Censorship of Information by Burchette

[Raptor]

There is no advantage for any group to negotiate at headquarters. Ask any labor professor if this situation is in the best interest of our members. Since I was there in 2003, I have planty of examples why we should not negotiate in DFW.

I agree chuck but my question is are the other groups Negotiating at DFW as well, they too are scattered all over the system, if they are Negotiating at DFW then the chances are the TWU will do it as well, maybe the company has said everyone will Negotiate here or you can just keep the contract you currently have and there will not be any Negotiating, its your choice, as you know are contracts do not actually expire.

If all the groups are Negotiating at DFW there has to be a reason.

 

[TWU informer]

There is no advantage for any group to negotiate at headquarters. Ask any labor professor if this situation is in the best interest of our members. Since I was there in 2003, I have planty of examples why we should not negotiate in DFW.

It would be nice to have traveling negotiations in different cities and membership observers present.

No secrets, No hiding information, No sellouts with out identification, No company bootlicking unionism.

Oh wait a minute, that isn't the TWU way.

 

[Chuck Schalk]

There is no advantage for any group to negotiate at headquarters. Ask any labor professor if this situation is in the best interest of our members. Since I was there in 2003, I have planty of examples why we should not negotiate in DFW.

we have different negotiators than the pilots and flight attendants. we all don't sit at the same table per say.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

I agree, especially with the specific individuals that will be negotiating ( like Burchette ) I am concerned about losing what we have with these guys negotiating and the fact that we would not be able to strike even if Tulsa would be willing to since Bush would step in and force everyone back to work, also they could sell the base or file bankruptcy, I tend to think that the company will probably throw a bone to the Negotiators and they will sell us on a small raise and maybe a few benefits back, hopefully these inhancements will not come at the loss of some other benefit.
like retiree medical or our Pension etc. but if it does I won't be surprised.

It will be interesting to see what happens with the Pilots, I am actually glad they went first.

ANYTHING less than full snapback plus COLA will be another concessionary contract. If the twu brings that back and tries to sell it then the entire membership had better be prepared to take action. With or without the int.

 

[Raptor]

ANYTHING less than full snapback plus COLA will be another concessionary contract. If the twu brings that back and tries to sell it then the entire membership had better be prepared to take action. With or without the int.

Ken the people in Tulsa won't strike I am sure of that, they would probably be willing to do a work slow down ergo do things by the Book.
Several years back you would hear people talking about striking because the work force in Tulsa was fairly young and they had not been at AA for very long but these days very few people think there would be any chance of a strike because the work force is not young anymore the average age is 46 years old, most people have been at AA for 20 years or more and they know they have never seen a strike or even came close to one, We took a massive concession in 2003 and never came close to a strike, very few people in Tulsa go to Union meetings or vote for officers or even vote on our contracts less than half actually, it is a very Apathetic work force here now and Apathetic people are not people of drastic action, I know that is not what you want to hear but that is the reality of the situation.

I know I am not telling you anything that you don't already know, if you could come to the specail Meeting on the 20th you should come and you will see what I mean, I am thinking there will probably be less than 1000 people there and we have like 8000 Members here in Tulsa.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Ken the people in Tulsa won't strike I am sure of that, they would probably be willing to do a work slow down ergo do things by the Book.
Several years back you would hear people talking about striking because the work force in Tulsa was fairly young and they had not been at AA for very long but these days very few people think there would be any chance of a strike because the work force is not young anymore the average age is 46 years old, most people have been at AA for 20 years or more and they know they have never seen a strike or even came close to one, We took a massive concession in 2003 and never came close to a strike, very few people in Tulsa go to Union meetings or vote for officers or even vote on our contracts less than half actually, it is a very Apathetic work force here now and Apathetic people are not people of drastic action, I know that is not what you want to hear but that is the reality of the situation.

I know I am not telling you anything that you don't already know, if you could come to the specail Meeting on the 20th you should come and you will see what I mean, I am thinking there will probably be less than 1000 people there and we have like 8000 Members here in Tulsa.

A special meeting at a union who's president is afraid of the word Strike? Even if I came I would not be allowed in.

