United posts $28 million net loss for November (excluding special items)

[WorldTraveler]

dc3,
you forgot to mention debt service. It's not an operating cost item but it is a real cost that is largely postponed and sometimes reduced (although not eliminated) in bankruptcy.

Yes, BK is costly but the reason companies don't file BK is because it destroys the equity in a company. In a non-bankrupt company, it is management's responsibiity to protect the interests of the companies owners. In bankruptcy, it is management's responsibility to preserve the value of the estate for the creditors. That is a major shift in purpose.

 

[Busdrvr]

OK, let's see if we can go over this ONE MORE TIME, so that even the slowest thinker can comprehend it.

UAL got rid of DEBT in BK. UAL's OPERATING performance in BK has NOTHING to do with debt. In BK, UAL asks Mr. Gas Man to fill up the jet. Mr. Gas Man say's SURE, BUT I WANT CASH. UAL GIVES HIM CASH. Did UAL get rid of DEBT in BK, CERTAINLY, HOWEVER, NO-ONE IS REQUIRED TO DO BUSINESS WITH A BK COMPANY, THOSE THAT DO DEMAND CASH, THEREFORE UAL IS CURRENTLY PAYING ALL IT'S BILLS. THESE BILLS ARE PART OF THE OPERATING COSTS. GOT IT?

Did UAL renig on it's pensions? Yes. Has the taxpayer payed an MF-n DIME? NO. If anything, you "Mr Taxpayer" probably owes UAL. UAL was fine, until YOU over the course of the 90's, continued to vote for idiots who cared not about our security, and UAL has hit, BECAUSE OUR GOVERNMENT FAILED US. Then when we went to war, the soldiers WENT ON UAL IRON, because the government saved tax dollars year after year by planning to use the airlines instead of buying it's own jets. Catch a clue. If you're having this much trouble comprehending the basics of BK law, then I'm thinking you don't pay taxes.... You can't be that slow and still have a job.

 

[dc3fanatic]

One of UALs bills was the pension. Ten Billion dollars. They now gave that bill to me, the tax payer. But wait, you say legal bills are more than what they shed thru bankruptcy. So the legal bill for filing this bankruptcy is more than ten billion dollars. Get a grip on reality. Exactly, think about it. You owe a ton of money, but filing for bankruptcy will end up costing you more money? NOT... UAL has screwed everyone out of TENS of BILLIONS of dollars. They have left even small Mom and Pop businesses with the unpaid tab. One resturant in Aspen is holding an $83,000.00 UAL bill. NOT PAID. Somehow they will have to take up the slack. And think. These people get upset when some one walks out the door without paying for a sandwich. Imagine how they feel at being owed 83k and having UAL tell them to take a hike!!!!

UAL DOES NOT have a pension bill, so there's nothing to pay. I'm sure you are upset about the pension issue, but it's not an unpaid bill.

The UAL bill you bring up in Aspen, when was the expense incurred? Was it 2005? I think NOT! Again, you are the one that needs to get a grip.

You still have no idea how bankruptcy works and the more you post, the more you show. Talk to someone that knows about bankruptcy and bills, and maybe you can start getting a clue. Seriously.

Finally, there are a few bills unpaid from the original filing of bankruptcy. That happens with every company that files. Those unpaid bills date back to 2002 or 2003, depending on when UAL filed.

After a company files for bankruptcy, that company is liable for all expenses incurred post filing, but not necessarily pre-filing. UAL is no different.

Find a vendor that has an unpaid bill after filing! You won't.

The comments I have been disputing here to people that don't listen to reason are about UAL making a profit or having a good operating margin in 2005. A few uneducated people posted that "Not hard when you don't pay your bills".

UAL pays all their bills, and you haven't found any expense incurred in 2005 to support your claims, have you?

 

[A737lvr]

UAL DOES NOT have a pension bill, so there's nothing to pay. I'm sure you are upset about the pension issue, but it's not an unpaid bill.

The UAL bill you bring up in Aspen, when was the expense incurred? Was it 2005? I think NOT! Again, you are the one that needs to get a grip.

You still have no idea how bankruptcy works and the more you post, the more you show. Talk to someone that knows about bankruptcy and bills, and maybe you can start getting a clue. Seriously.

Finally, there are a few bills unpaid from the original filing of bankruptcy. That happens with every company that files. Those unpaid bills date back to 2002 or 2003, depending on when UAL filed.

After a company files for bankruptcy, that company is liable for all expenses incurred post filing, but not necessarily pre-filing. UAL is no different.

Find a vendor that has an unpaid bill after filing! You won't.

The comments I have been disputing here to people that don't listen to reason are about UAL making a profit or having a good operating margin in 2005. A few uneducated people posted that "Not hard when you don't pay your bills".

UAL pays all their bills, and you haven't found any expense incurred in 2005 to support your claims, have you?

I stand corrected. <_<

 

[dc3fanatic]

Very simple way to tell how well/poorly UA is doing.
View the "Statement of Cash Flows"

It tells you all you need to know. The rest is accountig BS!

Not necessarily. If United owned 100 747's and sold them all for cash . . . SCF would look really good, but they would have just sold a major source of income.

 

[A737lvr]

UAL DOES NOT have a pension bill, so there's nothing to pay. I'm sure you are upset about the pension issue, but it's not an unpaid bill.

The UAL bill you bring up in Aspen, when was the expense incurred? Was it 2005? I think NOT! Again, you are the one that needs to get a grip.

You still have no idea how bankruptcy works and the more you post, the more you show. Talk to someone that knows about bankruptcy and bills, and maybe you can start getting a clue. Seriously.

Finally, there are a few bills unpaid from the original filing of bankruptcy. That happens with every company that files. Those unpaid bills date back to 2002 or 2003, depending on when UAL filed.

After a company files for bankruptcy, that company is liable for all expenses incurred post filing, but not necessarily pre-filing. UAL is no different.

Find a vendor that has an unpaid bill after filing! You won't.

The comments I have been disputing here to people that don't listen to reason are about UAL making a profit or having a good operating margin in 2005. A few uneducated people posted that "Not hard when you don't pay your bills".

UAL pays all their bills, and you haven't found any expense incurred in 2005 to support your claims, have you?