One Nation

[Mechanic]

On 10-02-10 our union is calling for all of us, officers,members and activists to come to washington to stand shoulder to shoulder with the American Communist Party, several factions of the socialist party, the violent thugs of SEIU and Code Pink who enjoys protesting at the funerals of our our service men who gave the ultimate sacrifice. This is a despicable example of the the values and character of the TWU. Im sure our union dues support this kind of Anti American, Anti Capitalist crusade. Work hard!

 

[Vortilon]

On 10-02-10 our union is calling for all of us, officers,members and activists to come to washington to stand shoulder to shoulder with the American Communist Party, several factions of the socialist party, the violent thugs of SEIU and Code Pink who enjoys protesting at the funerals of our our service men who gave the ultimate sacrifice. This is a despicable example of the the values and character of the TWU. Im sure our union dues support this kind of Anti American, Anti Capitalist crusade. Work hard!

This is the kind of crap I was talking about. If one dime of our dues money goes to support these losers, it's too much!

 

[aapitbull]

This is the kind of crap I was talking about. If one dime of our dues money goes to support these losers, it's too much!

Gentlemen

I have not read who will be in attendence but it would not surprise me if some or all of these groups will be there, this is one of the biggest problems with the AFL-CIO they do not understand or care that a large number ot their members will not be associated with some of the mainstays of the movement. the ironic part is that some of the socialist are the biggest critics of the modern movement not us capitalist we seem content to let the idiots sell us out over and over again!

 

[Bob Owens]

On 10-02-10 our union is calling for all of us, officers,members and activists to come to washington to stand shoulder to shoulder with the American Communist Party, several factions of the socialist party, the violent thugs of SEIU and Code Pink who enjoys protesting at the funerals of our our service men who gave the ultimate sacrifice. This is a despicable example of the the values and character of the TWU. Im sure our union dues support this kind of Anti American, Anti Capitalist crusade. Work hard!

Anti American? Hardly. Unless you consider Free Speech, Freedom of religion and Democracy Anti American.



Show me where in the Constitution is dictates that we are a Capitalist nation? The fact is the founding fathers were very distrustful of "limited liability corporations" and the concentrated power of combined Capital. Corporations had to request permission to exist, state their reason for being and define how long they would be needed. They were not allowed to own other corporations. Granted such limitations would be unrealistic in the modern world but dont claim that what we have today is what the founding fathers had in mind or that capitalism has anything whatsoever to do with Democracy or Freedom. Capitalism thrives just as well under a dictatorship as it does in a Democracy.


Do you feel that foreign interests should be able to contol what you hear off our public airways?
Look at recent Supreme Court rulings that allow Corporations unlimited control over our political process. That doesnt alarm you? Not only do they control what you hear but they can donate as much money as they want to any politician they want. Do you think its right that entities that have and should have no right to cast a vote can in reality have more of a say in our political process with their cash and control over the media than you or I have with our vote?

Yea,the Communist party and Socialists will probably be there, they always show up at anything having to do with workers but violent thugs of the Seiu? Where's that coming from? Corporate America kills hundreds of workers every year, if anyone can be accused of violence its them. Code Pink, an antiwar group, well I'd never heard of them before, didnt read anything about protests at funerals but did read that parents of dead soldiers were part of the Group, I guess that despite their loss you are a better American in your eyes than they are. I supose you think they should just suck it up and keep their mouths shut. They had a distasteful vigil outside of Walter Reed but they claim that the people who set up the coffins and stuff weren't part of their group.

This is a Union led gathering and if you sell your labor as a means to support your family this gathering is to support your economic interests, if you are more concerned about and agreeable to the political manipulation God, Guns and Gays you should do us a favor and go into management, that is if you arent already.

The sad thing is many workers think they are Capitalists . If you live off managing and investing your Capital , letting it earn your income then you could call yourself a Capitalist, if you live by selling your labor to someone else you are a worker. While many do a little of both how many exist primarily of the earnings of their earnings vs the earnings of the labor?

