BYE BYE ALPO

[ableoneable]

I don't think you understand.....23 years under the ALPA umbrella....first having UAL go back to work without me..and and having the Supreme Court of the US rule in my favor that ALPA screwed me out of 500 numbers. Then to work for a pilot group that simply accepted B scale, and then took a 150K raise for 330 pilots at the expense of junior 737 Capts.
I am so hardover that no AWA pilot will ever ride my jumpseat or fly my aircraft. Fact. I am done with this union, and any airline associated with it.

I appreciate your past view of my dedication.....from now on my intent and direction is only toward my own family and future, that is all I have left at 51 years old. And woe be it to any AWA pilot encounters me.
Greeter.

The first time an AWA pilot calls CS and tells them that he/she will miss check in because the East pilot does not allow west jump seaters you will find youself on the beach for an unpaid vacation. You can bank on it.

 

[b737fo]

I don't think you understand.....23 years under the ALPA umbrella....first having UAL go back to work without me..and and having the Supreme Court of the US rule in my favor that ALPA screwed me out of 500 numbers. Then to work for a pilot group that simply accepted B scale, and then took a 150K raise for 330 pilots at the expense of junior 737 Capts.
I am so hardover that no AWA pilot will ever ride my jumpseat or fly my aircraft. Fact. I am done with this union, and any airline associated with it.

I appreciate your past view of my dedication.....from now on my intent and direction is only toward my own family and future, that is all I have left at 51 years old. And woe be it to any AWA pilot encounters me.
Greeter.

Love the last sentence. A little ambiguous though. Would you like to expand on that and maybe make yourself a little more clear so the Westies know what to expect when they encounter you?

 

[Walmartgreeter]

Love the last sentence. A little ambiguous though. Would you like to expand on that and maybe make yourself a little more clear so the Westies know what to expect when they encounter you?


They won't "encounter" me. I simply do not have the ability to be in a confined space for any length of time with any of them. It is my job to maintain a cockpit environment free of stress and distractions.

Two "laughing" Westiies pointing at my cockpit over the last week pretty much did me in.

Clear enough?

Greeter.

The first time an AWA pilot calls CS and tells them that he/she will miss check in because the East pilot does not allow west jump seaters you will find youself on the beach for an unpaid vacation. You can bank on it.

No. That will not happen. Because here on the East the C/Os decision still stands. If my policy was random or addressed at a certain individual, maybe.

If the time comes, there simply will be no West guy touching my controls or in my space.

You can "bank on it."

Greeter.

 

[nycbusdriver]

I agree with Greeter that there will be no company consequences for an east captain who refuses a jumpseat ride to anyone. The policy gives wide discretion for captains to deny jumpseat requests and given the animosity that we now suffer, it might actually be a good idea for particular east captains to NOT have west pilots on their jumpseat for safety reasons. Heated discussions can be extremely distracting and are difficult to avoid given present circumstances.

Personally, though, I feel it is counterproductive to both sides to use the jumpseat as a weapon. It behooves us all to treat other pilots with professional courtesy and keep union politics out of the cockpit, no matter what the circumstances. Denying a jumpseat to a west pilot will not help the east cause one iota, and it will likely result in a tit-for-tat denial of a jumpseat to an east pilot trying to get to work or home on a west jumpseat.

 

[EastUS]

Personally, though, I feel it is counterproductive to both sides to use the jumpseat as a weapon. It behooves us all to treat other pilots with professional courtesy and keep union politics out of the cockpit, no matter what the circumstances.

Fully agreed with on my part. The cockpit's no place for brawling of any sort.

I've no thoughts of refusing jumpseat to any AWA pilots.

Having said that; I also understand either east or west crews not wishing to establish any uncomfortable distractions within the flight deck...but c'mon kids...we can put up with checkrides/Feds/etc.........

 

[exB717Flyer]

Good on you, EastUS!

It still shocks and saddens me that some professional pilots use the jumpseat as an instrument of their misplaced anger. All it takes is a handful of malcontents on both sides and a fullscale jumpseat war ensues. The only result is a lot commuters on both sides can't get to work or go home. Nothing is solved and no healing takes place. What a shame.

