Stop Blaming Us Air Pilots

[phasersonstun2]

I would like to post a few words about the state of our pilot group (US Airways), the airline industry and the whining posts from the "healthy" non-low fare carrier pilots.

First of all, we are not supposed to be flying. US Airways, an amalgamation of several carriers was nearly dead in 1994. We as a pilot group helped the company through an impossible time. In 1998, the pilots were asked to sign a "parity plus 1%" deal thast would bring up to 400 Airbuses on the property. We were harassed by our fellow employees during the negotiations to sign the deal. We did and the airline had several consecutive quarters of record profits. In short, every time the airline needed us, we were there.

Today, we are at the point of no return.

Don't expect the US Airways pilot group to be the sacrificial lamb and hold the hard line for everybody else. We don't have that kind of leverage and never did. If we survive, it will again be because the pilots did what we had to do. In the end, we will all be low fare carriers or guests of those airline reunion parties.


Phaser

 

[tim]

Don't expect the US Airways pilot group to be the sacrificial lamb and hold the hard line for everybody else.

Don't worry; there is ABSOLUETY no danger of this!! :down: :angry:

 

[robbedagain]

all i have to say is at least the pilots arent working for 13.00 an hr like a large group of employees like me are in cities such as pwm, srq, avp, avp, dtw, cle, abe, etc etc... the pilots can afford new cars and houses where us employees in the above mentioned cities are on GOVT APPROVED Food Stamps! and Welfare

 

[sdavis29]

all i have to say is at least the pilots arent working for 13.00 an hr like a large group of employees like me are in cities such as pwm, srq, avp, avp, dtw, cle, abe, etc etc... the pilots can afford new cars and houses where us employees in the above mentioned cities are on GOVT APPROVED Food Stamps! and Welfare

yo robbed...time out....
pilots are highly trained and without a doubt should be on the top of the fee scale.

next you have mtc...they are also highly trained and should be compensated accordingly. of course they could definetly streamline mtc, but you still need mtc .

now the rest of us.(union emp excluding dispatch)..all unskilled...

while you may be down to 13.00, try life on the outside...you could be in a lot worse shape...

 

[robbedagain]

here is one for you--how about have paid an attorney fee of 1000.00 for a full child custody which was granted to me (for my 19 month son) and his mother doesnt even want anything to do with him then helping to support my mom and sister and there is hardly any other job out there. the least our union could have done and failed to act on it was to get a top pay of at least 16 or 17 like the commuters of continental comair united express but no they sold us down the river and failed to give us the life jackets with it! the pilots may be highly skilled but we are the slaves at 13.00 an hr to load one airbus jet and a lot of commuters.
the union could have and should have done us a lot better and instead gave in to mgmt as usual!

 

[USA320Pilot]

Phaser:

Phaser said: "In the end, we will all be low fare carriers or guests of those airline reunion parties."

USA320Pilot comments: Unfortunately, I agree with you. The market will dictate what happens and either legacy carriers obtain a competitive cost structure or they will fail -- it's really plain and simple. Do I like it? Nope, but it's reality, just like it was for the railroad and steel industry workers.

Respectfully,

USA320Pilot

 

[WOJetDreamer]

all i have to say is at least the pilots arent working for 13.00 an hr like a large group of employees like me are in cities such as pwm, srq, avp, avp, dtw, cle, abe, etc etc... the pilots can afford new cars and houses where us employees in the above mentioned cities are on GOVT APPROVED Food Stamps! and Welfare

Pilots are highly skilled and trained and so are MX guys/gals. I am 27 years old, Have a BS degree in Aerospace from a top University. I have some great experience and have gained some great knowledge (to be 27) flying some very powerful and important people around in high performance jet aircraft with my past employers. And what do I get to show for it. A W2 form for the year 2003 saying I made $21,000.

Now lets see. $13.00/hr x 8 hrs/day=$104.00/day
$104.00/day x 5 day/wk= $520.00/wk
$520.00/wk x 56wk/year= $29,120/year estimated
+ you are home EVER FREAKIN EVENING WITH YOUR FAMILY

Now I will not assume you have no education but most folks out on the ground dont, and while I am at it, neither do most of these stuck up flight attendants and gate agents that look at me like I am a piece of crap because my badge says EXPRESS AND I FLY LITTLE PLANES. Well be careful what you think, I have done your job. In corporate avaition the pilots are the FAs, Baggage Handlers, Customer Service Rep, the Dispatch and flight planner, the CLEANING CREW and even fueled AC at the airport to pay my way through college. So I guess I am not worthy uh? I started flying when I was 16 so I consider myself of having 11 years of experience. And what do I get???????????

$21,000/year and a nice hotel room 200+ nights a year.

Do I think pilots are over paid? Very few I can not see pilots making $250+k/year. But 95% are under paid.

I have gotten off on a rampage, I better quit.

 

[BoeingBoy]

WOJetDreamer,

Nice rant - feels good to get it off your chest, doesn't it?

Back in the "olden days", I'd often sit in my 727 and watch some poor commuter (ok, the real olden days) pilot and think that if we were paid for how hard we worked I would be trading salaries with him.

In a fair world we would be paid for our efforts and what we contribute to society. Teachers, firemen, policemen, and the like would make what pro sports stars make, and those sports stars would be playing ball on their off time from their day job. Alas, the world isn't fair.

Jim

ps - a year only has 52 weeks.

 

[AOG-N-IT]

WOJetDreamer,

Nice rant - feels good to get it off your chest, doesn't it?

