Yeah, LavMan, and look how great AA pilots next contract was, they really fought that one hard. (Sarcasm intended)
US Air pilots turn on management
- Thread starter USA320Pilot
- Start date
To all the nay sayers, things may look rough now, but I say to you this. The union movement exists today because of the rich taking advantage of the poor. This is only the start of the new begining. At some point, you will have a group of people that will have been pushed far enough and then will decide to push back. This country can be shut down because of these people many of you poke fun of. At some point their will be a stance that clearly states you cant jail everyone! It may not be this year or even in the next 5 but the internal emotion is surly building and will one day reach a boiling point again.
All I have to say...don''t these people have anything better to do with their time. Sure they hate management...what is new. That is part of being in a union - you are brain washed to hate management...even if you were better off before they union, they were holding you back. Today''s unions are nothing but scared. They are losing revenue due to the decrease in union jobs available. 90% of the workers in this country have no problem being non-union...yet the other 10% will thump their chest until they are pushing up daisies.
Yes things are changing every day. US Airways has gone from being an airline that should be dead, to one that has a future again. Unfortunately a minority of the companies employees don''t like tha future because it takes US Airways back to its roots - of a local, regional airline flying small planes. There is no reason why Dave & Co. should be booted out now. They are reorganizing the company successfully - this far...unfortunately it has taken a serious toll on the pocket books of many. Had this airline found a way to adapt to the PSA way of doing business, things may have been a lot different...however now the company has nothing but a bunch of severely senoir bitter people. The good news is...they''ll all be retired in the next 5-10 years. The bad news...the airline may be gone by then.
This vote of no confidence is purely union propaganda...and means very little to other people. The Express guys know they are getting RJs, finally...and are ready to kick some butt for a change. The majority of other people are glad the bankruptcy cloud has cleared and they still have a job. Best of all...the majority of furloughed employees know that with the new 60-100 RJs that will come on the property by the end of 2004, they''ll soon have work once again - less pay, but it is better than sitting at home worrying about making the house payment.
The union elite are doing nothing but trying to retain their positions and in control of the union. They are also in the position to where they are bringing in less money from dues and that is really cramping their style.
The only issue I have with this is with a similar experience at my last job a few years ago. I had lost complete faith in my boss and the higher ups - as the Time Warner scum slowly took over. Did I go around to all my co-workers to get a vote saying we don''t believe in them? Nope. I simply made up my mind the company isn''t going in the direction I would like it to go and walked out. I''ve since found greener pastures running my own company and have had the joys over the last few months of being able to bring on more and more people to work. I will especially feel good about brining another 250 jobs to my community over the next 18 months. 250 jobs that are needed because the unions have failed to protect their own in this heavily unionized city. I''ve seen one union, the UFCW, go off attacking new comers like Wal Mart of Giant Eagle (non union shops) only to forget about other store they represent and the people that worked there....so far their union has lost nearly 1000 members this year alone, yet they continue to run ads 5 times per day on 5 radio stations at $75-140 a pop to try and pursuade people from going to the other stores. Yet the employees don''t mind since they are getting paid more and have better benefits than at the union shops - go figure.
Yes things are changing every day. US Airways has gone from being an airline that should be dead, to one that has a future again. Unfortunately a minority of the companies employees don''t like tha future because it takes US Airways back to its roots - of a local, regional airline flying small planes. There is no reason why Dave & Co. should be booted out now. They are reorganizing the company successfully - this far...unfortunately it has taken a serious toll on the pocket books of many. Had this airline found a way to adapt to the PSA way of doing business, things may have been a lot different...however now the company has nothing but a bunch of severely senoir bitter people. The good news is...they''ll all be retired in the next 5-10 years. The bad news...the airline may be gone by then.
This vote of no confidence is purely union propaganda...and means very little to other people. The Express guys know they are getting RJs, finally...and are ready to kick some butt for a change. The majority of other people are glad the bankruptcy cloud has cleared and they still have a job. Best of all...the majority of furloughed employees know that with the new 60-100 RJs that will come on the property by the end of 2004, they''ll soon have work once again - less pay, but it is better than sitting at home worrying about making the house payment.
The union elite are doing nothing but trying to retain their positions and in control of the union. They are also in the position to where they are bringing in less money from dues and that is really cramping their style.