 

[A320 Driver]

Good on you, EastUS!

It still shocks and saddens me that some professional pilots use the jumpseat as an instrument of their misplaced anger. All it takes is a handful of malcontents on both sides and a fullscale jumpseat war ensues. The only result is a lot commuters on both sides can't get to work or go home. Nothing is solved and no healing takes place. What a shame.

Agreed.

We keep digging a hole, pretty soon it's too deep to climb out of. We do not need a war over jumpseats. If you are that disturbed by current events, maybe you should consider a sick call. Otherwise, we need to keep our heads screwed on straight.

Leave the politics to the politicians.

A320 Driver B)

 

[ableoneable]

I agree with Greeter that there will be no company consequences for an east captain who refuses a jumpseat ride to anyone. The policy gives wide discretion for captains to deny jumpseat requests and given the animosity that we now suffer, it might actually be a good idea for particular east captains to NOT have west pilots on their jumpseat for safety reasons. Heated discussions can be extremely distracting and are difficult to avoid given present circumstances.

I stand by my theory. The first time a flight is delayed or cancelled because of a stuck commuter Wallmart greeter will be in Bular's office.

With respect to his "no west guy will touch the controlls...blah blah blah." I am sure that none of our FOs will put up with this crap. They will simply pack up their gear and leave the airplane. After a couple of delays Greeter will get to experience anger management classes or disciplinary action. No-one should put up his kind of amateur hour crap.

 

[EastUS]

I stand by my theory. The first time a flight is delayed or cancelled because of a stuck commuter Wallmart greeter will be in Bular's office.

With respect to his "no west guy will touch the controlls...blah blah blah." I am sure that none of our FOs will put up with this crap. They will simply pack up their gear and leave the airplane. After a couple of delays Greeter will get to experience anger management classes or disciplinary action. No-one should put up his kind of amateur hour crap.

Sigh....you just couldn't let even a moment's seemingly Reasonable positioning keep you from another "AWA's-in-your-east-face/Nyaah-Nyaah!" posting...could you? I won't alter anything I've said, nor my position on professionalism in the cockpit...but Geezus...kindly drop the attitude if you're traveling as "our" guest at any time. Courtesy's the ticket here...not some blustering BS about being sent to the Principal's Office in some hypothetical, and contrived scenario :down: ...grow up.

 

[ussnark]

I stand by my theory. The first time a flight is delayed or cancelled because of a stuck commuter Wallmart greeter will be in Bular's office.

Isn't that the guy some rent-a-lawyer ordered to drive an electric cart up and down the concouri in CLT, looking for pilots not wearing hats? Outcome of that was, nobody has to wear a hat.

Yeah, just quakin' in our boots, I tell ya.

With respect to his "no west guy will touch the controlls...blah blah blah." I am sure that none of our FOs will put up with this crap. They will simply pack up their gear and leave the airplane. After a couple of delays Greeter will get to experience anger management classes or disciplinary action. No-one should put up his kind of amateur hour crap.

Yeah, that'll float. Why don't you quit trying to inflame things with your fantasies, and stay where you are. Your kindergarden attitude isn't going to get you very far on the east coast, that is for sure.

 

[ableoneable]

Isn't that the guy some rent-a-lawyer ordered to drive an electric cart up and down the concouri in CLT, looking for pilots not wearing hats? Outcome of that was, nobody has to wear a hat.

Yeah, just quakin' in our boots, I tell ya.
Yeah, that'll float. Why don't you quit trying to inflame things with your fantasies, and stay where you are. Your kindergarden attitude isn't going to get you very far on the east coast, that is for sure.

Kindergarden attitude?

I am not the one saying woe onto the westie who encounters me. I never advocated any childish jumpseat behavior. The person who asks for a ride is almost universally polite. 99% of the jumpseating population will go out of their way not to say anything disagreeable. We have all seen jumpseaters who are masters of the non response when the captain opens with his theory about whatever vast conspiricy he thinks is controlling the country etc.

