IAM District 142 Negotiations Update

[delldude]

Just an opinion Dell. I will give your question some points though by saying it is a plausible question. I think most people are so damn busy today that they have little time to even consider their collective bargaining situation. Perhaps ironic.
Generally speaking, there is a huge cancer for unions called member apathy. Members want unions to entertain them but in the end, the opium has seemed to silence the masses anyways. The apathy has created an environment for the leaches to rise and multiply enough to pimp and corrupt the entire.

Both of us have similar union backrounds to some degree.I suppose you are a student of labor history then....I think the present state of unionism was the result of the toil and strife our forefathers went through to make it better for us.....however,to this day its a hand me down union,with present members having it too good and never experiencing the hardship of labor strife.Much like you and I growing up in a world where war is on the 6:00 news and not outside our door.....never having to see,hear or feel what those in the earlier part of the past century had to endure for the most part.
Sure there have been labor battles and such but not to the degree of the founding days of the labor movement for sure.
Later on,

 

[700UW]

There is a differance,

Dell you were in it for the members, Tim is in it for himself, he started his own union three times and failed, he appointed himself in charge and tried to divide the members.

He filed short of cards back in the early 90s and caused harm to this coworkers as a bar was enacted and the company did as they pleased and took and took and took.

He called for a slowdown on a PIT ramp webpage (The Big Picture) and was just about terminated and the IAM saved his job.

He tried to sell his name list to the IBT for a job, he was in contact with the TWU trying to get a job for promoting them, and that came from the PHX local of the TWU.

Big differance, you are a trade unionist and Tim is in it for himself.

 

[roadtrip]

You need some help from a very good head doctor because at this point your life consists of living to slam the IAM. Obsession is a serious disorder that needs prompt attention least we read about the spill over in the papers.

.

Its funny but there are many people who fight injustice people may not agree but is still America. Some folks have a passion when it comes to stand up and fight for a cause.
For example Kathy Sheehan or Liberials who hate George Bush or the repulican party so they go out and protest write papers does that make them obsessed ? Hell no! I suggest you read the constitution you dont like what your reading here I suggest you surf the net and find other blogs to read. On a side note I'm glad Tim's here to post
he brings content and stirs the pot to get people thinking about the leaders who are doing a piss poor job represnting the memebers of Fleet Service.

 

[700IAM]

Huh?

Yes, I understand clearly you are spiritually dead hence your past actions and present rants.

 

[700UW]

Believe it or not he is a minister.

 

[700IAM]

Believe it or not he is a minister.

What of... Satan's House of Worship?


And to the freak who worships that whack job telling me to read the constitution and telling me to go away, you are one of his few followers, a true believer, how sad. I sure hope you like it piping hot.


[get people thinking] you say, sure he does, of how insane he is and how moronic mental disorders can make one look.


Fleet service workers obviously have a very low opinion of themselves to even entertain such people, plus they stay in a dead end position then blame the world for it instead of moving forward with their live. Tim is the minister of what again, the disadvantaged or mentally challenged or both? I know I know, you’re going to kick my A-z-z like the Philly incident with those mental midget’s antics. You get out of life what you put into it and no man including Tim will save you from the woes of this life. In this life you will have trouble, regardless of whether Tim comes to the rescue or not. He is more of a hindrance than help, look at his track record and then look at what he opposes and their track record, oh I forgot, mentally challenged and can’t reason, forget it.