 

[Tex-Mech]

Well said Bob. Unfortunately in Texas we have a whole bunch of union members that will sellout workers rights for gun rights. They are feel they are Capitalist because they have a big house with all the top of the line stuff filling it up, and a couple SUV's in the garage. All the while they are strapped for cash with their credit cards maxed out, a huge mortgage, and a couple of car payments. These wannabees continue to backstab and cut deals for overtime to feed their Captilistic way of life. But hey...they got their guns. 😉

 

[Ed Norton]

Funny how you have these working class stiffs voting Republican and considering themselves Capitalist; particularly here in Texas. These same people decry the evils of socialism and praise the virtues of capitalism while they have to work two jobs to make ends meet, watch their wages decrease, their pensions disappear and their medical costs soar through the roof. While capitalists destroy the industrial might of this nation, and send jobs to China (good Communists), these working class Republicans parrot the line of their masters and blame the unions, malign the likes of Hugo Chavez(bad Socialist) when he takes over a golf course to build public housing, and denounce the Greeks when they demonstrate on the streets agains IMF sanctioned austerity programs. Voting democrat won't help the working class either; since both parties are controlled by the same corporate interests and the banks that own them.
Why do these people act the way they do? Because they have lost their class consciousness. This is not a new phenomena. Jack London complained about it in War of the Classes way back in 1905. The capitalist through the education system (http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/) have succeded in erasing class consciousness and instilling the phallacy of the "American Dream." This dream consists of being a good little non thinking drone while chasing the allure of wealth and status. Since most of us don't have the means to achieve this wealth and status by birth right or entrepeneural acumen, the capitalists provide an easy (or EZ) way to reach this "dream." It's called credit. With credit we can get the big house, the big truck, SUVs, boats and all the material trappings that bring about status. Of course now we are indebted, and to be indebted is to be a slave of the one that holds your debt. Now the working class has been effectively neutralized as a force to be reconed with,yet we continue fat dumb, and happy in our arrogance.; the biggest slave is the one who thinks he is free.
The truth is that capitalism produces wealth for the select few, the illusion of wealth for the working class and misery for the rest.
Many of these working class Republicans vote the way they do because the Republican party has succesfully sold them a bill of goods; the Republican party makes itself out to be the party of "family values," the pro life party, the party of God. Perhaps these voters should open up their King James Bible to Timothy 6 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

 

[Mechanic]

Anti American? Hardly. Unless you consider Free Speech, Freedom of religion and Democracy Anti American.



Show me where in the Constitution is dictates that we are a Capitalist nation? The fact is the founding fathers were very distrustful of "limited liability corporations" and the concentrated power of combined Capital. Corporations had to request permission to exist, state their reason for being and define how long they would be needed. They were not allowed to own other corporations. Granted such limitations would be unrealistic in the modern world but dont claim that what we have today is what the founding fathers had in mind or that capitalism has anything whatsoever to do with Democracy or Freedom. Capitalism thrives just as well under a dictatorship as it does in a Democracy.


Do you feel that foreign interests should be able to contol what you hear off our public airways?
Look at recent Supreme Court rulings that allow Corporations unlimited control over our political process. That doesnt alarm you? Not only do they control what you hear but they can donate as much money as they want to any politician they want. Do you think its right that entities that have and should have no right to cast a vote can in reality have more of a say in our political process with their cash and control over the media than you or I have with our vote?

Yea,the Communist party and Socialists will probably be there, they always show up at anything having to do with workers but violent thugs of the Seiu? Where's that coming from? Corporate America kills hundreds of workers every year, if anyone can be accused of violence its them. Code Pink, an antiwar group, well I'd never heard of them before, didnt read anything about protests at funerals but did read that parents of dead soldiers were part of the Group, I guess that despite their loss you are a better American in your eyes than they are. I supose you think they should just suck it up and keep their mouths shut. They had a distasteful vigil outside of Walter Reed but they claim that the people who set up the coffins and stuff weren't part of their group.

This is a Union led gathering and if you sell your labor as a means to support your family this gathering is to support your economic interests, if you are more concerned about and agreeable to the political manipulation God, Guns and Gays you should do us a favor and go into management, that is if you arent already.

