Third Party Maintenance

[AMFAMAN]

We do understand the misfourtunes that have been dealt to all employee's of AA, but their comes a time when you must "suck it up" and deal with the situation before you.... <_<

[post="261195"][/post]​

You are 100% correct. The misfortune is being represented by the twu and I will "suck it up" and deal with the situation by ousting them. Thanks for the advice.

 

[High Speed Steel]

You are 100% correct. The misfortune is being represented by the twu and I will "suck it up" and deal with the situation by ousting them. Thanks for the advice.

[post="261197"][/post]​

amfaman, Thanks for your assessement on my opinion of the posts of hopeful. I do respect your candor. But your posts as well in the opinion of the majority, "are part of the problem, and not the solution". I do believe the members of the TWU, have rejected your amfa efforts if I'm not mistaken..... :blink:

--------------------------------------
amfa: The YUGO of the labor movement
Where bargaining means YOU GO....!

 

[AMFAMAN]

amfaman, Thanks for your assessement on my opinion of the posts of hopeful. I do respect your candor. But your posts as well in the opinion of the majority, "are part of the problem,  and not the solution". I do believe the members of the TWU, have rejected your amfa efforts if I'm not mistaken..... :blink:

--------------------------------------
amfa: The YUGO of the labor movement
Where bargaining means YOU GO....!

[post="261203"][/post]​

No, the members did not reject AMFA, simple put, your good friend/lover-AA did you a favor by stopping an election for 1 year. Remember it took dead people to stop the election. The membership is well aware that this was the case and the twu is well aware that they have less then a year left collecting dues for free from the M&R class and craft at AA.

Your dues collection agency is done; hell even Art Luby quit because he was embarassed of the team twu. 😛

 

[Wretched Wrench]

Don't pay too much mind to HIgh Speed Steel. He is not a mechanic, rather a TWU stooge who has demonstrated his ignorance by posting here on 2/26:

"Do you know what HSS is? It is a tool steel that has been used for years to manufacture many items including the skin on the outside of an aircraft, to the wrench the mechanic holds in their hand."

He has never worked on an airplane, or he would not think they had high speed steel skins. He has never used a wrench if he thinks they are made of high speed steel. I think he (or she) is a clerk.

I believe he is as well informed on union issues as he is on High Speed Steel.

Steel skin indeed!

Go away and come back with yet another name. You are already posting under several.

 

[Bob Owens]

well to get 3rd party contract work there has to be a effort to get it. does anybody really believe that aa was serious about getting third party contract work in mci? if you do your probly on crack. all aa wanted to do was to try and keep the workers working until they got the airplanes they wanted done. and thats what they did, they got there airplanes and now there getting rid of what they didnt want, the employees. i was laid off out of mci in dec, and still havent found another job. now i am looking to go back to school and get out of aviation all together. if my son ever tells me he wants to work on airplanes, i am going to kick him so hard he'll wonder why that thought ever entered his mind, lol. i wish you all luck and hope you make it, my airline career is over.

[post="260957"][/post]​

Sorry to hear you have had enough. How about giving those of us who remain a shot at making it better(and perhaps giving you something worth coming back to-we have a 10 year recall) by sending in an AMFA card?

 

[Hopeful]

hopeless, I have been reading some of your posts over the past few weeks and have noticed some common repetitive traits you possess. You are truly a "Debbie Downer"!!! You never have anything postive to say, or inject anything positive to the topic of discussion. You, my friend. Must have a real problem! We do understand the misfourtunes that have been dealt to all employee's of AA, but their comes a time when you must "suck it up" and deal with the situation before you.... <_<

------------------------------------
amfa: The YUGO of the labor movement
Where bargaining means YOU GO....!

[post="261195"][/post]​

OH, please tell me what there is to be positive about! Maybe you enjoy getting raped, I don't!
Maybe if I were a TWU appointed crony with a guaranteed yearly raise in salary and pension, I might be able to "suck it up."

Do you rememebr Eastern, PanAM, Braniff? TWA?

Negative is the way to go!

 

[Bob Owens]

FWAAA,Apr 8 2005, 01:39 AM]
Don't forget the difference between net accounting losses and negative cash flow.  Most of 2004's net loss was non-cash GAAP items like depreciation/amortization. 

Hmm, kind of like the figures they released in 2003 where they claim to have lost $3.5 billion.