The only issue I have with this is with a similar experience at my last job a few years ago. I had lost complete faith in my boss and the higher ups - as the Time Warner scum slowly took over. Did I go around to all my co-workers to get a vote saying we don''t believe in them? Nope. I simply made up my mind the company isn''t going in the direction I would like it to go and walked out. I''ve since found greener pastures running my own company and have had the joys over the last few months of being able to bring on more and more people to work. I will especially feel good about brining another 250 jobs to my community over the next 18 months. 250 jobs that are needed because the unions have failed to protect their own in this heavily unionized city. I''ve seen one union, the UFCW, go off attacking new comers like Wal Mart of Giant Eagle (non union shops) only to forget about other store they represent and the people that worked there....so far their union has lost nearly 1000 members this year alone, yet they continue to run ads 5 times per day on 5 radio stations at $75-140 a pop to try and pursuade people from going to the other stores. Yet the employees don''t mind since they are getting paid more and have better benefits than at the union shops - go figure.
oldiebutgoody
Veteran
I don't agree with you, dfw. The unions here employ MANY capable, well educated and experienced people. People that have worked in this industry a long time. They see this "scheme" of management to rape the employees and other stakeholders while doing little or nothing for revenue in exactly the right light. Dave has NEVER run a successful airline, and his only real claim to fame is introducing RJs at Continental Express. He considers it so successful that he intends to do the same here, making U the east coast regional carrier for UAL. That is how it appears to me, and unless you have evidence otherwise it probably appears that way for most people. All the Daves did in chapter 11 was 1) Wipe out all shareholder equity, so that everyone invested in U lost it all, retirement plans, individuals, employees, anybody who owned the stock. Then, he FORCED leased holders to accept far less for the planes that U had agreed earlier to acquire, parking many in the desert. This deprived leasing companies and their investors of loads of cash. Simultaneously he "robbed" the employees of pay, something else this company agreed in good faith to provide, followed shortly thereafter by dumping the entire pilot retirement plan on the government with assurances that management would conitnue to pursue a legislated deal through congress that would allow refunding. It obvious now that it was just another lie, and Dave doesn't intend to do anyhing to help restore the pension. Then at 20 minutes before exiting chapter 11, he drops the bombshell on PIT, voiding all the airport leases, leases on facilities that the state and county built for U at U's request. These guys are all outrageous liars, and all that they have proven is that they have perfected the art of the holdup, but there is NO evidence at all that they can run an airline. In fact, from what I've seen and heard, I have serious doubts about their competence. That's what the "no confidence" vote was about.
PITbull
Veteran
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On 5/24/2003 1:46:21 PM Twicebaked wrote:
On 5/24/2003 1:46:21 PM Twicebaked wrote:
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On 5/24/2003 12
42 PM N628AU wrote:
Have fun ALPA. By the time this works through any grievance/legal proceeding, those jets will be online and furloughed employees working them. I wonder what the ALPA response will be when the judge asks what is the problem when half of the seats are occupied by U ALPA members?
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That may be true that things may already be going through once the grienvences are completed, but someone has to put a stop to this "hitler" type managment. I hope that all labor groups realize that this company does not only consist of flight attendants and pilots. Are we the only one''s that are fed up? I wouldn''t think so.
EVERYONE NEEDS TO DO INFORMATIONAL PICKETING. WE HAVE BEEN RAPED FOR THE LAST TIME FROM THIS MANAGMENT.
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AFA PIT local 40 and Local 70 PHL will be picketing and leafleting on June 5. For PIT, we will be on the ticketing level in two areas designated for our group. Also, June 12...and all summer long. On 5/24/2003 12
42 PM N628AU wrote: Have fun ALPA. By the time this works through any grievance/legal proceeding, those jets will be online and furloughed employees working them. I wonder what the ALPA response will be when the judge asks what is the problem when half of the seats are occupied by U ALPA members?
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That may be true that things may already be going through once the grienvences are completed, but someone has to put a stop to this "hitler" type managment. I hope that all labor groups realize that this company does not only consist of flight attendants and pilots. Are we the only one''s that are fed up? I wouldn''t think so.
EVERYONE NEEDS TO DO INFORMATIONAL PICKETING. WE HAVE BEEN RAPED FOR THE LAST TIME FROM THIS MANAGMENT.
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PITbull
Veteran
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On 5/25/2003 10:44:35 PM dfw79 wrote:
All I have to say...don't these people have anything better to do with their time. Sure they hate management...what is new. That is part of being in a union - you are brain washed to hate management...even if you were better off before they union, they were holding you back. Today's unions are nothing but scared. They are losing revenue due to the decrease in union jobs available. 90% of the workers in this country have no problem being non-union...yet the other 10% will thump their chest until they are pushing up daisies.
Yes things are changing every day. US Airways has gone from being an airline that should be dead, to one that has a future again. Unfortunately a minority of the companies employees don't like tha future because it takes US Airways back to its roots - of a local, regional airline flying small planes. There is no reason why Dave & Co. should be booted out now. They are reorganizing the company successfully - this far...unfortunately it has taken a serious toll on the pocket books of many. Had this airline found a way to adapt to the PSA way of doing business, things may have been a lot different...however now the company has nothing but a bunch of severely senoir bitter people. The good news is...they'll all be retired in the next 5-10 years. The bad news...the airline may be gone by then.