The sad thing is many workers think they are Capitalists . If you live off managing and investing your Capital , letting it earn your income then you could call yourself a Capitalist, if you live by selling your labor to someone else you are a worker. While many do a little of both how many exist primarily of the earnings of their earnings vs the earnings of the labor?

 

[Mechanic]

First you say "show me in the Constitution where we are a capitalist nation". Thats not even what the Constitution is all about. You should read it sometime. This country was born and grew over the years by ideas, action, innovation and hard work by the Mother called Capitalism. The very fact you even have a job at this company is the result of Capitalism. You say "Capitalism thrives just as well under a dictatorship as it does in a Democracy". I had to read that several times to be sure you really said that.

Here is the definition from Wikipedia:Capitalism, also called free market economy, or free enterprise economy, is an economic system in which the means of production and distribution and industry are privately owned and operated for a private profit; decisions regarding supply, demand, price, distribution, and investments are made by private actors in the market rather than by central planning by the government; profit is distributed to owners who invest in businesses, and wages are paid to workers employed by businesses.

You justify standing with Communist and Socialist as free speech? Please. Do you have 1 value driven bone in you body? Check out YouTube for things on SEIU and Code Pink.. Do some research.

A union led gathering? Key note speaker Ed Shultz? Polls show 12% of people trust MSNBC for news reporting. 12%. Thats the Key note speaker? Why not have SEIU Leader Andy Stern. Advocate of Income Redistribution and a believer in the Communist Manifesto and has been to the White House more than any other visitor. Thats a real union leader you can believe in.

People spending above there means and getting in over their head is not the result of Capitalism. Those people deserve what they get. They should be held responsible for all debt. We only learn by being held accountable for our actions. Life's best teacher.

I'm a conservative. I believe in smaller government, lower taxes, Capitalism and free markets. Were clearly not in the same boat. The enemy is our current progressive socialist marxist administration and the congressional lap dogs that for some unknown reason will follow this guy to the gates of hell. I'm sure were not in the same boat on this either.

No more on this. This is not the forum for politics. I'll continue my fight and you continue yours. Just be an informed fighter.

Peace

 

[Bob Owens]

First you say "show me in the Constitution where we are a capitalist nation". Thats not even what the Constitution is all about. You should read it sometime. This country was born and grew over the years by ideas, action, innovation and hard work by the Mother called Capitalism. The very fact you even have a job at this company is the result of Capitalism. You say "Capitalism thrives just as well under a dictatorship as it does in a Democracy". I had to read that several times to be sure you really said that.

The Constitution is our guiding document, I've read it, are you sure you have?

Here is the definition from Wikipedia:Capitalism, also called free market economy, or free enterprise economy, is an economic system in which the means of production and distribution and industry are privately owned and operated for a private profit; decisions regarding supply, demand, price, distribution, and investments are made by private actors in the market rather than by central planning by the government; profit is distributed to owners who invest in businesses, and wages are paid to workers employed by businesses.

I guess that too many years of relying on FOX news has cut your attention span down to one paragraph, here's what followed in Wiki: There is no consensus on the precise definition of capitalism, nor how the term should be used as an analytical category.[1] There is, however, little controversy that private ownership of the means of production, creation of goods or services for profit in a market, and prices and wages are elements of capitalism.

Definition of CAPITALIST
1: a person who has capital especially invested in business; broadly : a person of wealth : plutocrat
2: a person who favors capitalism

Plutocrat; (American Standard Dict)1 A member of a governing wealthy class
2 Someone having political influence or control because of wealth.

work·er [ wúrkər ] (plural work·ers)
noun

Definition:

1. person or thing that works: a person, animal, or device that is engaged in or used for a task of some kind


2. employee: an employee of a person, company, or organization


3. member of working class: a member of the working class, especially a factory employee or manual laborer

Working Class; (answers.com)The class of people who are employed for wages, especially as manual workers. Narrower than Marx's proletariat, comprising those who have nothing to sell except their labour power, because that describes almost everybody in a modern industrial society. In ordinary use the term denotes a Weberian status-group rather than a Marxian class. To be working-class is to have some badge(s) of status such as wearing heavy protective clothes at work, being subject to tight discipline on attendance such as having to clock in and out of work at fixed times, and working in a heavily unionized occupation. The criteria are vague and it is not clear how they are to be fitted to those not actually in work; nevertheless almost everybody uses and has subjective understanding of the term.