Back in the "olden days", I'd often sit in my 727 and watch some poor commuter (ok, the real olden days) pilot and think that if we were paid for how hard we worked I would be trading salaries with him.

In a fair world we would be paid for our efforts and what we contribute to society. Teachers, firemen, policemen, and the like would make what pro sports stars make, and those sports stars would be playing ball on their off time from their day job. Alas, the world isn't fair.

Jim

ps - a year only has 52 weeks.

Jim,

Gotta agree with you on that , I thought the same thing when I was at express..after shelving a better paying job in the automotive industry , just to be back in aviaton (Boy what a mistake in hindsight) LOL :huh:

I feel like society has lost its collective mind. Teachers , Firemen , Policemen and even to a degree Medical Doctors (due to insurance issues) don't get a fair shake Vs. what they contribute to society ..but let a near idiot with a degree in "Underwater Basket Weaving" who can barely speak a complete and understandable sentence dunk a basketball or run for 100 yards a game (operative word "Game")..and people are tripping all over themselves to heap fame and rewards upon them.

I have to conclude that how we as people and a society place value on things is way way off in practical terms.

Pardon me for not wasting my paultry earnings on season tickets for anything..TV will do just fine...and I won't support them by buying the products they promote and endorse on TV either

 

[28yearsnojob]

Robbedagain you are right these pilots should have agreed 6 years ago to fly RJ and u would have never been in this situtation.I lost everthing because of the greed at the top.I lost job to fund there pension only to have it taken away
from them months later under bankrupcy. They will get no brake from me .As far
as i concerned I hope Bonner make them double for their wages.

 

[linemech]

I would like to post a few words about the state of our pilot group (US Airways), the airline industry and the whining posts from the "healthy" non-low fare carrier pilots.

First of all, we are not supposed to be flying. US Airways, an amalgamation of several carriers was nearly dead in 1994. We as a pilot group helped the company through an impossible time. In 1998, the pilots were asked to sign a "parity plus 1%" deal thast would bring up to 400 Airbuses on the property. We were harassed by our fellow employees during the negotiations to sign the deal. We did and the airline had several consecutive quarters of record profits. In short, every time the airline needed us, we were there.

Today, we are at the point of no return.

Don't expect the US Airways pilot group to be the sacrificial lamb and hold the hard line for everybody else. We don't have that kind of leverage and never did. If we survive, it will again be because the pilots did what we had to do. In the end, we will all be low fare carriers or guests of those airline reunion parties.


Phaser

Oh Thank you, Thank you ever so much for saving all the employees at "U".

I can't remember any other employees who gave anything to help save the airline
except the pilots.

I can't remember Parity plus one being something that the pilot group profited from.

I can't remember how the pilots turned a deaf ear to management on the initial RJ issue when management was begging for relief.

But if I try real hard I can remember how the pilots stayed home in OCT. of 92 and got paid to do so, while the airline was losing money.

I can remember how every time the airline needs you, you are there.
(Because your never working)

If it only takes the pilot group to save the airline, then why has Dave gone after so much from ALL employee groups ?

It seems to me that the pilots got us into this mess (being the leaders and all)
and maybe it is only just that they lead us back from the point of no return.

I would like to think that all pilots aren't as narrow minded as you appear to be.
And you should hope that every other employee at your airline is not as narrow minded as i APPEAR to be.


Linemech.

 

[bluetoad]

Piney,
I went to the union meetings and sat there until something important came up and then they adjorned to the back room to deliberate in secrecy where they ultimately sold me and the rest of the pilots down the river. Have not seen any change in their operating mode. So when you ask did we go to the meetings? You should ask, where we allowed to participate in the meetings? The answer to that question is no. I have never perceived any value in being part of ALPA except for my magizine subscription. ALPA's legacy will be the trail of unemployed / under employed pilots it leaves behind. This will be ALPA's ultimate demise.

 

[WOJetDreamer]

I will agree with some of your argument. I think the guys at the top (usually the ones at the table making and cutting deals) has a different mind set when it comes to their jobs. You are right, the U pilot group should have taken care of the RJ thing along time ago along with the rest of the industry. Would it have saved U from what is happening today?? NO, I certainly do not think so. Do I think there are STILL being bad decisions being made when it comes to the company and the unions? YES. It is happening at Mainline and Express. The top guys (yep, the ones going to the table) are making deals for themselves and for the short term which will benefit them the most since they will be gone in just a few years. Leave it up to the ones behind us to clean up the mess and make there own deal. Just as long as they can make it to retirement with some big money then they are happy. I mean you can see it as we speak.

For example: I work for a U WO. When our negotiation team went in to negotiate pay rates for the RJs they went in only thinking of themselves. When all was said and DONE WITHOUT PILOT RATIFICATION!!!!!!! Senior Capt. get a $15-$20/hr raise once on the RJ, while the Junior FOs would get $0.50-$1.00/hr raise once on the RJ. Now I dont understand that and if someone has a reasonable explanation then I am willing to listen.

And as someone has already pointed out,,,,Its not just the pilot group that will save the company. It is everyone!!!!!!!

 

[Hope777]

WOJetDreamer, you make me laugh. Please tell me again how educated you are? Only saying this becuase last time I checked, there are only * 52 * weeks in a year.....not 56. Very surprised no one else caught this.

 

[Colby]

Jim

ps - a year only has 52 weeks.

HOPE...... Someone did catch it !!!!!!!!!!!