Holy Moly Andy....

The Ronin

Senior
Sep 17, 2002
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CHICAGO - United Airlines expects to emerge from bankruptcy by year's end even if its pending application for a $1.6 billion federal loan guarantee is rejected, CEO Glenn Tilton said Friday.

Cash-crunched United believes it qualifies for and urgently needs the government backing, which the Air Transportation Stabilization Board is expected to rule on soon. But Tilton said the carrier's 18-month restructuring has left it on solid enough footing to finish the reorganization regardless of the verdict.

United is targeting fall for its exit from Chapter 11, though that timing could be in jeopardy if the company doesn't receive the long-sought loan guarantee.

"I think that the balance of the year would provide us ... with sufficient time to complete the restructuring _ with or without" the loan guarantee, Tilton told The Associated Press in an interview at United's headquarters in suburban Elk Grove Village.

Tilton declined to discuss any contingency plans if the government backing falls through, but he said the airline's bankruptcy lenders have strongly endorsed its restructuring steps and the overhaul has left it "resilient" despite continuing losses.

United's restructuring moves have included $2.5 billion in annual labor cost reductions, including trimming employee wages and benefits, and extensive aircraft refinancing.

The airline recorded a modest operating profit in May and would be en route to an operating gain for the entire second quarter if not for recent jet fuel increases that have added $750 million to its estimated fuel tab for 2004, Tilton said.

"Whatever our fate, the business plan manifested in the application is a resilient business plan," he said. "When we take that business plan forward to whatever the group of constituents will ultimately be that ... take this company out of its restructuring, I think that we have done the work."

Tilton's comments come as some analysts voice skepticism that the government will approve United's application for a loan guarantee, citing the recent losses of large carriers, high fuel costs, pricing pressures from discount carriers and US Airways' continuing struggles despite the government's help.

But few think a denial, while painful to United, would drive the airline out of business.

UBS Securities analyst Sam Buttrick said in a note to investors Thursday that an ATSB rejection would simply move United to Plan B, "which would likely entail some combination of a longer stay in the protective custody of bankruptcy and redoubled cost-reduction efforts to achieve a cost structure that would attract market capital and perhaps some modest level of network downsizing."

Further cuts could put employees' pension plans at risk, especially in light of some huge looming payment obligations to those funds. Tilton declined to say whether he would consider such a drastic action if the loan guarantee is turned down.

"The only answer I could give you is that the current business plan is, in my view and the view of our banks, our financial advisers and the rating agency that we took the plan to, financeable. I'm focused on that business plan and I'm not focused on anything else."

Tilton hailed United's unions for agreeing to revised cutbacks to retirees' medical and life insurance benefits.

"It's an example of all of the constituent groups coming to recognize the need," he said. "This is a balance between something that is unfortunate, unpleasant, but necessary."

He also said that while its four-month-old discount carrier Ted has proven successful so far, with planes 87 percent to 89 percent full, United will be "disciplined" about expanding it and will focus first on improvements.
 
WOW.....WOW......WOW....

Bet you didn't see this one coming....did the landscape just change or what....uh-oh,....."Houston....I think we have a problem" :eek:
 
Out of bankruptcy by "year's end". Which year? First it was the Spring, then the Summer, then the Fall, then.....
 
46Driver said:
Out of bankruptcy by "year's end". Which year? First it was the Spring, then the Summer, then the Fall, then.....
Hmm, with DAL, and NWA joining the fight, and ACA's inability to be on time, deliver luggage to it's passengers, and reduce costs to a level that would make them profitable under the new UAL rates (like Skywest, AWA, and Mesa have done), I'm thinking UAL will be out of BK just a little while before Incontinence Air enters it. :eek:
 
Busdrvr said:
Hmm, with DAL, and NWA joining the fight, and ACA's inability to be on time, deliver luggage to it's passengers, and reduce costs to a level that would make them profitable under the new UAL rates (like Skywest, AWA, and Mesa have done), I'm thinking UAL will be out of BK just a little while before Incontinence Air enters it. :eek:
Well, maybe well be lucky enough to stay in Chapter 11 for several more years and ask the government for a few billion $ to cover our incompetence like some other airlines.....
 
46Driver said:
Well, maybe well be lucky enough to stay in Chapter 11 for several more years and ask the government for a few billion $ to cover our incompetence like some other airlines.....
Doubtful, Chapt 11 isd only an option if you actually have some plan or even concept for lowering costs. With some of the lowest paid employees in the industry, you're already there. A bastion of military pilots? Yeah right :rolleyes:
 
Hmmm, in the regional industry, we were near the top of the scale in regards to pay and work rules. You now have MESA which is the bottom of the payscale.

As for military pilots, last time I checked my "wings of gold" were representative of me being qualified as a naval aviator - just like a number of my friends at ACA.
 