 

[700AW]

What of... Satan's House of Worship?
And to the freak who worships that whack job telling me to read the constitution and telling me to go away, you are one of his few followers, a true believer, how sad. I sure hope you like it piping hot.
[get people thinking] you say, sure he does, of how insane he is and how moronic mental disorders can make one look.
Fleet service workers obviously have a very low opinion of themselves to even entertain such people, plus they stay in a dead end position then blame the world for it instead of moving forward with their live. Tim is the minister of what again, the disadvantaged or mentally challenged or both? I know I know, you’re going to kick my A-z-z like the Philly incident with those mental midget’s antics. You get out of life what you put into it and no man including Tim will save you from the woes of this life. In this life you will have trouble, regardless of whether Tim comes to the rescue or not. He is more of a hindrance than help, look at his track record and then look at what he opposes and their track record, oh I forgot, mentally challenged and can’t reason, forget it.

errrr, is the title of this thread about dl 142's update, if you want to belittle and besirch tim for his ramp opions due it on one of those threads, we already have enough in the 142( or recently seperated) that are just as disagreed with for their opining as tim is disagreed with about his.
it shows your character that you have to resort to calling him "mentally challenged and can’t reason" unless you are a licensed psychologist, then leave mental diagnosis to the pro's

 

[PITbull]

When I didn't like what I saw, I tried to coordinate a competing officer ticket to get those I personally saw as 'leaches' out of office. I was successful in putting together a multi employer ticket that even included "Diehards" that would die for the IAM. But, in the end, the undemocratic system was a stonewall, and not surprisingly, the IAM even violated that [See DOJ and DOL suits].

My conclusion was that any time spent trying to 'fix this union' is a complete and utter waste. It's just the perfect storm of worker apathy and union boss unaccountability.
BTW, it is much harder to vote out an IAM Boss than it would be to just get rid of the whole union. Nonetheless, a taunting task indeed.

Hopefully, a delta merger would trigger a vote where I believe the great majority of workers will finally have the democratic opportunity to 'wash out' the IAM off US AIRWAYS property.

Just an opinion Dell. I will give your question some points though by saying it is a plausible question. I think most people are so damn busy today that they have little time to even consider their collective bargaining situation. Perhaps ironic.
Generally speaking, there is a huge cancer for unions called member apathy. Members want unions to entertain them but in the end, the opium has seemed to silence the masses anyways. The apathy has created an environment for the leaches to rise and multiply enough to pimp and corrupt the entire.
I think if one is to research the cultural phenomena that it will show an environment not condusive to unions or solidarity. A radical shift would have to take place within the American Labor movement to make unions more of an internalized and legitimate part of society. Such a shift, imo, would not occur at the top of the unions, they are already damned and I would think it impossible for the bloodsuckers to stop feeding.

At any rate,

regards

Tim,

How true is that...(your statement in the above post that I bolded).

I can surely empathise. It is perfectly understandable how some from the "inside" can develop an impression of certain leadership who once elected or promoted, no longer have to be accountable. The most frustrating part of my experience in the union was seeing political corruption and not allowing those that want total control to contain you, specifically when you know they are not acting in the "best interest" of the membership.

Anyone who sits on this board and denies that this type of shitt doesn't exist in their respective union is delusional and drank to much of their own kool-aide brew. I am pro organized labor; but against leaders who become "comfortable" with the status quo and try to quench those who oppose their lack of energy or complacency to collect big pay with no accountability or lack of production. At AFA we have the bylaws that can get rid of someone elected or appointed by virture of a recall and not having to cite any reason(s).

However, often times, I have seen first hand, that it is one of the most challenging tasks...to get rid of those leaders that don't belong in an organization, basically any organization representing dues paying members. With the IAM, unlike AFA, getting rid of a district rep is literally impossible, and that should not be.

Someone or group needs to present an agenda item at the IAM International convention to change their bylaws so that the members have more of a say in who represents them. There needs to be an avenue for "recall", and I haven't seen it in the IAM bylaws. I suspect that would be a feat as well, being that IAM upper level is not accountable to the membership for their actions, or lack there of in certain districts.

Anyway, I can understand why you would move to form your own union...perfectly understand that passion. I agree with everything you posted on this issue.

