History Of B Scale

[justanadd]

In the NW forum it is stated that the TWU introduced the B scale. Does anyone have the facts to support which labor group at AA first was affected by the "B" scale and the first to agree to it?

As for the flight attendants was TWU or APFA the represenative when it was negoiated into the fa's contract.

 

[Wretched Wrench]

In the NW forum it is stated that the TWU introduced the B scale. Does anyone have the facts to support which labor group at AA first was affected by the "B" scale and the first to agree to it?

[post="311278"][/post]​

It was the TWU around 83, and affected mechs and fleet service first.

 

[jimntx]

It's BAAACK! Do not be surprised in the next round if an even worse B scale than previously instituted is put in. The difference will be that next time the B scalers will NEVER merge into the A scale.

The company's selling point will be that the current flight attendants will be able to continue as they are drawing $45/hr at top of scale. The new B scalers will start at something like $17/hr, top out at $24 or $25/hr and NEVER go over to A scale.

Now, this will probably mean that the job of flight attendant will return to something that young men and ladies do for a few years after college or retired people do part-time just to get cheap travel benefits. But, think of the money the company would save not only on salaries, but other benefits such as pensions.

And, don't think that the majority of APFA members would not vote for it in a second. They did it before, and they'll do it again.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

jimntx,

You MUST be a prophet !!!!!!!!

Because you're 1000% CORRECT !!!!!!!

NH/BB's

 

[aafsc]

jimntx,

You MUST be a prophet !!!!!!!!

Because you're 1000% CORRECT !!!!!!!

NH/BB's

[post="311386"][/post]​

That's right, they will vote it in to save themselves. A lot of the old timers in the TWU at AA complain rant and rave about the B-scale yet they are the ones who voted it in. During the early 1980s, all the people at EAL, TWA, Pan AM, Continental, and others were giving concessions back to their carriers. The "A-scalers" at AA never took cuts in wages (until 2003) because the "B-scalers" took it for them. Of course, after the B-scale came in at AA, Crandall placed a huge order for the super 80s and AA expanded exponentially. I can't see another "B scale" for ramp because starting pay is $8/hr and they have a hard time finding people. 5 hours a day X 5 days a week=25 hrsX$8=$200 per week gross pay. Subtract taxes and cost of benefits and a person is lucky to bring home $125 per week. I drive a small car and it costs about $38 per week in fuel to go back and forth to work. That leaves about $87 per week for busting your a$$ in the heat. No sane person would work for those wages.

 

[PRINCESS KIDAGAKASH]

What makes you think the company wants "sane" people working for it? :blink: :wacko: We had a "psycho"(I'll just call him/her "Nuvite") here at AFW,which the company fired(the union even agreed with the firing). The mechanics or the union local don't want anything to do with this person,because this person could go "postal" at anytime. What does AA do? They hired this person back on the condition that they'll take an "anger management" course(Like that is going to fix the serious mental problems this nutcase has).The only reason that we can guess AA brought "Nuvite" back was: They found out "Nuvite" was scabbing at NWA. I guess they figured he would come in handy during the next concessions vote. :blink:

 

[will fix for food]

I heard the pilots came up with it first.

 

[j7915]

It was the TWU around 83, and affected mechs and fleet service first.

[post="311280"][/post]​

Very slow news days??

The B-scale affected only new hires. People with recall rights were recalled under the pre-1983 contract. When are you guys going to stop beating ancient history? NO ONE was forced to hire on at AA. If the recruiter lied to you, you could always quit. AA is not the US military, so many fondly remember, you were not compelled to stay; only as I recall there were pretty long lines at the "ticket counter", how many B-Scalers actually had to work the full 10-12 years on that progression? Every contract there were jumps.

To pre-empt the tin-hat crowd, yes I have a floor to my income expectations, yes I am topped out, and yes I'd like more vacation...just not as much (vacation) as the NWA AMFA represented highly skilled, indispensable AMTS, sorry technicians. B)

AA is a job, a pay-check.

 

[AMFAMAN]

Very slow news days?

[post="311452"][/post]​

No, the thread was started by a NWA F/A in which the twu is raiding. Thanks for admitting on behalf of the twu about the B-Scale.