Doubtful, Chapt 11 isd only an option if you actually have some plan or even concept for lowering costs. With some of the lowest paid employees in the industry, you're already there. A bastion of military pilots? Yeah right :rolleyes:
 
Oh no, nay nay contraire. It can get worse….much worse. And it’s all right here in Glenn’s statement. For the first time UAL has admitted “optionsâ€￾ if ATSB denies the loan. It is preparing publicly for this possibility. And without ATSB backing, we may be a 245 a/c fleet with 30,000 employee company. I can feel all the underpinnings at work here. Something will be salvaged of UAL, exactly what no one knows. :up:
 
Hmmmmm...

I'm not convinced that the ATSB has made up it's mind yet. This is an election year, and my personal guess is about a 65% to 75% chance of getting the ATSB guarantee.

But it is interesting that Tilton said we will emerge with or without the ATSB loan. I can't help but wonder if this is just a statement of confidence to reassure our customers, or if he is publicly preparing to announce an ATSB rejection.

It's possible JP Mogan and Citigroup have opened the financial market to us again, which would give the ATSB reason to claim we don't need the guarantee.

Who knows... I just hope we find out soon. The suspense is killing me.

My optimistic side believes that we do have a solid restructured business plan. The higher cost of an unsecured loan, coupled with possible loss of codeshare revenue if USAir liquidates, and higher (but dropping) fuel costs, would mean some more sacrifice, but not create an unsolveable crisis. I don't expect any more reduction in the airline's size. Especially with UA re-entering and expanding international markets, and the expansion of TED.

On a side note, has anyone noticed that no A319/320's have the new UA paint job? So far I've seen a 737, 757, 767, 777, and 747 in the new livery. I've also seen many TED airplanes. Any guesses?
 
<<<On a side note, has anyone noticed that no A319/320's have the new UA paint job? So far I've seen a 737, 757, 767, 777, and 747 in the new livery. I've also seen many TED airplanes. Any guesses? >>>

Yes, the current livery schedule starts with older airplanes. Many Airbuses were delivered only a few years ago, so except for TED, I dont expect to see any A320/319 in the new livery until at least next year or two.
 
No,
the livery schedule starts with airlplanes that are scheduled for paint. Age of the aircraft is not the factor, it is how long it has been since they were painted last.

JB Guppy
 
An election year might not pan out the way UAL hopes. While an ATSB turndown may cause additional job loss at UAL, the public taxpayer/voter will support this IMHO . Most non-airline people feel that UAL shouldn't get the backing. Unfortunately for UAL, the majority of the country isn't employed at United. Just my $.02
 
767jetz said:
Hmmmmm...

I'm not convinced that the ATSB has made up it's mind yet. This is an election year, and my personal guess is about a 65% to 75% chance of getting the ATSB guarantee.

But it is interesting that Tilton said we will emerge with or without the ATSB loan. I can't help but wonder if this is just a statement of confidence to reassure our customers, or if he is publicly preparing to announce an ATSB rejection.

It's possible JP Mogan and Citigroup have opened the financial market to us again, which would give the ATSB reason to claim we don't need the guarantee.

Who knows... I just hope we find out soon. The suspense is killing me.

My optimistic side believes that we do have a solid restructured business plan. The higher cost of an unsecured loan, coupled with possible loss of codeshare revenue if USAir liquidates, and higher (but dropping) fuel costs, would mean some more sacrifice, but not create an unsolveable crisis. I don't expect any more reduction in the airline's size. Especially with UA re-entering and expanding international markets, and the expansion of TED.

On a side note, has anyone noticed that no A319/320's have the new UA paint job? So far I've seen a 737, 757, 767, 777, and 747 in the new livery. I've also seen many TED airplanes. Any guesses?
I love your optimism!!

Hopefully we will know soon, the waiting is intense!!
 
Ok, obviously I don't KNOW what the ATSB will do. But lets paint a picture shall we. I am Glenn, and I have spent a year preaching the necessity of the ATSB loan. I have been quoted in every magazine and newspaper saying how United's recovery depends on this loan backing. I have used every lobbying means on capitol hill including just recently hiring some broad cause she knows people? I have exuded the utmost pressure and reassured everybody that United had done what was necessary to obtain this guarantee. Why then do I pubicly announce that with or without the guarantee United is postured correctly for BK exiting? Why do I let the pressure off the board and politicians? Why do I give the board an out, unless a little bird may have already given me the answer. This message is not for Washington or the board. This message is for the employee's who will rightfully panic. This is for the customers who will worry about already booked tickets. This is for the creditors who are likely to be just as jumpy. I think it would be safe to say that we will know this week, and it won't be in our favour. Otherwise, our annointed one just made about the biggest tactical blunder as well, anyone in the United family could. :up: