Thanks 628, but Im still trying to figure what does the traveling public get out of this flightnumber scam??? Why is it incumbent on me to decipher who flies what where and how?? A fricking farce!! IF I thought it would do any good, I would call my US Senator and maybe I will. If Frank Lautenberg stopped smoking on planes maybe he can cease this scam!
Code Share - a gimmick that is now old in the new world
- Thread starter Old PSA
- Start date
I remember, when returning from Berlin (TXL) on LH a couple of years ago, I was checked in and handled by an operation called "Globe Ground" not LH. Mind you this was in Berlin. I remember distinctly, because the young man behind the counter decided to upgrade me to biz for no apparent reason. Anyway, wouldn''t a common ''ground'' operation (let''s call it United/Star Ground or USGround) be a way to resolve the code share issue. If all USGround personnel and equipment could handle all operations of US/UA/AC, that would solve the check-in problem. Perhaps such an operation could also address the manpower issue with economies of scale.
Short of that, co-location of counters and gates would solve 90% of your problem. It''s just that you''ve got to start somewhere.
However, I agree that the code-share aspect is a glorified inter-line agreement designed primarily to get an advantage in computer reservation systems and distribution systems. The real inducement is FF merging. Now THAT would go over really well: Award Star Miles for all flights operated by UA/UA/AC so customers and not juggling three different programs.
just some thoughts.
Short of that, co-location of counters and gates would solve 90% of your problem. It''s just that you''ve got to start somewhere.
However, I agree that the code-share aspect is a glorified inter-line agreement designed primarily to get an advantage in computer reservation systems and distribution systems. The real inducement is FF merging. Now THAT would go over really well: Award Star Miles for all flights operated by UA/UA/AC so customers and not juggling three different programs.
just some thoughts.
KCFlyer
Veteran
The great thing about code shares is it will get those "I''ll never fly United Airlines again, and to prove it I''m flying USAirways on this trip", to buy a ticket on U and find themselves standing at the UAL gate.
Damnit ITRADE, stop your myopic perspective! OK, gimme the 700 miles! Ill take them! YES!!! But WHATS THE F*CKING POINT OF HAVING TO LABEL UNITED FLIGHTS AS USAIR FLIGHTS??? YOU STILL HAVE NOT ADDRESSED THAT POINT! Thats my contention! There is no need! FF programs and flightnumbering CAN BE mutually exclusive - did you know that?
ITRADE
Veteran
1) To increase positioning in the CRS.
2) To guarantee connections to the passengers.
3) To permit expansion of FF/passenger benefits to flights beyond those of carrier #1s network.
4) To market additional service without having to have the physical assets in place for the additional service.
Again, code-sharing is increasing, is not "old in the new world," and is DOT compliant. If it was old hat, then why did Continental, Northwest, and Delta just start doing it? Why is American looking for an additional partner to do it?
2) To guarantee connections to the passengers.
3) To permit expansion of FF/passenger benefits to flights beyond those of carrier #1s network.
4) To market additional service without having to have the physical assets in place for the additional service.
Again, code-sharing is increasing, is not "old in the new world," and is DOT compliant. If it was old hat, then why did Continental, Northwest, and Delta just start doing it? Why is American looking for an additional partner to do it?
KCFlyer
Veteran
I guess in the old days we didn''t have "code shares" - they just did that little thing that they used to call "interlining" That meant if I had to go from Orlando to Atlanta to Akron and then on to Dallas I flew Eastern to Atlanta, Alegheny to Akron, United to Chicago and American to Dallas. All with one phone call. And today we have "code shares". I guess so that you can be flying USAirways flight 6255 when everybody else is flying United 255.
Is JI GUY really upset about flying in a UA plane with a ticket that said US or that he had to wander around the airport looking for a US checkin? If there are no signs for US in PDX, then properties needs to get their act together and get some up in all of the code share cities asap. There also needs to be better signage at the counters telling people exactly where to checkin. If you are flying on a US flight numbers 6000-6999 to Denver, Chicago or Washington Dulles nonstop, then you need to check in at UA since these flights are operated by our Marketing Partner. Our current signage in this area doesnt measure up.
As far as the benefits for customers, I had a man today want to get a ticket to Toronto one way. We had a US flight all the way, but it was a long layover. We could get him to PIT and connect to AC with a shorter layover, but it was $1200. UA had a code share (US to PIT and AC to YYZ) that he ended up buying from UA and it was only $550 since it was sold as a UA flight connection and not an interline flight. Big advantage to the consumer in that case and proof that it DOES benefit the customer to have the codeshares.