BTW...why don't you give the NWA F/A's a good reason to join the twu.

 

[Wretched Wrench]

Very slow news days??

[post="311452"][/post]​

What's with that? ...................A question was asked and answered.

Settle down.

.

 

[local 12 proud]

What's with that? ...................A question was asked and answered.

Settle down.

.

[post="311501"][/post]​

hey if you dont like it ......just quit

 

[TWU informer]

Very slow news days??

The B-scale affected only new hires. People with recall rights were recalled under the pre-1983 contract. When are you guys going to stop beating ancient history? NO ONE was forced to hire on at AA. If the recruiter lied to you, you could always quit. AA is not the US military, so many fondly remember, you were not compelled to stay; only as I recall there were pretty long lines at the "ticket counter", how many B-Scalers actually had to work the full 10-12 years on that progression? Every contract there were jumps.

To pre-empt the tin-hat crowd, yes I have a floor to my income expectations, yes I am topped out, and yes I'd like more vacation...just not as much (vacation) as the NWA AMFA represented highly skilled, indispensable AMTS, sorry technicians. B)

AA is a job, a pay-check.

[post="311452"][/post]​

Ancient History?

The fact that the TWU has negotiated a concessionary contract in every negotiations since de-regulation is not ancient history. That is current history.

an•cient

Pronunciation: (ān'shunt), [key]
—adj.
1. of or in time long past, esp. before the end of the Western Roman Empire a.d. 476: ancient history.

BTW, AMFA and NWA Management will be meeting for negotiations on Thursday, so let's wait and see how much vacation they return to work with.

 

[FWAAA]

I can't understand why the TWU membership at AA voted for all those concessionary contracts (not counting the 2003 concessions, which, of course, were not approved by any workgroup according to many) nor why the TWU membership didn't replace the TWU with another union in all those years since 1983.

Failing to take action in 1984 or 1985 or 1986 or any subsequent year branded the AA mechanics and related as easy marks. No wonder the 2003 concessions were so easily enacted.

But then again, I can't understand why airline mechanics would have ever associated with a bus drivers' union in the first place.

 

[TWU informer]

I can't understand why the TWU membership at AA voted for all those concessionary contracts (not counting the 2003 concessions, which, of course, were not approved by any workgroup according to many) nor why the TWU membership didn't replace the TWU with another union in all those years since 1983.

Failing to take action in 1984 or 1985 or 1986 or any subsequent year branded the AA mechanics and related as easy marks. No wonder the 2003 concessions were so easily enacted.

But then again, I can't understand why airline mechanics would have ever associated with a bus drivers' union in the first place.

[post="311574"][/post]​

Replacing a Union sounds easy.

But with 16,000+ scattered across the country, and then fighting the company, the company union, the AFL-CIO, and the National Mediation Board, the task is far more difficult than it sounds.

What is real interesting, is that the Mechanics at AA were represented by a mechanics union until 1947, and the bus driver union used the low skill stock clerk to conduct a raid, and the mechanics voted to change unions to the bus drivers dues collection agency.

There is enough evidence that I have seen to suspect that maybe the mechanics did not really vote in favor of all of those concessions of the past. It is not just the 2003 concessions that had illegal or questionable ratification ballot distribution, collection, and counting methods.

 

[Wretched Wrench]

.

What is real interesting, is that the Mechanics at AA were represented by a mechanics union until 1947, and the bus driver union used the low skill stock clerk to conduct a raid, and the mechanics voted to change unions to the bus drivers dues collection agency.

[post="311586"][/post]​

Not exactly. I have worked with a number of mechs who were at AA in 47 and voted in the TWU. The TWU achieved great gains for the transit workers in NYC, where AA's overhaul was located then. Additionally, the TWU had gotten Pan Am the 40 hour week a year or so earlier, along with better pay. And the TWU was led by Mike Quill until 66 or so. He was an honest idealistic aggressive and charismatic union man, and was loved and followed by most mechs in those days. I believe most of us would have voted in the TWU in 47 had we been there. I believe the moving of overhaul to TUL, with a quite different demographic creeping into the work force, and the corruption of the TWU hierarchy after Mike Quill's death are the main causes of our present situation.