Bye Bye American Pie

[delldude]

Russia and China’s New World Order: Chinese President Calls for Global Governance With Increasing Power for China and Russia Over Global Economic System

Progressives mortgage your ### and this what comes down the pike.

 

[xUT]

Chinese officials stole $120 billion, fled mainly to US

Thousands of corrupt Chinese government officials have stolen more than $120bn (£74bn) and fled overseas, mainly to the US, according to a report released by China's central bank.

Khodorkovsky Says Corruption Means Russia Needs $200 Oil

Khodorkovsky, Russia’s richest man when he was arrested on the tarmac of a Siberian airport in October 2003, says he’s been persecuted by Prime Minister Vladimir Putin because he financed opposition parties. The former chief executive officer of Yukos Oil Co. was convicted of fraud and tax evasion in 2005 and oil embezzlement in December 2010, pushing his sentence to 13 years.

He responded to questions from Bloomberg News while being held at a detention center in Moscow. The answers were delivered June 10, the day he was sent to an undisclosed penal colony.

As we are all getting raped by our gooberments... 😱 😱 😱

 

[Ms Tree]

Liberals bad conservatives good. Conservatives had absolutely nothing to do with the situation we are in now. :blink:

 

[SparrowHawk]

Liberals bad conservatives good. Conservatives had absolutely nothing to do with the situation we are in now. :blink:

Honestly NO! Here's why. We haven't had a Conservative President since Reagan who left a robust economy in the hands of Bush I some 20 years ago. The proof is the growth of the Federal Government

 

[Ms Tree]

You are aware he nearly doubled the debt, raised taxes 11 times (I think), wasted billions on defense spending, and if I recall correctly granted amnesty to a few million illegal aliens, helped train the future Al-Queda aka Mujahedeen. He sold arms to the terrorists in Iran with drug money from Nicaragua. I seem to recall something about one of the largest tax increases in history when he was governor of CA. How many of his people were convicted and/or pardoned for criminal activity?

Other than this stuff, he rocked a the best 'conservative' resident ever.

 

[SparrowHawk]

You are aware he nearly doubled the debt, raised taxes 11 times (I think), wasted billions on defense spending, and if I recall correctly granted amnesty to a few million illegal aliens, helped train the future Al-Queda aka Mujahedeen. He sold arms to the terrorists in Iran with drug money from Nicaragua. I seem to recall something about one of the largest tax increases in history when he was governor of CA. How many of his people were convicted and/or pardoned for criminal activity?

Other than this stuff, he rocked a the best 'conservative' resident ever.

History has judged him far differently. As for doubling the debt IIRC it took him 8 years to do less than the Empty Suit has done in 28 months.


Debt at the end of Reagan Years = $2,602,337,712,041.16
Debt at the beginning of Reagan = $ 907,701,000,000.00

Total Debt incurred under Reagan = $1.69 Trillion divided by 8 years or 210 billion per year on average.

Compared to the record of the Empty Suit.

This from the Communist News Network (CNN)

Obama Added More to National Debt in First 19 Months Than All Presidents from Washington Through Reagan Combined, Says Gov’t Data
In the first 19 months of the Obama administration, the federal debt held by the public increased by $2.5260 trillion, which is more than the cumulative total of the national debt held by the public that was amassed by all U.S. presidents from George Washington through Ronald Reagan.
Wednesday, September 08, 2010

The Total US Debt To GDP Ratio Is Now Worse Than In The Great Depression
By Michael Snyder on July 21, 2010
Did you think that we could just continue to run deficits equal to 10 percent of GDP forever?

Of course not.

The U.S. economy is being driven off a cliff, but America’s ”ruling class” has insisted all along that they know better than we do.

But the truth is that in the final analysis it is not us that they care about

If you note from the dates of the articles that the Empty Suits stellar record was accomplished in about 19 months with no current end in sight. Obama makes Reagan look like Ebenezer Scrooge.

An even more startling revelation is that when Regan took office the Debt to GDP ratio was around or just below 50% and due to a rising growing economy that ratio didn't increase at as robust a rate as it would have had we had the economy of today which was similar to what Reagan walked into. Now under the Empty Suit the Debt to GDP ration is around 94%. Most economists concur that 90% is the "Tipping Point" and the lower the ratio the better it is for the long term growth and stability of the currency.

 

[Ms Tree]

So had Obama taken his time in increasing the debt that would have been OK with you? And I guess by omission the tax increases and the illegal activities for which several members of his team were convicted over is OK with you. Do actually ever read what you write or is your hatred for Obama blinding you to your hypocrisy?