 

[700IAM]

errrr, is the title of this thread about dl 142's update, if you want to belittle and besirch tim for his ramp opions due it on one of those threads, we already have enough in the 142( or recently seperated) that are just as disagreed with for their opining as tim is disagreed with about his.
it shows your character that you have to resort to calling him "mentally challenged and can’t reason" unless you are a licensed psychologist, then leave mental diagnosis to the pro's

MY opinion is just that, an opinion, and my opinion is that every other opinion on this topic is simply moronic.

Tim wants his name published then he can take the heat with that choice.

I don’t see anything changing from a few moronic posters belittling the IAM, it’s direction or leadership.

You want to change the world, then pray for Jesus to return sooner than he plans because that’s the ONLY way things will change.

Changing the world one fit and rant at a time doesn’t get it

 

[fanlube]

All Labor groups should be running ads as we speak and let people know where the money for this merger is coming from! It is coming from all the sacrifices that all the airline employees have made, the pensions lost the wage cuts, the holidays we no longer get, the lack of sick time, the thousands furloughed and last but not least let the public know how this management team can't agree on a transition agreement because and I quote Al Hemmingway, "There is nothing in it for the company". I beleive they pretty much got every thing they wanted and then some during the bankruptcy process!! Remember they are willing to spend 10 BILLION DOLLARS for Delta, don't buy into the song and dance about we have to keep costs in line, I understand we can't get everything back but there is no reason we can't get a little!!

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim,

How true is that...(your statement in the above post that I bolded).

I can surely empathise. It is perfectly understandable how some from the "inside" can develop an impression of certain leadership who once elected or promoted, no longer have to be accountable. The most frustrating part of my experience in the union was seeing political corruption and not allowing those that want total control to contain you, specifically when you know they are not acting in the "best interest" of the membership.

Anyone who sits on this board and denies that this type of shitt doesn't exist in their respective union is delusional and drank to much of their own kool-aide brew. I am pro organized labor; but against leaders who become "comfortable" with the status quo and try to quench those who oppose their lack of energy or complacency to collect big pay with no accountability or lack of production. At AFA we have the bylaws that can get rid of someone elected or appointed by virture of a recall and not having to cite any reason(s).

However, often times, I have seen first hand, that it is one of the most challenging tasks...to get rid of those leaders that don't belong in an organization, basically any organization representing dues paying members. With the IAM, unlike AFA, getting rid of a district rep is literally impossible, and that should not be.

Someone or group needs to present an agenda item at the IAM International convention to change their bylaws so that the members have more of a say in who represents them. There needs to be an avenue for "recall", and I haven't seen it in the IAM bylaws. I suspect that would be a feat as well, being that IAM upper level is not accountable to the membership for their actions, or lack there of in certain districts.

Anyway, I can understand why you would move to form your own union...perfectly understand that passion. I agree with everything you posted on this issue.

PitBull,
[after replying to your post, I reread your post and saw that your question 'how true is that' was really a statement. At any rate, I left the text below unedited.]
First, my apologies for not putting in the time to fully answer your question, but time i just don't have to really deconstruct this topic.

But a truncated 'generalized' view of my opinion FWIW:

Dunno, but it seems to me there are three fundamental things that interfere with the power or need of 'present day organized labor in America'.

1. Apathy. Apathy creates a huge gulf between those that make it to the other side as paid union officers, as opposed to common members. A great emptiness is between the two sides so that the sacred side [paid officers] can pretty much sit back and put the union on cruise control as they make sweethearts and pimp the workers. The high salaries of these paid officers usually leave no question as to where their loyalty lies...in their wallets.

2. Cultural shift
early last century unions thrived as the working people didn't mind being soldiers to a paternal structure. A union could do whatever it wanted with little or no communication. I don't think these things exist in today's culture as people want to make choices, usually associated with individual[ism].
With that Paternal, 'daddy knows best' power, the unions always found something to fight for and were often successful. Union Bosses were still thugs and still stole from members but it didn't matter because the union was internalized and legitimated under the 'workers canopy'. The union had its sacredness and the meaning of a scab was truly profane.