This vote of no confidence is purely union propaganda...and means very little to other people. The Express guys know they are getting RJs, finally...and are ready to kick some butt for a change. The majority of other people are glad the bankruptcy cloud has cleared and they still have a job. Best of all...the majority of furloughed employees know that with the new 60-100 RJs that will come on the property by the end of 2004, they'll soon have work once again - less pay, but it is better than sitting at home worrying about making the house payment.
The union elite are doing nothing but trying to retain their positions and in control of the union. They are also in the position to where they are bringing in less money from dues and that is really cramping their style.
The only issue I have with this is with a similar experience at my last job a few years ago. I had lost complete faith in my boss and the higher ups - as the Time Warner scum slowly took over. Did I go around to all my co-workers to get a vote saying we don't believe in them? Nope. I simply made up my mind the company isn't going in the direction I would like it to go and walked out. I've since found greener pastures running my own company and have had the joys over the last few months of being able to bring on more and more people to work. I will especially feel good about brining another 250 jobs to my community over the next 18 months. 250 jobs that are needed because the unions have failed to protect their own in this heavily unionized city. I've seen one union, the UFCW, go off attacking new comers like Wal Mart of Giant Eagle (non union shops) only to forget about other store they represent and the people that worked there....so far their union has lost nearly 1000 members this year alone, yet they continue to run ads 5 times per day on 5 radio stations at $75-140 a pop to try and pursuade people from going to the other stores. Yet the employees don't mind since they are getting paid more and have better benefits than at the union shops - go figure.
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dfw79,On 5/25/2003 10:44:35 PM dfw79 wrote:
All I have to say...don't these people have anything better to do with their time. Sure they hate management...what is new. That is part of being in a union - you are brain washed to hate management...even if you were better off before they union, they were holding you back. Today's unions are nothing but scared. They are losing revenue due to the decrease in union jobs available. 90% of the workers in this country have no problem being non-union...yet the other 10% will thump their chest until they are pushing up daisies.
Yes things are changing every day. US Airways has gone from being an airline that should be dead, to one that has a future again. Unfortunately a minority of the companies employees don't like tha future because it takes US Airways back to its roots - of a local, regional airline flying small planes. There is no reason why Dave & Co. should be booted out now. They are reorganizing the company successfully - this far...unfortunately it has taken a serious toll on the pocket books of many. Had this airline found a way to adapt to the PSA way of doing business, things may have been a lot different...however now the company has nothing but a bunch of severely senoir bitter people. The good news is...they'll all be retired in the next 5-10 years. The bad news...the airline may be gone by then.
This vote of no confidence is purely union propaganda...and means very little to other people. The Express guys know they are getting RJs, finally...and are ready to kick some butt for a change. The majority of other people are glad the bankruptcy cloud has cleared and they still have a job. Best of all...the majority of furloughed employees know that with the new 60-100 RJs that will come on the property by the end of 2004, they'll soon have work once again - less pay, but it is better than sitting at home worrying about making the house payment.
The union elite are doing nothing but trying to retain their positions and in control of the union. They are also in the position to where they are bringing in less money from dues and that is really cramping their style.
The only issue I have with this is with a similar experience at my last job a few years ago. I had lost complete faith in my boss and the higher ups - as the Time Warner scum slowly took over. Did I go around to all my co-workers to get a vote saying we don't believe in them? Nope. I simply made up my mind the company isn't going in the direction I would like it to go and walked out. I've since found greener pastures running my own company and have had the joys over the last few months of being able to bring on more and more people to work. I will especially feel good about brining another 250 jobs to my community over the next 18 months. 250 jobs that are needed because the unions have failed to protect their own in this heavily unionized city. I've seen one union, the UFCW, go off attacking new comers like Wal Mart of Giant Eagle (non union shops) only to forget about other store they represent and the people that worked there....so far their union has lost nearly 1000 members this year alone, yet they continue to run ads 5 times per day on 5 radio stations at $75-140 a pop to try and pursuade people from going to the other stores. Yet the employees don't mind since they are getting paid more and have better benefits than at the union shops - go figure.
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I am not sure you are aware of this or not, but union leaders can not get more money than what they can earn out on the front line, e.g., a union local president or MEC president can not make higher wages or earn more than what their senority can hold. You get no more money by being a union rep here at U. I don't know how the AFL-CIO leaders are paid and our International is salaired and they take cuts accordingly, which ours has done...to the tune of 10%.
When you state,  "vote of no confidence" is nothing but union propaganda. Who do you think the union is? Let me tell you what the union is NOT; the union is not about union leadership...it is about union members. THEY DICTATE... .and they are the driving forces. If they are not, the union members need to get rid of the leadership.
You may believe the best answer to folks who don't like what is happening to them in the work place should just up and leave to better pastures, but most of us here at U believe we are the company, why would we leave? Management is but a small part of the whold and they are just visiting.