Last year, AMR had positive cash flow from operations of $717 million, net investments (CapEx) of $1.05 billion, and net borrowings (net of debt repayment) of $331 million.  Those balance out to break even cash flow.  Cash and short term investments actually increased during 2004 by $323 million.

2004's unit revenue from Pacific operations was up 15% from 2003, and for Europe it was up 8.4%.  Recently, AMR said that 2005 Q1 mainline unit revenue was up between 3.5% and 4.5%.  Revenue is actually improving.  That revenue will pay the bills.  Nothing left over as profits, of course.

http://yahoo.reuters.com/financeQuoteCompa..._wen7883_newsml

Profits may never return.  We all hope they do, but the primary concern now (as it has been for the past 3+ years) is to avoid running out of cash.    So far, AMR is doing an ok job at not running out of cash, especially since it is paying its pension contributions (contrast to UAL and USAir, which did not pay their 2004 contributions).

Profits may never return. Well in order for us to see any of them they would have to make more than $500 million anyway. Even if they ever hit half a billion in profits only 10% of the excess would go towards profit sharing any way. So if AA made $1 billion in profits only 50 million would go towards profit sharing, or about $500 per employee.In order for us to get back what we lost through profit sharing the company would have to make over $41,000,000,000 in profits. Considering that they only make about $20 billion in revenue thats extremely unlikely.

And if they never make a profit will the airline dissappear or will other entities prop it up like GE Capital is doing over at USAIR? The fact is that while the "airlines" may not make money the service they provide is essential and their existance, even if they are losing money, generates profits for others. So forget all the "Pull together-win together hype, the harder you work the more you will be encouraging management to cut your pay even more.

With higher fuel prices in Q1 2005, AMR probably had slight negative cash flow in the first quarter.  But management has a plan for that - it has already announced yet another cut in the catering budget to slash another $120 million or so.  That's the customer contribution:  Higher fares (higher unit revenue) plus smaller F meals. 

Like I said, why bother, if we work harder for less it will just provide the oil companies more cushion to raise Jet fuel prices. WE cut our pay and every penny of it went to the oil companies. I say let it come to a crisis where people start talking about regulating oil prices because the oil companies are gouging the public or they pressure their politicians to put a real effort towards alternative resources.

On this year's debt repayments:  AMR has $659 million of debt due this year, and $2.5 billion in 2006-2007.  The 2005 amount is managable, but the 2006-2007 repayments will be impossible unless something changes.    A cash crunch will happen in 2006 unless major changes occur.

Ah yes, just in time for the contract openers and another round of TWU concessions.

This year's pension contributions are expected to be $310 million, of which AMR has probably already contributed a large part (we'll know for sure in a couple of weeks).  Pension contributions in 2006-2007 are expected to be significantly larger than this year's $310 million.

If USAir and UAL survive much longer, AMR will probably face a real cash crunch by mid-2006 unless oil falls to $25 - $30/bbl.

Let it all come crumbling down, the sooner the better. We gave up 25% of our compensation, the planes are full but the company still cant make it work. Why should they? The way things are every one else is making a mint and airline workers have no leverage towards getting any of the spoils. Better to keep the crisis going to see how low we can go.Why should we think that another round might do the trick? By working harder for less all we are doing is saving management from being replaced, the same management that put us in this place. The fact is that AA will be around for a while no matter what happens, the question is will it be a job worth having? Do we give away everything to keep the same people in control or do we let them steer it wherever they want and just make sure that we get a fair share for what we do? Look at the executives, you dont see them making any sacrifices. That goes for the executives of the TWU too. Little and company all gave themselves raises while they got us concessions.

 

[FWAAA]

Hmm, kind of like the figures they released in 2003 where they claim to have lost $3.5 billion.

Yes, Mr Owens, just like the lies told to you in 2003. 🙄

You got me - the concept of GAAP net losses were designed to deceive the poor employees. The evil capitalist owners are the only people smart enough to read the financials and see the truth. 🙄

Profits may never return. Well in order for us to see any of them they would have to make more than $500 million anyway. Even if they ever hit half a billion in profits only 10% of the excess would go towards profit sharing any way. So if AA made $1 billion in profits only 50 million would go towards profit sharing, or about $500 per employee.In order for us to get back what we lost through profit sharing the company would have to make over $41,000,000,000 in profits. Considering that they only make about $20 billion in revenue thats extremely unlikely.

Really? That's a smaller percentage than AMR's profit sharing payouts throughout the late 1990s. Did AMR's employees really agree to give back most of the upside? Well, I guess that's not so farfetched, considering the willingness of the mechanics to bend over for over 20 years (according to you, since what - 1983?) without complaint.

