No Loan For Ua

[Bigsky]

With the ATSB rendering their decision regarding UA's loan guarantee, what effect might that have on NW? With the Pacific also being a crown jewel for UA, I seriously doubt that UA will be selling off any of their Asian routes to raise much needed capital. Of course, eventually they may not have a choice. I do think it was a good call by the ATSB; I had this horrible vision of UA getting the loan and with their pockets full of cash you'd see alot of cheap seats from the US to Asia while they attempted to reclaim some lost Asian markets.

cheers

bigsky

 

[BillLumbergh]

Thanks for putting the NW subheading on the post. This certainly keeps it within this forum.

Feel free to carry on.

If folks want to review the UA perspective, click here

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

With the ATSB rendering their decision regarding UA's loan guarantee, what effect might that have on NW? With the Pacific also being a crown jewel for UA, I seriously doubt that UA will be selling off any of their Asian routes to raise much needed capital. Of course, eventually they may not have a choice. I do think it was a good call by the ATSB; I had this horrible vision of UA getting the loan and with their pockets full of cash you'd see alot of cheap seats from the US to Asia while they attempted to reclaim some lost Asian markets.

cheers

bigsky

Hurt NW ???

IMHO, There is NO way in HEL* UA's (now bigger) problems can hurt BIG RED !!

NH/BB's

 

[jimntx]

Hurt NW ???

IMHO, There is NO way in HEL* UA's (now bigger) problems can hurt BIG RED !!

NH/BB's

I don't think the question limited the answer to negative effects. However, if UAL does end up having to sell some trans-Pacific route authorities, I doubt seriously that NW would be allowed to purchase them. The lack of competition issue would be objected to on one side of the pond or the other.

Reduction in UAL domestic service, aside from reducing competition for NW domestic service, might make connecting to a NW International flight more attractive than to a UAL International flight to the same destination. But that would require all other things to be equal to make a real difference. Let's face it. Making a connection from domestic to International on anybody's airline is not exactly a piece of cake in this day and age.

 

[kiowa]

any asset sales would certainly not be allowed to a "legacy carrier". only low budget airlines with cheap employees would benefit- to the detriment of nwa.

 

[jimntx]

any asset sales would certainly not be allowed to a "legacy carrier". only low budget airlines with cheap employees would benefit- to the detriment of nwa.

Unless the assets for sale are International route authorities. None of the US LCCs are really set up to take advantage of international flying on the same scale as AA, UAL, CO, or U. These airlines know how to do International flying and have crews readily available to pick up the slack. The LCCs would have more infrastructure preparation to do--training programs (which by FAA regs are different from domestic training), acquisition of a/c with the range, etc.

Not to say they couldn't get that way, but there is a limit to how far you can travel on LCC meals or lack thereof. They would have to more closely match the legacies as far as onboard service. Flying to the Caribbean from NYC and flying to Narita from ORD are two really different things.

Besides, if UAL starts selling assets while in bankruptcy, the court will not care who buys it, only that their check doesn't bounce. Neither the court nor the creditors committee will look kindly on UAL saying, "Well, HP can bid on this, but not AA." Out of bankruptcy, they might have that luxury, but not in bankruptcy.

 

[kiowa]

totally disagree. current mindset of our government and country is cheap. all benefits to lo budget airlines. look at the issue in california where $28 million tax payer dollars were offered to branson ( a foreign corporation) to start a low cost carrier in san francisco to compete against US airlines. virgin can definitly compete against nwa on a world basis. any failing of a full service, quality airline, even usair, would hurt all the remaining carriers who pay their employees reasonable wages. the industry is seeking how lo everyone will go.

 

[Bigsky]

the industry is seeking how lo everyone will go.

And as long as there are pilots who are willing to do this job for Jetblue, Spirit and Airtrash/Valuejet wages the ground is the limit.

cheers

bigsky

 

[kiowa]

bigsky; absolutely true!

 

[boeing787]

Keep on posting all your BS about UAL. You guys are in for a dogfight like it or not. UAL ain't selling anything and ain't cutting domestics routes.

 

[TDR1502C]

How many haircuts can you stomach? NWA hasn't even gone to court yet, though it seems Wings Holdings doesn't care to be in any spotlights.

 

[bigbusdrvr]

And as long as there are pilots who are willing to do this job for Jetblue, Spirit and Airtrash/Valuejet wages the ground is the limit.

cheers

bigsky

The pilots at JBLU and airtran make what every other carrier makes, go to airlinepilotpay.com and see for your self...

Its all the "other people" that don't fit in to the LCC mantra.....

 

[Dave]

>>The pilots at JBLU and airtran make what every other carrier makes, go to airlinepilotpay.com and see for your self...<<

In salary. The difference is in retirement plans. Should UA pilots lose their retirement plan, no doubt NW will come to their pilots looking for the same concession.

It's a race to the bottom.

 

[bigbusdrvr]

>>The pilots at JBLU and airtran make what every other carrier makes, go to airlinepilotpay.com and see for your self...<<

In salary. The difference is in retirement plans. Should UA pilots lose their retirement plan, no doubt NW will come to their pilots looking for the same concession.

It's a race to the bottom.

This is the rub.....

Hire has beens or down on thier luck pilots at the LCC's......

They only think of today, no concern for the future retirement days.

Oh thats right they all are gonna be stock millionares........

So were the pilots at peoples express, ask a copilot at southwest how his retirement looks......

 

[Oneflyer]

Its called a 401k and it doesn't get taken away from you when your dinosaur of an airline goes out of business. federal law says that the corporate match has to offer something other than stock, most people are either stupid or greedy and chose the stock anyway.