Nw, F9 And Ua Payscales

[Bigsky]

For the A320, an aircraft common at NW, F9 and UA. Here are the new hourly pay rates for a five year Captain and FO

Captain A320
NW 171
F9 137
UA 120 (ouch)

First Officer A320
NW 106
F9 82
UA 77

 

[C54Capt]

For the A320, an aircraft common at NW, F9 and UA. Here are the new hourly pay rates for a five year Captain and FO

Captain A320
NW 171
F9 137
UA 120 (ouch)

First Officer A320
NW 106
F9 82
UA 77

[post="244816"][/post]​

bigsky,

The comparison gets worse for UA as you get to the top of the scale. BTW there is no such thing as a 5 year FO at F9 (by choice), they are all Captains making at least a buck and a quarter per year. Its unfortunate that as the smaller airlines were starting to create parity in the industry from a pay standpoint, UAL began a race for the bottom that they are clearly winning.

 

[Fly]

bigsky,

The comparison gets worse for UA as you get to the top of the scale. BTW there is no such thing as a 5 year FO at F9 (by choice), they are all Captains making at least a buck and a quarter per year. Its unfortunate that as the smaller airlines were starting to create parity in the industry from a pay standpoint, UAL began a race for the bottom that they are clearly winning.

[post="244975"][/post]​

What choice did they have? Say NO and lose their jobs? The race to the bottom began when the jerks at the top (mgmt) figured out just how much people loved their jobs and were willing to keep giving up to keep them. Sad fact. All you guys can #### and moan, but you'll bend over too....watch! I realize it's sad, but I also realize it's a fact.

(count how many guys who were furloughed who haven't found employment at other airlines in 3 years to prove my point)

 

[Bigsky]

Have to disagree, Fly. NWA pilots just signed an agreement three months ago. Yes, it did include a 15% paycut along within a few other minor goodies but all in all the contract that the NWA guys signed was pretty decent and the disparity in pilot contracts between NW and UA is now overwhelming.

So my question is to you, Fly, is at what point do you stop giving and actually have UAL management come up with a business plan that works? All the great employees at UAL say "Labor is not the problem." Next mangement asks for give backs and UAL labor signs on the dotted line. What's up with that? If you believe labor is not the problem then I'd stick with my convictions and not sign anywhere. Oh, yeah, like the mechs did!!!

cheers

bigsky

 

[Fly]

We stop giving when we find a better job.

What about you?

 

[Bigsky]

When it gets to where I am working for UAL pay/work rules, I would hope there would be at least a few opportunities that would top flying the friendly skies. A friend of mine at UAL agreed and recently started his own business and said "buh-bye" to UAL after 9 years of flying. He said he couldn't wait until 2009 to see if things got better with a new contract.
Kind of ironic that the 350 hour wonders who went straight to UAL out of flight school and avoided the low paying commuter jobs will finally get a second chance to work for similiar wages at United.

In the end we'll all probably get a chance to work for nothing. The question is who will say enough is enough. At UAL it's: Management 4, Mechanics 1, Everyone else 0

cheers

bigsky

 

[aafsc]

I do believe that the IAM, which represents ramp and agents, has not signed yet either.

 

[nostradamus]

Do you think that the barbarians will not come knocking at your door again, put a clean mat ouside, you will have alot of visitors. You opened the gates, the flood will start soon.

 

[Red Tail Bear]

I do believe that the IAM, which represents ramp and agents, has not signed yet either.

[post="245140"][/post]​

We haven't had anything to sign in quite a while now. And that means that we haven't had a pay increase in quite some time either. AA ramp just took a 16% paycut and still makes about the same $$ as NWA ramp.In almost 20 years the top pay has only risen $3.00 or $0.15 cents per year. Not to shabby HuH! :down: :down: :down:

 

[aafsc]

We haven't had anything to sign in quite a while now. And that means that we haven't had a pay increase in quite some time either. AA ramp just took a 16% paycut and still makes about the same $$ as NWA ramp.In almost 20 years the top pay has only risen $3.00 or $0.15 cents per year. Not to shabby HuH! :down: :down: :down:

[post="247716"][/post]​

My post was in reference to Big Sky's post on UA: Management 4, Mechanics 1, and everyone else 0. He was inferring that AMFA is the only one that has not yet caved when in fact the IAM has not yet caved either. The IAM, like AMFA, had something imposed on them by the judge. The only difference is the IAM never got a tentative agreement to vote on. But I am in agreement with your post.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Have to disagree, Fly. NWA pilots just signed an agreement three months ago. Yes, it did include a 15% paycut along within a few other minor goodies but all in all the contract that the NWA guys signed was pretty decent and the disparity in pilot contracts between NW and UA is now overwhelming.

[post="245005"][/post]​

Your bright, shiny new contract means NOTHING!!!

Take it from one who has been there on several occasion in the last few years. Pilot contracts and letters of agreement are worth less than the toilet paper being digested in your holding tanks.

Absent the national seniority list and national contract that ALPA should have pushed for 25 years ago with deregulation, each airline will now be forced into the race to the bottom. NW will be no different. NW will not be able to compete with Lowest Common Denominator Airline which will eventually find your markets and turn yields into negative numbers.

Bank on it happening within 2 - 3 years, unless UA and/or US closes its doors. Then it will happen in 3 - 4 years. But it will happen.

 

[Busdrvr]

Your bright, shiny new contract means NOTHING!!!

Take it from one who has been there on several occasion in the last few years. Pilot contracts and letters of agreement are worth less than the toilet paper being digested in your holding tanks.

Absent the national seniority list and national contract that ALPA should have pushed for 25 years ago with deregulation, each airline will now be forced into the race to the bottom. NW will be no different. NW will not be able to compete with Lowest Common Denominator Airline which will eventually find your markets and turn yields into negative numbers.

Bank on it happening within 2 - 3 years, unless UA and/or US closes its doors. Then it will happen in 3 - 4 years. But it will happen.

[post="248020"][/post]​

If U or UAL went away it would happen QUICKER. That capacity would not be replaced by NWA and DC-9's, it would be replaced by those slightly "nused' AB's and 77's that would hit the market, piloted by some out of work pilot's willing to work for low pay for the job, and for a WELL capitalized company. NWA, DAL, CAL, and AMR would be in big big big trouble.

Funny, the NWA guys weren't talking about the profession when they signed a NEW contract after 911 that significantly UNDERCUT UAL's. They had a chance to step up, they didn't.