As far as the benefits for customers, I had a man today want to get a ticket to Toronto one way. We had a US flight all the way, but it was a long layover. We could get him to PIT and connect to AC with a shorter layover, but it was $1200. UA had a code share (US to PIT and AC to YYZ) that he ended up buying from UA and it was only $550 since it was sold as a UA flight connection and not an interline flight. Big advantage to the consumer in that case and proof that it DOES benefit the customer to have the codeshares.
JS
Veteran
JI Guy, STOP IT! What are you, three years old?
Forget about the DOT and frequent flyer programs for a moment. Let me explain how this works from the perspective of pricing an airline ticket. Given the huge variance in fares and the increasing number of people who book their own tickets, I think this is an important point.
There are several fares available in the PDX-PHL market. You can buy a ticket from DL, AA, NW, CO, HP, UA or US. With 6 of those 7 airlines (any but US), you can choose plain old non-codeshare flights the whole way. You can fly DL PDX-ATL-PHL, you can fly AA PDX-DFW-PHL, you can fly NW PDX-MSP-PHL, you can fly CO PDX-IAH-PHL, you can fly HP PDX-PHX-PHL, and you can fly UA PDX-DEN-PHL.
If you choose to buy the ticket from US, you have no choice but to fly on a flight operated by UA from PDX to DEN since US operates no flights at all out of PDX.
Now let's consider this possibility -- go to Expedia.com or Travelocity.com or whatever, and choose "multiple cities". Enter PDX to DEN, DEN to PHL, PHL to DEN and DEN to PDX. Leave airline choice as "any airline".
Choose a plain old UA flight from PDX to DEN, and a plain old US flight DEN to PHL, and the same for the return flights.
The resulting fare you see will probably be greater than the fare you paid (if DEN is on sale, and the fare is less this way, that's a pretty obvious solution).
Why is this? By choosing a UA flight number from PDX to DEN and a US flight number from DEN to PHL, the fare quote you get back is PDX-DEN roundtrip plus DEN-PHL roundtrip. You have essentially created a PDX to PHL roundtrip with a DEN stopover in both directions (not connection, a stopover). Because it's actually two different fares, you can make your DEN stopover any length of time you want -- 45 minutes or 8 months, your choice.
The only way to get a roundtrip fare from PDX to PHL is to have just one airline code for all of the flights. It doesn't matter who operates them.
Forget about the DOT and frequent flyer programs for a moment. Let me explain how this works from the perspective of pricing an airline ticket. Given the huge variance in fares and the increasing number of people who book their own tickets, I think this is an important point.
There are several fares available in the PDX-PHL market. You can buy a ticket from DL, AA, NW, CO, HP, UA or US. With 6 of those 7 airlines (any but US), you can choose plain old non-codeshare flights the whole way. You can fly DL PDX-ATL-PHL, you can fly AA PDX-DFW-PHL, you can fly NW PDX-MSP-PHL, you can fly CO PDX-IAH-PHL, you can fly HP PDX-PHX-PHL, and you can fly UA PDX-DEN-PHL.
If you choose to buy the ticket from US, you have no choice but to fly on a flight operated by UA from PDX to DEN since US operates no flights at all out of PDX.
Now let's consider this possibility -- go to Expedia.com or Travelocity.com or whatever, and choose "multiple cities". Enter PDX to DEN, DEN to PHL, PHL to DEN and DEN to PDX. Leave airline choice as "any airline".
Choose a plain old UA flight from PDX to DEN, and a plain old US flight DEN to PHL, and the same for the return flights.
The resulting fare you see will probably be greater than the fare you paid (if DEN is on sale, and the fare is less this way, that's a pretty obvious solution).
Why is this? By choosing a UA flight number from PDX to DEN and a US flight number from DEN to PHL, the fare quote you get back is PDX-DEN roundtrip plus DEN-PHL roundtrip. You have essentially created a PDX to PHL roundtrip with a DEN stopover in both directions (not connection, a stopover). Because it's actually two different fares, you can make your DEN stopover any length of time you want -- 45 minutes or 8 months, your choice.
The only way to get a roundtrip fare from PDX to PHL is to have just one airline code for all of the flights. It doesn't matter who operates them.
