Update Regarding AAA Presentation to EC

[Junebug172]

Here's the pertinent part:

"While we would have preferred that Captain Prater reject entirely the AAA MEC’s request and put to rest once and for all the AAA MEC’s baseless assertion that the Award can and should be set aside, we understand that the Executive Council has a long and unbroken history of permitting MECs to make presentation to it on virtually any subject. In light of this history, it is our view that the Executive Council concluded that it would have been inadvisable to have rejected the AAA MEC’s request, no matter how the Council felt about its lack of authority to change the award. While trying to dissect selected words of a letter can sometimes be dangerous, it is the case that Captain Prater’s letter makes the point that the meeting is “[w]ithout implication concerning the Award or Executive Council jurisdiction.â€￾ In our view, his careful choice of words speaks volumes about his understanding of the limitations on the Council’s authority in these matters."

 

[USA320Pilot]

According to a US Airways MEC source, the presentation to the Executive Council is the first step in the process of decertifying ALPA on the US Airways property, imposing a new union on the America West pilots, seeking legal relief/damages, not agreeing to a new contract and living under LOA 93/RLA (which is the right of the US Airways pilots), and permitting "whip sawing" of the AWA pilots to the maximum extent possible under terms of the Transition Agreement.

What can the AWA pilots do about this? Nothing, absolutely nothing!

😛

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[aquagreen73s]

According to a US Airways MEC source, What can the AWA pilots do about this? Nothing, absolutely nothing!

😛

Regards,

USA320Pilot

OK...here we go with the "sources." This, in USA's world, means the voices are getting down to business and the fabrication, obfuscation, and delusions will begin in earnest.


There's nothing AWA, ALPA national, the Easter Bunny or the East pilots can do about the award. It's final, and it's over.

 

[700UW]

You cant decertify under the RLA, you have to have another union with enough members signing cards to call for an election if 50%+1 does not vote in the election then you are non-union and have no CBA and no seniority.

Don't let the facts get in your way.

 

[Junebug172]

OK...here we go with the "sources." This, in USA's world, means the voices are getting down to business and the fabrication, obfuscation, and delusions will begin in earnest.
There's nothing AWA, ALPA national, the Easter Bunny or the East pilots can do about the award. It's final, and it's over.

His "sources" also told him he was getting DOH.

Will he ever learn?

:down:

 

[Junebug172]

According to a US Airways MEC source, the presentation to the Executive Council is the first step in the process of decertifying ALPA on the US Airways property, imposing a new union on the America West pilots, seeking legal relief/damages, not agreeing to a new contract and living under LOA 93/RLA (which is the right of the US Airways pilots), and permitting "whip sawing" of the AWA pilots to the maximum extent possible under terms of the Transition Agreement.

What can the AWA pilots do about this? Nothing, absolutely nothing!

😛

Regards,

USA320Pilot

OK, let's try to understand this moron's logic.

He says the east will decertify their side of ALPA. He then says that AAA will impose a union on AWA's property.

Can someone who understands the RLA please explain to me how one pilot group imposes a new union on another pilot group?

Or is he just an idiot?

:huh:

 

[700UW]

The latter would be correct.

Both groups would have to sign enough cards since the NMB certified Single Carrier Status.

You would have to get the right % for the NMB to hold an election.

Unions under the RLA do not decertify, that would only be under the NLRA.

 

[USFlyer]

I guess I'm still confused what "expectations" the US East pilots had in reality. They were working for a twice bankrupt airline that was about to liquidate. What career expectations were there? I mean, honestly, you guys probably had about 2-3 months left had HP not decided to buy US. You should be lucky you weren't stapled to the bottom of the HP seniority list given this. Time to move on.

 

[Bear96]

. . . . seeking legal relief/damages, . . .

I'm not sure you can recover for self-inflicted wounds.

 

[luvn737s]

OK, let's try to understand this moron's logic.

He says the east will decertify their side of ALPA. He then says that AAA will impose a union on AWA's property.