As for striking. Perhaps Tulsa will not strike if the time calls for it, which, if we are not given back what was taken will come. Then let Tulsa stay at work and show their weakness. I am sure that the Line Stations will strike and that would impact AA quicker than any "blue zebra" or rented coffin ever will. Let Local 514's president and burchette continue to pretend to be union men. We both know the ONLY people these two people care about are themselves.

It will not be Tulsa who decides if we do in deed demand a decent contract it will be the Line, with MCI. Let's see Tulsa come repair a no go item 10 minutes before departure. This is NOT a traditional contract negotiations.

 

[Raptor]

A special meeting at a union who's president is afraid of the word Strike? Even if I came I would not be allowed in.

As for striking. Perhaps Tulsa will not strike if the time calls for it, which, if we are not given back what was taken will come. Then let Tulsa stay at work and show their weakness. I am sure that the Line Stations will strike and that would impact AA quicker than any "blue zebra" or rented coffin ever will. Let Local 514's president and burchette continue to pretend to be union men. We both know the ONLY people these two people care about are themselves.

It will not be Tulsa who decides if we do in deed demand a decent contract it will be the Line, with MCI. Let's see Tulsa come repair a no go item 10 minutes before departure. This is NOT a traditional contract negotiations.

I agree with you that a strike at the line stations would hurt AA much more than one at a Maintenance base it would take a Month or more for a strike at a Maintenance base to have much effect but it would hurt much sooner at a line station.

You have a good positive attitude I will give you that much, but what if Tulsa with the Majority votes to accept the contract what will happen then, that is what happened with the last concession and the other area's some of which did not pass, did not go on strike they merely accepted the vote and went on, I have to think that if Tulsa passes the vote that history will repeat itself and the other stations will go along with it again.

I hope things work out the way you want them to Ken, I really do, but I think you probably won't be to happy with the next contract we get, I would be happy if we just kept what we currently have and did not go backwards anymore, but I am not so sure even that will happen.

People are really nervous because of what happened with United and Northwest many people lost their Jobs and must now start over, United after filing Bankruptcy is now talking about selling off their Maintenance base, what will happen to all those people ?

Good luck Ken as I said I hope things work out.
If not atleast you have the great weather and Beuatifull woman of California to help ease the pain.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Well you have a good positive attitude I will give you that much, but what if Tulsa with the Majority votes to accept the contract what will happen then, that is what happened with the last concession and the other area's some of which did not pass, did not go on strike they merely accepted the vote and went on, I have to think that if Tulsa passes the vote that history will repeat itself and the other stations will go along with it again.

I hope things work out the way you want them to Ken, I really do, but I think you probably won't be to happy with the next contract we get, I would be happy if we just kept what we currently have and did not go backwards anymore, but I am not so sure even that will happen.

People are really nervous because of what happened with United and Northwest many people lost their Jobs and must now start over, United after filing Bankruptcy is now talking about selling off their Maintenance base, what will happen to all those people ?

Good luck Ken as I said I hope things work out.
If not atleast you have the great weather and Beuatifull woman of California to help ease the pain.

Nervous because of what happened at UAL & NWA?

That fear/threat will always be there as long as we allow it. If we do not demand what is right then "next time" the same fear/threats will be pulled out of storage and used again.

If AA puts lipstick on a pig then the Presidents at negotiations should inform the members of what the insult consists of and refuse to bring it to a vote and leave negotiations. Let burchette and company then accept the contract and that will be the end of the twu at AA. These are not words of bravado. They are the "tone" of the work force.

 

[Raptor]

Nervous because of what happened at UAL & NWA?

That fear/threat will always be there as long as we allow it. If we do not demand what is right then "next time" the same fear/threats will be pulled out of storage and used again.

If AA puts lipstick on a pig then the Presidents at negotiations should inform the members of what the insult consists of and refuse to bring it to a vote and leave negotiations. Let burchette and company then accept the contract and that will be the end of the twu at AA. These are not words of bravado. They are the "tone" of the work force.