3. Labor Organizational resource shift from the working people, towards politics and agendas that have nothing to do with the working people. In short, the unions are a long way from home and the resulting relationship [as with any relationship] isn't as warm and there is a huge feeling of distrust between member and union boss. Everyone is sleeping around now and the only thing left of the relationship is a meaningless ring [dues check off].

There's more to it but I got to jet.

I should note to you that although I fully understand you being 'pro organized labor', I am not, provided we are talking about the American Labor movement. I've come 180 degrees as I believe the American Labor movement is a fraud and scandal and should be chunked into the deep blue sea. It's cancerous to the masses and contributes to the problems.

Practically speaking, what this means is that I would be 100% for a decertification if there was ever a Delta merger. Doesn't mean corporate greed isn't alive but rather the American Labor movement as I know it is useless, powerless, and not worth the 50 bucks and change per month IMO.

regards,

 

[PITbull]

Tim,

I don't think it fair to measure all organized labor looking through a tunnel where your experience and disatisfaction lay IAM or Teamsters. That's not to say that all unions don't have their own innate broblems, but what I think is important is that members have a way to extricate/expell leaders who are useless. AT AFA and ALPA (who have basically the same Constitution and Bylaws) have guidlines which all carriers' members who are under AFA and ALPA must abide by. The C&B gives POWER to the membership, and they can move to replace those that don't act in their best interest. Same with the BOD delegates who are The LEC Presidents of all the carriers under AFA. Their vote by majority can remove an International President.

WHo has the most POWER (if they know how to use it and are organized) ARE the members.

It has been used and done quite often at AFA, and ALPA.

Behold, most recent, the pressure by the members to remove the Local officers of the biggest base at U...Philadelphia.

New elections to be conducted next month.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim,

I don't think it fair to measure all organized labor looking through a tunnel where your experience and disatisfaction lay IAM or Teamsters. That's not to say that all unions don't have their own innate broblems, but what I think is important is that members have a way to extricate/expell leaders who are useless. AT AFA and ALPA (who have basically the same Constitution and Bylaws) have guidlines which all carriers' members who are under AFA and ALPA must abide by. The C&B gives POWER to the membership, and they can move to replace those that don't act in their best interest. Same with the BOD delegates who are The LEC Presidents of all the carriers under AFA. Their vote by majority can remove an International President.

WHo has the most POWER (if they know how to use it and are organized) ARE the members.

It has been used and done quite often at AFA, and ALPA.

Behold, most recent, the pressure by the members to remove the Local officers of the biggest base at U...Philadelphia.

New elections to be conducted next month.

True, some are better than others. Still, i think a whole new paradigm is needed. And even if there is a leader who has the members best interest, the INTL will manufacture against said leader if the leader doesn't abide by what the union's 'laptop boys' think.

regards,

 

[PITbull]

True, some are better than others. Still, i think a whole new paradigm is needed. And even if there is a leader who has the members best interest, the INTL will manufacture against said leader if the leader doesn't abide by what the union's 'laptop boys' think.

regards,

We share the same history...LOL....You just have to be one step ahead. I made sure my people were communicated to for 5 straight years. The International PRes didn't get away with anything with my members, nor the MECP at the time. The idea is to communicate often so that you are not alone with the truth, using every venue known to mankind. I have learned the more folks that know, the better representation and relationship you have with your membership. I found myself arguing with my own leadership more than managment...but my members knew every single detail!

 

[Tim Nelson]

We share the same history...LOL....You just have to be one step ahead. I made sure my people were communicated to for 5 straight years. The International PRes didn't get away with anything with my members, nor the MECP at the time. The idea is to communicate often so that you are not alone with the truth, using every venue known to mankind. I have learned the more folks that know, the better representation and relationship you have with your membership. I found myself arguing with my own leadership more than managment...but my members knew every single detail!

Yes, I thought you did well. Alot of time sacrifice on your part. Then didn't they manufacture garbage against you?