So tell me which definition fits your situation better? Capitalist or worker? Are you a person of Wealth? Do you have political power because of your wealth or, do you work for an hourly wage and badge in and out to support your family? I guess you could call yourself a Working Class Capitalist, someone who works for a living but supports Capitalism despite the fact he has little Capital. They had their gatherings a few weeks ago.
Here in NY we call that a 'Wannabe".

A union led gathering? Key note speaker Ed Shultz? Polls show 12% of people trust MSNBC for news reporting. 12%. Thats the Key note speaker? Why not have SEIU Leader Andy Stern. Advocate of Income Redistribution and a believer in the Communist Manifesto and has been to the White House more than any other visitor. Thats a real union leader you can believe in

.

Stern hasnt been the leader of the Seiu since April. What was that about being informed? Polls? Polls conducted by whom a Ruppert Murdoch subsidiary? Did they do the poll on Fox News?

 

[Vortilon]

Funny how you have these working class stiffs voting Republican and considering themselves Capitalist; particularly here in Texas. These same people decry the evils of socialism and praise the virtues of capitalism while they have to work two jobs to make ends meet, watch their wages decrease, their pensions disappear and their medical costs soar through the roof. While capitalists destroy the industrial might of this nation, and send jobs to China (good Communists), these working class Republicans parrot the line of their masters and blame the unions, malign the likes of Hugo Chavez(bad Socialist) when he takes over a golf course to build public housing, and denounce the Greeks when they demonstrate on the streets agains IMF sanctioned austerity programs. Voting democrat won't help the working class either; since both parties are controlled by the same corporate interests and the banks that own them.
Why do these people act the way they do? Because they have lost their class consciousness. This is not a new phenomena. Jack London complained about it in War of the Classes way back in 1905. The capitalist through the education system (http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/) have succeded in erasing class consciousness and instilling the phallacy of the "American Dream." This dream consists of being a good little non thinking drone while chasing the allure of wealth and status. Since most of us don't have the means to achieve this wealth and status by birth right or entrepeneural acumen, the capitalists provide an easy (or EZ) way to reach this "dream." It's called credit. With credit we can get the big house, the big truck, SUVs, boats and all the material trappings that bring about status. Of course now we are indebted, and to be indebted is to be a slave of the one that holds your debt. Now the working class has been effectively neutralized as a force to be reconed with,yet we continue fat dumb, and happy in our arrogance.; the biggest slave is the one who thinks he is free.
The truth is that capitalism produces wealth for the select few, the illusion of wealth for the working class and misery for the rest.
Many of these working class Republicans vote the way they do because the Republican party has succesfully sold them a bill of goods; the Republican party makes itself out to be the party of "family values," the pro life party, the party of God. Perhaps these voters should open up their King James Bible to Timothy 6 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

I bet you're a real hit in the break room trying to convince your co-workers of the virtues of communism.
😛h34r:

 

[xmarlin]

No more on this. This is not the forum for politics. I'll continue my fight and you continue yours. Just be an informed fighter.

Peace

Didn't you start this thread?

Just sayin"

 

[Ed Norton]

I bet you're a real hit in the break room trying to convince your co-workers of the virtues of communism.
😛h34r:

I don't bother, my co-workers are more concerned with the mass opiate of foot bawl than engaging in any kind of exchange of thought and ideas; which is how the ruling class establishment wants us. I doubt you know what communism is or that in reality we live in a corporocracy, which is another way of saying fascism.