 

[AMFAMAN]

FWAAA,

Wrong Forum, but while your there and I had the form 41 up;

Just wondering if you could explain how AA debt was reduced $9 billion in the first 9 months of last year? I am looking at the form 41 and 2004 through 3Q shows, AA American Airlines, Inc. -27,144,108,000. 2003 shows AA American Airlines, Inc. -36,036,183,000. Would this reduction be because of favorable investments? Seems like a dramatic reduction, being almost 25%.

Also Eagle shows almost $10 Billion in debt for many of the past years and we hear no complaining about that debt despite on an revenue generating basis, Eagle can't produce nearly the revenue that AA does, in fact it shows 1/14 the revenue but yet has more than 1/3 the debt. They also have only 1/7 the assets of AA. If these numbers the DOT puts out are correct, it appears that Eagle is in much worse shape than AA.

Form 41 link

 

[FWAAA]

I'll take a look. I can guarantee that AMR's total debt (including AA, AE, and all other subs) did NOT decline by any substantial amount in 2004 over 12/31/03 levels.

 

[AMFAMAN]

I'll take a look. I can guarantee that AMR's total debt (including AA, AE, and all other subs) did NOT decline by any substantial amount in 2004 over 12/31/03 levels.

[post="261312"][/post]​

This debt was listed under long term debt for what it's worth. Not sure why there is a difference between the form 41 debt and the 10k debt except that the 10k is less current maturities but that doesn't come close to the same maturities on the form 41-schedule B1. The same holds true for Assets, D.O.T. has the combined AA and AE at close to $90 billion, SEC shows AMR at near $29 billion. I just wondering if either is accurate. I like the form 41 and its schedules because it really breaks down each division of the company, flight, maint, etc, as compared to the 10k, but I'm just wondering where do they get the numbers from. The numbers are consistent with other airlines as Delta shows $66 billion in assets and NWA $56 billion.

 

[Buck]

What is TUL going to do with all of the maintenance capacity set aside for Third Party Maintenance?

I understand that the customer database is a little thin??

 

[Bob Owens]

FWAAA,Apr 8 2005, 06:16 PM]
Yes, Mr Owens, just like the lies told to you in 2003.

You got me - the concept of GAAP net losses were designed to deceive the poor employees. The evil capitalist owners are the only people smart enough to read the financials and see the truth.

Your childish comments are meant to distort the truth. I never said that GAAP rules were designed to decieve employees, I said they were designed for investors, not employees. Using these figures from our position is like using the wrong tool. The GAAP rules tend to show the worst case because normally most corporations tend to paint overly rosy pictures.

Really? That's a smaller percentage than AMR's profit sharing payouts throughout the late 1990s.

No kidding.

Did AMR's employees really agree to give back most of the upside?

What?

Well, I guess that's not so farfetched, considering the willingness of the mechanics to bend over for over 20 years (according to you, since what - 1983?) without complaint.

Without complaint? You havent been listening.




AMFAMAN, you got a link for that Form 41?

 

[AMFAMAN]

AMFAMAN, you got a link for that Form 41?

[post="261376"][/post]​

form 41

Bob,

This is the general link as there are many schedules in the form 41. The first one B-1 covers the assets and debt. Click on the Table name-B-1. Next click on Analysis on the Carrier line so you can look at all carriers. Once in the database you can change the fields in Filter Variables and also the year back to 1990. There is also much more data in the other schedules including the managment salaries, outsourcing, etc.

enjoy..

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

amfaman, Thanks for your assessement on my opinion of the posts of hopeful. I do respect your candor. But your posts as well in the opinion of the majority, "are part of the problem, and not the solution". I do believe the members of the TWU, have rejected your amfa efforts if I'm not mistaken..... :blink:

--------------------------------------
amfa: The YUGO of the labor movement
Where bargaining means YOU GO....!

[post="261203"][/post]​

hss, are you actually aware that your comment, "I do believe the members of the twu, have rejected your AMFA efforts if I'm not mistaken...", makes you appear even more ignorant than previously believed? The boys in the international sure have a real simpleton in hss.

How have the members of the twu rejected our AMFA efforts? Was it the scarey coffin that was surrounded by kirk wells and his merry band of "To the doors and stop" chanters? Or maybe it was the INFLATED list of eligible voters?

You should try auditioning for the Comedy Channel's "Friday Night Stand-Up". Your act is killer!