Of course the numbers are bigger but 50% is still 50% whether it be from $3 trillion to $6 trillion or $7 to $14. Neither is good. Then again, Reagan did not have 2 wars sucking trillions out of his budget, he was just wasting tax money on defense and other wasteful projects.

I guess we need to raise taxes like Regan did and cut spending like Regan did not to get back to that robust economy. I'm glad we finally agree.

 

[delldude]

Ahh, if you look, I think the progressives do out spend the con's a little bit....

So at the vast chasm we now straddle, what we gonna do?

Chinese own our collective butts......Obama/Pelosi really put the hammer down there.

 

[Ms Tree]

My idea has always been to reduce spending across the board by 5%-10%. Close the corporate tax loop holes and reduce the corporate tax rate (not like they are paying much now). Close all the private tax loop holes so that Warren Buffet pays more tax than his secretary. Increase/decrease the over all tax rate by about 5%-10% as well. The increase/decrease will depend on what the results of closing all the tax loop holes. Do this ever 2 or 3 years till the deficit starts to decrease and the economy starts to recover. Then maintain until a surplus is achieved at which time taxes can be reduced. Any public spending increase their after would have to result in a tax increase to cover the cost.

 

[dapoes]

My idea has always been to reduce spending across the board by 5%-10%. Close the corporate tax loop holes and reduce the corporate tax rate (not like they are paying much now). Close all the private tax loop holes so that Warren Buffet pays more tax than his secretary. Increase/decrease the over all tax rate by about 5%-10% as well. The increase/decrease will depend on what the results of closing all the tax loop holes. Do this ever 2 or 3 years till the deficit starts to decrease and the economy starts to recover. Then maintain until a surplus is achieved at which time taxes can be reduced. Any public spending increase their after would have to result in a tax increase to cover the cost.

Typical liberal mentality. It's not a revenue ie tax problem. It's a spending problem.

 

[delldude]

My idea has always been to reduce spending across the board by 5%-10%. Close the corporate tax loop holes and reduce the corporate tax rate (not like they are paying much now). Close all the private tax loop holes so that Warren Buffet pays more tax than his secretary. Increase/decrease the over all tax rate by about 5%-10% as well. The increase/decrease will depend on what the results of closing all the tax loop holes. Do this ever 2 or 3 years till the deficit starts to decrease and the economy starts to recover. Then maintain until a surplus is achieved at which time taxes can be reduced. Any public spending increase their after would have to result in a tax increase to cover the cost.

Ten percent now is quite a huge number.........

US corporate tax rate is number two in the world just behind Japan.

I don't know why one couldn't eliminate income tax which only working people pretty much pay, like 51%....and institute a national sales tax that your welfare and under the table incomes would pay and make it more or less equal. Now all you have is special interests no matter who is in.

 

[SparrowHawk]

Typical liberal mentality. It's not a revenue ie tax problem. It's a spending problem.

One could ad it's also a Growth Problem. Go back to Reagan, where his tax cut plan stimulated the economy and as a result led to an average growth rate of just under 5%. This resulted in nearly 800 billion more in Revenue at lower tax rates.

Our Recovery should be focused on:

Spending cuts
Balanced Budget
Pro Growth Strategies such as oil and gas exploration
Shutting down large portions of our massive overseas empire
Lowest Corporate tax rate once loopholes are closed.
Less government intervention into the day to day lives of average citizens

Long term Goals should be:

Elimination of the Federal Income tax.
Plan to pay off the debt over 20 years
Reduction of our worldwide Empire

Bottom line is the Federal Government needs to become the driver of economic growth through the private sector. Think of the economy as a giant football field where people, companies, concepts & ideas come to compete. The Federal should be know more than the Head Groundskeeper whose sole responsibility is to make sure the field is in playing shape.

 

[tech2101]

My idea has always been to reduce spending across the board by 5%-10%.

Bad idea. Cut spending where it needs to be cut. Across the board cuts damage the effective programs and do little to stop the ineffective ones.

Did you see the Gates interview this AM on the morning shows?

He said the same thing.

 

[Ms Tree]

Reagan raised taxes, he did not cut them.

The 10% was just a random number for argument sake. It can be adjusted depending on the situation.

I agree that cutting everything is not optimal but given today political landscape no one will want to pick and choose. They all have their pet projects. If you do an across tbe board cut then no one has to be the bad guy.

I believe the cuts and tax increases have to be gradual as to not rock the boat but to get tbe ball rolling. Cutting spending with out increasing taxes or vice versa is not going to work. We are way to far down the rabbit hole.

 

[Ms Tree]

The sales tax sounds good on the surface but I remember reading a few articles that made a strong argument that it would affect the poor much more adversely than the current system.

Ill see if I can dig them up later.