ual-crewdesk-man
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- Sep 7, 2002
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United Reaches Tentative Labor Pact with Pilots
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wwiiairliner
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- Jan 27, 2003
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Do you have any more details?
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ual-crewdesk-man
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- Sep 7, 2002
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- Thread Starter
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No...just came out. No details yet. I''ll keep my ears open though.
ZMAN777
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- Aug 23, 2002
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Here's a few major points if/when ratified:
1. 6 year agreement....through April 2009
2. "A" Fund multiplier lowered to 1.35 (from 1.5)
3. "B" Fund lowered to 9% (from 11%)
4. Additional 1% wage cut from the current 29% "interim" wage adjustment
4 pay increases of 1.5% over the life of the agreement.
5. 3 tier pay scale
737/320
767/757
777/747
6. Low Cost Carrier is now labled "Low Cost Operation" and will be flown
by UAL pilots (one seniority list!!) and the company has been given
the latitude to use 737/320 aircraft as it decides. Unlikely to be a
separate entity from UAL. (Huge benefit for the Company. If they
can't make money with this there's no hope for us!)
7. No IRP (International Relief Pilot)provision
8. No Augmentee Pilot on International flights scheduled under 8 hours.
9. Greater responsibility for International F/O to maintain landing
currency or go NQ and lose pay. Could be made up by volunteering for
pickup.
10. Lowered line guarantee to 65 hours, 70 hours for reserves.
11. Some form of profit sharing tied to others in management (TBD)
As you can imagine there's a lot else but those are the big ticket items. No mention of number of furloughs likely to occur due to the increase in
productivity. Not great but more than likely a whole lot better than you could expect from "da judge"!
Cheers,
Z
P.S. Here's wishing our friends at AMR the best. We really don't want to see you also end up here with us in BK. Best wishes!
1. 6 year agreement....through April 2009
2. "A" Fund multiplier lowered to 1.35 (from 1.5)
3. "B" Fund lowered to 9% (from 11%)
4. Additional 1% wage cut from the current 29% "interim" wage adjustment
4 pay increases of 1.5% over the life of the agreement.
5. 3 tier pay scale
737/320
767/757
777/747
6. Low Cost Carrier is now labled "Low Cost Operation" and will be flown
by UAL pilots (one seniority list!!) and the company has been given
the latitude to use 737/320 aircraft as it decides. Unlikely to be a
separate entity from UAL. (Huge benefit for the Company. If they
can't make money with this there's no hope for us!)
7. No IRP (International Relief Pilot)provision
8. No Augmentee Pilot on International flights scheduled under 8 hours.
9. Greater responsibility for International F/O to maintain landing
currency or go NQ and lose pay. Could be made up by volunteering for
pickup.
10. Lowered line guarantee to 65 hours, 70 hours for reserves.
11. Some form of profit sharing tied to others in management (TBD)
As you can imagine there's a lot else but those are the big ticket items. No mention of number of furloughs likely to occur due to the increase in
productivity. Not great but more than likely a whole lot better than you could expect from "da judge"!
Cheers,
Z
P.S. Here's wishing our friends at AMR the best. We really don't want to see you also end up here with us in BK. Best wishes!
Sounds like things are going forward and not backwards, and that has to be a positive, in the midst of a few months of mostly negatives. 
I am a 1K flyer, not a staffer, but like the staffers, want to see UA fly out of Chapter 11. Do you guys who have yet to vote on this have a feeling this will be voted in by your colleagues?
I am a 1K flyer, not a staffer, but like the staffers, want to see UA fly out of Chapter 11. Do you guys who have yet to vote on this have a feeling this will be voted in by your colleagues?
Sounds like things are going forward and not backwards, and that has to be a positive, in the midst of a few months of mostly negatives.
I am a 1K flyer, not a staffer, but like the staffers, want to see UA fly out of Chapter 11. Do you guys who have yet to vote on this have a feeling this will be voted in by your colleagues?
I am a 1K flyer, not a staffer, but like the staffers, want to see UA fly out of Chapter 11. Do you guys who have yet to vote on this have a feeling this will be voted in by your colleagues?
Ozstamps, I''d expect it to pass.
Ac500, there are many other concessions that will result in that kind of cost savings. For instance, lines will be built to 85 hrs which will result in a lot more furloughs; the reduction in personnel will lower UAL''s benefits costs. Medical & dental have changed. Duty rigs changed. Etc.
RJDrvr, what scope? It''ll be practically nonexistant with the new TA.
One item that I''m pissed about is that the furlough grievances were waived by this TA, but did not change recall rights past 7 years. With all of the changes, I would expect a minimum of another 1000 furloughs. With 2400 pilots on the street, there will be many of us not recalled within 7 years.
Ac500, there are many other concessions that will result in that kind of cost savings. For instance, lines will be built to 85 hrs which will result in a lot more furloughs; the reduction in personnel will lower UAL''s benefits costs. Medical & dental have changed. Duty rigs changed. Etc.
RJDrvr, what scope? It''ll be practically nonexistant with the new TA.
One item that I''m pissed about is that the furlough grievances were waived by this TA, but did not change recall rights past 7 years. With all of the changes, I would expect a minimum of another 1000 furloughs. With 2400 pilots on the street, there will be many of us not recalled within 7 years.
R
retread
Guest
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On 3/28/2003 12
49 AM 737nCH11 wrote:
It''s not great, but no concessionary contract ever is. All in all it was much better than what I was expecting.
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However, that is only their first trip to the well. When they get thirsty they will be back. Our well was run dry. Expect to give the most. Good luck.On 3/28/2003 12
49 AM 737nCH11 wrote:It''s not great, but no concessionary contract ever is. All in all it was much better than what I was expecting.
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Retread(AAA)
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/03/28/business...
Paul Whiteford, a captain who is chairman of the master executive council for the pilots'' union at United, said the agreement would make United a "more effective competitor" against both traditional and low-fare carriers.
Mr. Whiteford said the company and the union "will continue to work together to ensure that United''s operations remain competitive in every market United serves, including markets served by the company''s no-frills, low-fare competition."
United is continuing talks with other unions, including flight attendants and mechanics. A spokeswoman for the flight attendants'' union, Sara Dela Cruz, said yesterday that the union was committed to helping United successfully restructure.
Joseph Tiberi, a spokesman for the International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, which represents the mechanics, said his union would like to conclude talks quickly. "There''s no advantage to anyone in dragging this process out any further," Mr. Tiberi said.
etc
Paul Whiteford, a captain who is chairman of the master executive council for the pilots'' union at United, said the agreement would make United a "more effective competitor" against both traditional and low-fare carriers.
Mr. Whiteford said the company and the union "will continue to work together to ensure that United''s operations remain competitive in every market United serves, including markets served by the company''s no-frills, low-fare competition."
United is continuing talks with other unions, including flight attendants and mechanics. A spokeswoman for the flight attendants'' union, Sara Dela Cruz, said yesterday that the union was committed to helping United successfully restructure.
Joseph Tiberi, a spokesman for the International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers, which represents the mechanics, said his union would like to conclude talks quickly. "There''s no advantage to anyone in dragging this process out any further," Mr. Tiberi said.
etc
Yes, the only sticking point left now is the Mechanics and with a couple thousand of them cooling their heels on the street on "involuntary leave" the IAM and the company now feel confident they can get another concessionary contract past them. So everything will be hunky-dory, at least until the effects ripple through the rest of the industry, depressing the wages of all airline workers, and we end up right back here again.
Same old song….
Same old song….
