Strike vote
- Thread starter luv2fly
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Yipee. Time to see how the pilots feel about the rest of their co-workers. IOW, a "yes" strike vote tells me that they couldn't give a hoot about the other employees that have given so much (not talking financially here) to support them and the company. I hope to see a "no" vote if for nothing else but to say that the pilots actually care whether or not they put all of us out of work. There's much more at stake than just the pilot's personal lifestyle funding. There's the livlihood of tens of thousands of people. I hope that cooler heads (mgmt AND pilots) prevail and a rational agreement can be had.
BTW- why would the pilots choose to allow mediation but plan on striking if mediation doesn't go their way? Doesn't sound like a mediation to me.
luv2fly
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Because, if you understood the agreement, it is not binding arbitration. Both parties agreed to an LOA that would allow for more time to reach a negotiated settlement. That did not happen.
The 1113 decision is still in play. Nothing precludes both sides from negotiating while the arbitration hearings proceed, although, the company has made it quite obvious it has no intention to do so. So be it.
Thanks for clearing that up. I was not aware that it was not binding in this case.
luv2fly
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12,
It is my opinion that both sides will not truly negotiate until the board gets close to a decision. The hearings still favor the company's request, but nobody knows how the board will rule, and both sides will most likely not want to chance it.
Just to clarify, the arbitration boards decision is binding, but it does not preclude the union from being able to strike. It is my understanding that the company could also petition the court for another 1113 hearing if the board finds in favor of ALPA.
Sounds like a pretty hollow arbitration for both sides to me. Good luck. I hope we can all put this behind us before long and start hoping for better times.
WorldTraveler
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don't worry, Ch. 12. The pilots will cave if for no other reason (which is a pretty big one) that they have bills to pay and mouths to feed.
I heard a very interesting statistic recently which I surely hope someone can tell me is NOT true but am afraid is. I heard that DL mgmt is saying that DL pilots are currently calling in sick at the rate of 1 month of sick time per pilot per year! That is astounding if true. If that is true and mgmt wants to convince someone that the pilots are acting irresponsibly, that is a pretty powerful statistic. Any other worker in America would be thrown out on their tail side for that kind of sick time problem. Can someone speak to this?
I heard a very interesting statistic recently which I surely hope someone can tell me is NOT true but am afraid is. I heard that DL mgmt is saying that DL pilots are currently calling in sick at the rate of 1 month of sick time per pilot per year! That is astounding if true. If that is true and mgmt wants to convince someone that the pilots are acting irresponsibly, that is a pretty powerful statistic. Any other worker in America would be thrown out on their tail side for that kind of sick time problem. Can someone speak to this?
luv2fly
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Now, now WT. Your prejudice is shining through... again.
You wouldn't mind letting us know who your management insider is and how he or she arrived at their numbers would you? Perhaps you should remind your management friend about the arbitration hearing on the company's alleged sick leave abuse case. I can give you a fact. The company took the case to a neutral arbitrator. The arbitrator "spoke". He decided the company's case to be baseless, and the company was instructed to cease its antagonistic practices. "Bills to pay, and mouths to feed". Why yes I do. That's why I have spent the past two years preparing for what may happen next month. Thanks for your concern. It is greatly appreciated.
Since your allegation really has nothing to do with the topic, I will be more than happy to continue the discussion via PM.
luv2fly
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You are absolutely correct. It was designed soley to provide more time with some temporary cuts to provide immediate relief.
For pete's sake World, will you stop with the "pilots caving" stuff? We all know that you *ahem* dislike pilots, but give me a break. There will be plenty of "caving" on the management side, too, if they want to collect their big fat stock allocation if DAL exits bankruptcy successfully. I know it pains you that the pilot group has so much power over the fate of your airline, but I guess you'll just have to hope that level heads prevail on both sides.
Comparing pilot sick policy to a 9 to 5'ers sick leave policy is apples and oranges. There are many ailments that ground a pilot (a simple cold comes to mind) that would allow many other occupations to continue working. So if you compared different professional occupations, I would imagine that pilots' sick leave usage would always be higher. Besides, when you layoff, cut wages, take retirements, reduce quality of life, etc., etc., which way do you think sick leave (and other variables) are going to trend- towards the negative end of the graph or the positive end? If you're going to pay discount airline pilot wages, I imagine you're going to see discount airline pilot work ethics, whether that's right or wrong.
Comparing pilot sick policy to a 9 to 5'ers sick leave policy is apples and oranges. There are many ailments that ground a pilot (a simple cold comes to mind) that would allow many other occupations to continue working. So if you compared different professional occupations, I would imagine that pilots' sick leave usage would always be higher. Besides, when you layoff, cut wages, take retirements, reduce quality of life, etc., etc., which way do you think sick leave (and other variables) are going to trend- towards the negative end of the graph or the positive end? If you're going to pay discount airline pilot wages, I imagine you're going to see discount airline pilot work ethics, whether that's right or wrong.
Although I agree wiht most of your post I do take issue with the work ethic of a LCC pilot. Most are just as professional and have strong work ethics. Im sure this was just posted out of emotion after having your integrity questioned and the gravity of the situation at hand.
B
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Why should they think about the other work groups? The priority for the pilots are their own lives. When they negotiate or vote to strike it's for their own good, not any other work group. If they strike, then to bad for all the other work groups. It's their right to strike if they see it to be necessary.
Maybe all of the non-union folks should have thought about that when they had the chance to vote in a union. Unlike all the non-union groups; the pilots have a CHOICE!
Approved or not approved?
I have no idea what the work ethic/professionalism of a LCC pilot is vs. a non LCC pilot nor would I imply otherwise. I'd be foolish to paint with such a broad brush. The distinction between the two is rapidly eroding anyway.
My point is that if the Delta's, United's, American's, Northwest's, etc., etc., are going to drag pilot wages down to the JetBlue/Airtran/Frontier level and basically turn a "career" into a "job," I would expect that there will be long term repercussions for that action. Increased sick leave usage will probably be one of many.
I think they are already taking your proud profession and turning into a job. Sadly, they give themselves bonuses for doing it. Im sure there is going to be more than increased sick leave usage in the long run. I dread thinking about how the most qualified will either leave the profession or how those that dream of a future career will never enter and the profession will suffer. My best to you and your co workers.
You will never get it. We non-union folks don't care to have a union...we are saying that a strike would be idiotic...not that we wish we could strike and kill a company. You also have the right to own a shotgun...that doesn't mean that it is smart to blow your head off with it (nor is it smart to let Dick Cheney use it in your presence...). It's good to have rights but it's not always good to excercise them. But with your argument, you are saying that you have the right to own a gun and blow your head off and we are all jealous of that?! C'mon.