As you said Ken the real power is with the Line stations and I totaly agree with you there, IF they decide to ban together regardless of wether Tulsa accepts the contract or chooses not to strike or what the International chooses to do etc. then you will have your battle with the company, I am not at the line station so I do not know if they really have the guts to do that or not, all I know is what has happened in the past, I understand the threat will always be there and I understand you willingness to fight it is very Noble of you, but I also understand how the people here in Tulsa think, life moves at a slower pace here, people are more relaxed and complacent, they have big houses and land and toys etc. it is a very different lifestyle than at the line stations if you were here you might understand it better and you might not have as much contenmpt for their laxadazial attitudes.

I don't hammer on the apathic complacent attitudes here anymore because I have found that I have become one of them, it is very easy to do here for some reason, :unsure: I didn't even vote in the last officer election because I knew the same old people would just get right back in again and of course all but three of them did, our officers don't even campaign anymore because they know they are almost automatically going to get back in, and it is not because they are particulary good officers either it is just apathy.

P.S you idea about the Presidents sounds good but so far I am not impressed with any of them, how many went against the International to give us the details on this last extension. NONE

 

[Boomer]

Every TWU Union Member needs to make a motion refusing to fund negotiations costs, and cancelling all Union Officer Credit Cards, unless we are given access to the noegotiations and full language for each and every article T/A'ed.

Do it, and do it now: make the motion to stop the secrecy and misdirection.

 

[Raptor]

Every TWU Union Member needs to make a motion refusing to fund negotiations costs, and cancelling all Union Officer Credit Cards, unless we are given access to the noegotiations and full language for each and every article T/A'ed.

Do it, and do it now: make the motion to stop the secrecy and misdirection.

Sounds good on paper, I really like the idea myself, I doubt that anyone would disagree, but I wonder if anyone will actually do it :unsure:

Maybe you could run it by one of the 20 people that actually goes to our Union meetings in Tulsa.

 

[Bob Owens]

Was anything else expected from burchette? This guy is like a bad nightmare! He is the twu's version of a Phoenix. He was never "elected" into the int. the first time. He is ordered to step down. Goes back to Tulsa and some how finds enough blind fools to vote for him and then gets APPOINTED a second time into the int.

With burchette "in charge" you can trust on one thing. His #1 priority is the company.

Bobby Gless filled me in on why Burchette left office the first time. This is what he told me.


Joe Hasen, who was President of AFW invited Burchette to stay with him at his place when in Dallas. Joe Hasen was dating a girl whose twin sister was dating a top executive of AMR, I dont know if he was/is married, which would not suprise me, so I will leave his name out.

Well Burchette apparently really made himself at home while at Joes and decided whats Joes is his and availed himself to Joes girlfriend. This girl was an insurance salesperson and she felt she could offer TWU members a better LTD plan than Sonny Halls son and Ed Koziateks daughter were presently offering. Well when Burchette started pushing this new plan that was the end for him. Little couldnt save him.

Sonnys son passed away and Sonny Hall has retired so Burchette is right back where he left off. I dont know where the girl or Joe are now but it seems they are out of the picture.

 

[AMFAMAN]

Sonnys son passed away and Sonny Hall has retired so Burchette is right back where he left off. I dont know where the girl or Joe are now but it seems they are out of the picture.

Joe's mug shot was on the Tarrant County Jail database until recently, I believe he has now moved on to the "bigger" house, and is obviously no longer employed. Something about a meth operation.

 

[Bob Owens]

Joe's mug shot was on the Tarrant County Jail database until recently, I believe he has now moved on to the "bigger" house, and is obviously no longer employed. Something about a meth operation.

Funny how TWU posterboys end up on other posters.

 

[AMFAMAN]

I would be happy if we just kept what we currently have and did not go backwards anymore, but I am not so sure even that will happen.

You're not serious about settling for what we have? If that is the case, expect a major revolt on the line if a contract is brought back and bought by Tulsa that resembles those remarks. :down: Anything less than the return of our contract as a starting point with improvements from there is a sellout. If your remarks represent the majority of Tulsa, then tell your president to remain home and keep what you have and allow the pie to be divided by those who need it.