I am not trying to inflame anything. Based on what I have been seeing, with respect to section 19 hearings, a vindictive jumpseat policy will not fly. In addition, any captain who opens his briefing with, "I am not going to let you touch anything because you guys stole my future..." is going to find himself on the beach, where he belongs.

 

[EastUS]

Kindergarden attitude?
I am not trying to inflame anything. In addition, any captain who .......... is going to find himself on the beach, where he belongs.

"I am not trying to inflame anything." = Best joke that I've recently seen on this forum.......At least it's just BS on a chat thread.

My two cents worth of chat thread BS on this remains as: Flight decks simply aren't any proper place to establish any duelling fields. Plus?...It'd be nearly impossible to hide the body anyway.

 

[2BorNot2B]

I am all for that. I think all ALPA members, from day one and in perpetuity, should have access and full voting priveledges as long as they remain in good standing.

The access is truly the issue. After 28 dues paying loyal supportive years, to be denied access to the web site is an insult. I truly am interested in what is going on, not only at U but within the industry. What better source than ones own Union. I truly enjoyed the message boards. I was told that it was a certain number of undesireable Posters that brought about the decision to deny access. Hey .... just deny non-dues paying members ( be they Active, Retired or Furloughed) posting priviledges. Simple .... that works for all the other Forums on the Web .. you can view but not post! I would like to keep track of things ... such as the Seniority List, to see what is happening with the guys and Gals I flew with .... stuff like that! Why deny that??? I am not an "outsider" ..... I never considered ALPA to be a "pay by the month Membership Club".

As for Voting Priveledges, that is reserved for Dues Paying Active Members, as it should be!

Does anyone know if any other ALPA Carriers "Block" their Retirees??

2B

 

[ussnark]

Kindergarden attitude?

I am not the one saying woe onto the westie who encounters me.

True. But you did say "woe unto the eastie who encounters (refuses my jumpseat) to me"

I never advocated any childish jumpseat behavior.

But you just did. You said that if you get refused a jumpseat and miss your schedule, that pilot will see Mr. Bular. Seems pretty childish to me that you assume you will always get the jumpseat.

I am not trying to inflame anything. Based on what I have been seeing, with respect to section 19 hearings, a vindictive jumpseat policy will not fly. In addition, any captain who opens his briefing with, "I am not going to let you touch anything because you guys stole my future..." is going to find himself on the beach, where he belongs.

Section 19, is that drug and alcohol rehab for the west folks? Mental health? Come on, give us a break here.

The US captains will never give you a reason why. Believe me, you will make enough mistakes just talking on the radio.

 

[ableoneable]

True. But you did say "woe unto the eastie who encounters (refuses my jumpseat) to me"
But you just did. You said that if you get refused a jumpseat and miss your schedule, that pilot will see Mr. Bular. Seems pretty childish to me that you assume you will always get the jumpseat.

No, I was speaking in general. I am not a commuter and rarely need to jumpseat. When flights have been late or worse canceled, due to crew issues, mnagement has been much more agressive than they used to be. I simply stated what I think will happen. When a pilot calls crew sched and says "Hey I am a commuter, I gave myself two online flights but the operating capt.refused me the jump because Iam a west guy." management is going to talk to the operating captain. It's probably only going to happen once per individual.
[/quote]

Section 19, is that drug and alcohol rehab for the west folks? Mental health? Come on, give us a break here.
[/quote]

Section 19 is the Investigation and Discipline section of the CBA. When the company decides to discipline or terminate a pilot they follow section 19 of the ALPA CBA.
(I am pretty sure that it is the same section in your CBA as well.)

[/quote]

The US captains will never give you a reason why. Believe me, you will make enough mistakes just talking on the radio.
[/quote]

Ah, another ad hominem personal attack. I am a westie so I must not know how to fly. Very droll. I take it you support this junior high bullshit. "The arbitration did not go my way so I am not going to let you fly... So there!" You are a clown.