 

[Ed Norton]

Mechanic lives in a dream world. In his dream world, Dick Chaney lets him in through the front door and not the service entrance; though Mechanic toils with his hands, Dick greets him warmly. In his world he brunches with Dick ; they discuss the evils of socialized health care, unionism and how we need to bomb some third world country which resists our imperialist aggressions. The dream continues as Mechanic goes on a hunting trip with the afore mentioned Dick and manages not to get his rump full of bird shot.
But alas, the alarm clock comes alive with the shrill voice of the conservative talk show host dujour ! Mechanic has to wake up to the fact that he is, well... a Mechanic, a working class stiff, a Joe Six Pack (as Rush likes to put it). Mechanic has to put aside the dreams of mint juleps with Dick and reach for a cup of Maxwell House premium blend. Mechanic reminds himself that he wont see his family today, nor the next day either. After all, Mechanic is not a child of priviledge and has to work doubles in order to have an extra day off and be able to run his pool business, dabble in home rehab or work his second job.
In Mechanics dream world, the U.S was not build on the backs of cheap labor in the form indentured servitude, chatel slavery and meager wage slavery, it " was born and grew over the years by ideas, action, innovation and hard work by the Mother called Capitalism.' Of course nothing has changed. Today we have an invasion of the invaded swarming through the southern U.S. border. They are welcomed with open arms by the capitalist, who is ever hungry for new humanity to exploit. The mother of innovation is nessecity, not capitalism. There were no capitaists when fire was discovered or the wheel invented. The innovations mechanic refers to are labor saving devices. These devices reduce the ammount of labor required for production thus incresing the profit margin of the capitalist. Profit is the sole reason for the exploitaion of labor. In Mechanics dream world, the capitalist hires workers out of the goodness of his heart and a feeling of social obligation to the community. All that was in the day of industrial capitaism. Today we have financial capitalism. Financial capitalism produces nothing. It puts value to worthless paper and trades it in the rigged stock market, where the true insiders make billions from the suckers who invest in this legalized con game.
Everywhere the "free market" has reared its ugly head, it has to be implemented by slight of hand or blatant use of force. Europe was rebuilt from the ashes of WW2 through the socialist/Kensian policies of the Marshall Plan, not the "free market." Today the EU wants to implement "free market" reforms and austerity programs and is met by resistance. Most people in the world knows that "free market" means the elimination of public pensions, the privatization of state owned utilities and natural resources. This "free market" only favors a select few. That is why China is the sweat shop to the world. Its "free market" is firmly in place and maintained by the power of the ....gasp!...the Communist Chinese Government!
In Mexico, this "free market" is embraced by the U.S. proppedd ruling oligarchy. Mexico also boast the richest man in the world while the majority live in abject poverty.Many displaced malcontents are forced flee to "el norte" where they can slave away in order to send money back to their families. Next to oil, remitances are the highest cash influx into the Mexican economy.
Karl Marx called for a revolution of the proletariat. The proletariat would control the means of production. A dictatorship of the proletariat (like Platos dictatorship of philosophers in "The Republic"), would ensue. Once disparity is eliminated, there will be no need for a central government. You want limited government? Well there it is. Contrast this with the current inhabitant of the White House who has bailed out the bankers with billions of public money. This is socialism for the capitalist. Privatized gains socialized losses. I laugh when he is called a Marxist by Beck, Hannity etal. When was the last time Obama called for the workers of the world to unite and to remind them that they have nothing to lose but their chains?

 

[Tex-Mech]

Ed,

Great post but I doubt the Fox news educated folks will figure it out here in Texas. Hard to believe that we have unionized working class stiffs preaching the corporate gods word. Just goes to show how well the corporate gods have succeeded in dumbing down the workerbees.

 

[eolesen]

Even harder to believe that you working class stiffs continue to be bamboozled and hoodwinked by the Democratic platform.

Unions overwhelmingly support Dems, yet Dems are on the forefront of preserving the current lack of border enforcement, demonizing the AZ stance on illegal immigration, and want to push for things like immunity and/or fast-tracking of citizenship for illegals.

I'm sure the Dems see it as increasing their voting base and power. Yet it's the illegals who are also driving down wages and setting up those non-union shops stealing all the union work. Just ask anyone in a trade who works in Arizona. I lived there. I saw it firsthand.