Can someone who understands the RLA please explain to me how one pilot group imposes a new union on another pilot group?

Or is he just an idiot?

:huh:

He thinks that the protected 500, all the captains, and somehow the furloughees will decide to fall on their collective swords to allow those east guys to dishonor the rest of the pilots by backing out of what they agreed to.

Pretty naive, huh?

 

[Junebug172]

I guess I'm still confused what "expectations" the US East pilots had in reality. They were working for a twice bankrupt airline that was about to liquidate. What career expectations were there? I mean, honestly, you guys probably had about 2-3 months left had HP not decided to buy US. You should be lucky you weren't stapled to the bottom of the HP seniority list given this. Time to move on.

Actually, that is way to generous.

The creditors were going to go after their engines and airplanes right around the begining of September. With less than 30 days of cash, creditors tend to shut places down so that they can reover a few pennies for their invested dollars.

Fortunately for Airways, Parker was in a buying mood and gave Airways the relief it need by showing the creditors it finally had business plan.

By the 3rd week of September, 2005 Airways had less than a week of cash which is why Parker moved the aquisition date to September, instead of the original October.

He was afriad Airways would have closed its doors before he got a chance to sign the paperwork.

Please, feel free to verifiy these facts. Google is a wonderful tool.

 

[SkyRat]

According to a US Airways MEC source, the presentation to the Executive Council is the first step in the process of decertifying ALPA on the US Airways property, imposing a new union on the America West pilots, seeking legal relief/damages, not agreeing to a new contract and living under LOA 93/RLA (which is the right of the US Airways pilots), and permitting "whip sawing" of the AWA pilots to the maximum extent possible under terms of the Transition Agreement.

What can the AWA pilots do about this? Nothing, absolutely nothing!

😛

Regards,

USA320Pilot

Every argument on this post is BASELESS.

1. Decertifying? Pettition, 50+1%, NMB approval, new Union? OK!

Nicolau's decision is Still a BINDING, NON-Reversible Decision... GET IT!!! Cry all you want, won't make a difference, be realistic and stop managing UR own expectations.

Since day one, Nicolau told your MC that DOH was NOT going to happen, but the only argument that UR MC presented leaned towards a complete STAPLE, by going DOH.

For 18 months that's all they did, now deal with it. You can all get organized with the Westies and MAYBE get a decent contract that might address some LOS issues.

All these DIVISIVE arguments and ideas will only HURT all of you! Take a few days off, chill, and get your thoughts together.

GL

 

[aquagreen73s]

Six days into this and I'm still waiting for all the promised "shock and horror" from the OAL pilots. So far, all I've seen on this board is the same sentiment I've encountered on my last trip - that this award was very fair and even somewhat generous to the East pilots given the fact that they got the top 500 slots. What the diehard East pilots will have to accept is that JETZ's opinions are very representative of the collective opinions of OAL pilots.

 

[Charlie_Tuna]

Again per RLA website this is only way to change or get rid of unions. Call it what you like decertification or whatever.

. Q: How can employees change their labor organization?

A: Employees can change their labor organization by signing authorization cards for another organization, which then files an application and "wins" an election.

11. Q: How can employees decertify their current representative without getting another one?

A: There is no application for decertification, however if a majority of the craft or class does not vote for representation the current representative will lose its representation rights.

12. Q: Can employees form and elect their own union?

A: Yes, employees can form their own organization if they submit an application supported by a sufficient showing of interest.

 

[TechBoy]

I guess I'm still confused what "expectations" the US East pilots had in reality. They were working for a twice bankrupt airline that was about to liquidate. What career expectations were there? I mean, honestly, you guys probably had about 2-3 months left had HP not decided to buy US. You should be lucky you weren't stapled to the bottom of the HP seniority list given this. Time to move on.

Even if US had somehow managed to stay afloat, there would have been a 15-30% reduction in the fleet. That would have put half of the East FOs on the street. And those are the people that were supposedly "shafted" by the Nicolau decision. Perhaps they are better off even with their unhappiness about the decision.