOT MINE. He told us this past March. He only took his lump sum retirement, through all these years. And you know if he did, it would have been reported through the SEC filings. Check it out.
PITbull
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- Dec 29, 2002
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Bob,
Gangwal even said that to us. He said that just call him "dum", but he didn't cash it in at any point. He didn't speak about Wolf, just himself.
Dave will never stop the blood bath. It will stop when there is NO airline left or this managment is gone; which ever happens first. I believe, though, if this management does leave, they will "suck" every penny and blood from this company, and blame the unions on their way out.
Dave will never play nice nice....he is to arrogant and does not have the capacity. Especially when his focus is on the airline profiting for his OWN gain. We as employees are collateral damage and expendable in the eyes of this management. They keep you poor enough and hungry enough to stay.
I will state this now...sometimes examples have to be set to show corporate American THAT IT IS NOT OK TO DEMORALIZE YOUR EMPLOYEES TO THE POINT OF HOPLESSNESS AND NO SELF WORTH, and think you will still succeed with creating havoc in the work place. ALL FOR THE SAKE OF THE DOLLAR AND PERSONAL GAIN FOR THE "ELITISTS" in the company... any company. There will be many that will blame the unions if USAirways goes down WHILE their is Major labor unrest. But, unless management snaps out of it, or leaves....the company will eventually cease to exist if it continues down this same path.
BUT I KNOW BETTER. And I will make sure that I spend my life telling the REAL story of how this played out, because I lived it, AND I HAVE THE DOCUMENTATION TO BACK IT UP.
With regard to Gangwal cashing in OR cashing stock out....you blame him either way. Of the few CEOs who do go on and get other Executive jobs in corporate america, HE moved on quite quickly and is THE PRESIDENT OF WORLD SPAN.
Gangwal even said that to us. He said that just call him "dum", but he didn't cash it in at any point. He didn't speak about Wolf, just himself.
Dave will never stop the blood bath. It will stop when there is NO airline left or this managment is gone; which ever happens first. I believe, though, if this management does leave, they will "suck" every penny and blood from this company, and blame the unions on their way out.
Dave will never play nice nice....he is to arrogant and does not have the capacity. Especially when his focus is on the airline profiting for his OWN gain. We as employees are collateral damage and expendable in the eyes of this management. They keep you poor enough and hungry enough to stay.
I will state this now...sometimes examples have to be set to show corporate American THAT IT IS NOT OK TO DEMORALIZE YOUR EMPLOYEES TO THE POINT OF HOPLESSNESS AND NO SELF WORTH, and think you will still succeed with creating havoc in the work place. ALL FOR THE SAKE OF THE DOLLAR AND PERSONAL GAIN FOR THE "ELITISTS" in the company... any company. There will be many that will blame the unions if USAirways goes down WHILE their is Major labor unrest. But, unless management snaps out of it, or leaves....the company will eventually cease to exist if it continues down this same path.
BUT I KNOW BETTER. And I will make sure that I spend my life telling the REAL story of how this played out, because I lived it, AND I HAVE THE DOCUMENTATION TO BACK IT UP.
With regard to Gangwal cashing in OR cashing stock out....you blame him either way. Of the few CEOs who do go on and get other Executive jobs in corporate america, HE moved on quite quickly and is THE PRESIDENT OF WORLD SPAN.
PITbull
Veteran
- Dec 29, 2002
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Bob,
Only thing I understand is that in Corporate America today, most companys understand the synergistic fragile balance that is needed to succeed today in their respective competitive market. In order for a company to achieve success, and sustain that level of achievment, all must work as a team to provide a competitive product and quality customer service. No matter what business your in. In order to do that THERE CAN NOT BE LABOR UNREST. You can not achieve any long term corporate goals if there is fighting between your employees and mangement collectively. High anxiety among the workers filled with continued uncertainty and fear of job loss by either furlough, termination, or sickness. The focus here is all wrong.
Wolf did not bloat the cost structure, UNITED AIRLINES MANAGEMENT DID. Most contracts on the property had "parity plus 1% when it came to wage triggers. AFA did not. But none the less, this concept which was a MANAGEMENT CONCEPT AND NEGOTIATION, back fired. But who took the major hits for these poor management decisions WAS LABOR.
I am not in agreement with you that Dave will have any eye on growing revenue and profit with the same zeal when all his cost structure vision is completed. This company will make a profit as a consequence of NOT giving the employees livable wages they can survive on, very little benefits along with raking from the customer and providing very little quality customer service.
You watch how this pans out. If the airline continues down this path, this great franchise will cease to exist. And that will be a result of "lack of vision for the long term" success of the company, by this management. We as employees are operating this airline without any real leadership and inspite of this mangement. We have asked them repeatedly to "roll up their sleeves" and join us any day now.
if this airline does not succeed, the Corporate community will view this in many ways and will look to blame employees...but we as labor and those that were close to these labor groups know the truth. AND IT WILL BE TOLD.
If Mechanics don't stand up now against this mangement with the out sourcing of their work, inspite of clear contract language, THEN ALL WILL FAIL IN UNION LABOR IN AMERICA TODAY. You have to have faith that it is the right thing to do from these corporate raiders, even if it costs you your job....ALL OF OUR JOBS.
Examples must be set to show corporate america that you can't get away scot free when you continue to demoralize and disrespect, and devalue your employees. If things don't change, specifically with this outsourcing of work idea with management. The airline is done. There will be no stakeholders, no return on investment. And trust that management will have lost more than we. We are losing are jobs daily, in one form or another, and one way or another. We are perishing slowly anyway.
.
Only thing I understand is that in Corporate America today, most companys understand the synergistic fragile balance that is needed to succeed today in their respective competitive market. In order for a company to achieve success, and sustain that level of achievment, all must work as a team to provide a competitive product and quality customer service. No matter what business your in. In order to do that THERE CAN NOT BE LABOR UNREST. You can not achieve any long term corporate goals if there is fighting between your employees and mangement collectively. High anxiety among the workers filled with continued uncertainty and fear of job loss by either furlough, termination, or sickness. The focus here is all wrong.
Wolf did not bloat the cost structure, UNITED AIRLINES MANAGEMENT DID. Most contracts on the property had "parity plus 1% when it came to wage triggers. AFA did not. But none the less, this concept which was a MANAGEMENT CONCEPT AND NEGOTIATION, back fired. But who took the major hits for these poor management decisions WAS LABOR.
I am not in agreement with you that Dave will have any eye on growing revenue and profit with the same zeal when all his cost structure vision is completed. This company will make a profit as a consequence of NOT giving the employees livable wages they can survive on, very little benefits along with raking from the customer and providing very little quality customer service.
You watch how this pans out. If the airline continues down this path, this great franchise will cease to exist. And that will be a result of "lack of vision for the long term" success of the company, by this management. We as employees are operating this airline without any real leadership and inspite of this mangement. We have asked them repeatedly to "roll up their sleeves" and join us any day now.
if this airline does not succeed, the Corporate community will view this in many ways and will look to blame employees...but we as labor and those that were close to these labor groups know the truth. AND IT WILL BE TOLD.
If Mechanics don't stand up now against this mangement with the out sourcing of their work, inspite of clear contract language, THEN ALL WILL FAIL IN UNION LABOR IN AMERICA TODAY. You have to have faith that it is the right thing to do from these corporate raiders, even if it costs you your job....ALL OF OUR JOBS.
Examples must be set to show corporate america that you can't get away scot free when you continue to demoralize and disrespect, and devalue your employees. If things don't change, specifically with this outsourcing of work idea with management. The airline is done. There will be no stakeholders, no return on investment. And trust that management will have lost more than we. We are losing are jobs daily, in one form or another, and one way or another. We are perishing slowly anyway.
.
I'm absolutely floored people here are saying they want Wolf/Gangwal back. I wish I could call up the message threads from 2000 and 2001. The hatred expressed at the two of them was unbelievable. And now people are saying they want them back. Also unbelievable.
PITbull
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- Dec 29, 2002
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USflyer,
Get a grip...no one said anywhere on this thread that Wolf needs to come back. No one, no where.
Gangwal won't come back as he has resigned from the company. However, there is talk that he may sit on the AFA Board seat. That is the speculation. AND MANGEMENT HATES HATES HATES THIS. Trust me. I have been PM regarding this issue like there is no tomorrow from this management...short of death threats.
Get a grip...no one said anywhere on this thread that Wolf needs to come back. No one, no where.
Gangwal won't come back as he has resigned from the company. However, there is talk that he may sit on the AFA Board seat. That is the speculation. AND MANGEMENT HATES HATES HATES THIS. Trust me. I have been PM regarding this issue like there is no tomorrow from this management...short of death threats.
