Us Air Weighs Extra Measures To Help Finances
- Thread starter USA320Pilot
- Start date
- Thread Starter
- #63
In my opinion, ALPA and the company will reach a new labor accord shortly. Then the AFA will have a new agreement with "me too" clauses implemented. In addition, I expect new agreements between the company and the CWA and IAM-FSA, which will not major overhauls.
That leaves the IAM-M. I believe the IAM-M made a big mistake in not accepting the company's offer to negotiate an acceptable agreement and now the mechanics have very little legal leverage.
Moreover, I believe senior management can be vindictive if you do not agree with their position. Thus, I expect the IAM and its members could be in for a very painful time and there is not much the rank-and-file can do to stop their blood letting. Time is running short for the IAM-M and if the mechanics and related workers want a job at US Airways in the future, it may be in their best interests to cut a deal.
In conclusion, this issue will not effect me one way or another, but it could effect members of the IAM-M, just like yesterday's court ruling.
Regards,
USA320Pilot
That leaves the IAM-M. I believe the IAM-M made a big mistake in not accepting the company's offer to negotiate an acceptable agreement and now the mechanics have very little legal leverage.
Moreover, I believe senior management can be vindictive if you do not agree with their position. Thus, I expect the IAM and its members could be in for a very painful time and there is not much the rank-and-file can do to stop their blood letting. Time is running short for the IAM-M and if the mechanics and related workers want a job at US Airways in the future, it may be in their best interests to cut a deal.
In conclusion, this issue will not effect me one way or another, but it could effect members of the IAM-M, just like yesterday's court ruling.
Regards,
USA320Pilot
"Moreover, I believe senior management can be vindictive if you do not agree with their position."
As opposed to what they have done so far?
"How to make friends and influence people" really is a great book
As opposed to what they have done so far?
"How to make friends and influence people" really is a great book
delldude
Veteran
i suggest you call robert roach...he has a deal for you.USA320Pilot said:
we'll take the arbiter.......
what are they going to do in any case? bring it in,move the base?
vendor it out,layoff??
- Thread Starter
- #66
Dell:
Management won on the A320 issue -- it's over. Your union has a small window of opportunity to protect member jobs and from what I have heard you should cut a deal.
You had more leverage before the court's recent decision and your union elected to not "come to the bargaining table." Now you may have to live with the results, which are likely to be very painful, regardless of what you do.
Best of luck,
USA320Pilot
Management won on the A320 issue -- it's over. Your union has a small window of opportunity to protect member jobs and from what I have heard you should cut a deal.
You had more leverage before the court's recent decision and your union elected to not "come to the bargaining table." Now you may have to live with the results, which are likely to be very painful, regardless of what you do.
Best of luck,
USA320Pilot
ITRADE
Veteran
I have to disagree there. It was sent back so that it could be aribrtrated. There is a dispute - the 3d curcuit ruled it was "minor."
- Thread Starter
- #68
Itrade:
It will be arbitrated, but labor has a very poor record in arbitration and this will be a long drawn out process. In addition, management can be vindictive and I believe the IAM will lose in the end. Unfortunately for some very good people, there are some very painful things that can occur to the rank-and-file, which are indcluded in their present contract.
That's why I have encouraged IAM members to cut a deal, but in the end, it's not my fight, and will have little effect on me and my family.
Respectfully,
USA320Pilot
It will be arbitrated, but labor has a very poor record in arbitration and this will be a long drawn out process. In addition, management can be vindictive and I believe the IAM will lose in the end. Unfortunately for some very good people, there are some very painful things that can occur to the rank-and-file, which are indcluded in their present contract.
That's why I have encouraged IAM members to cut a deal, but in the end, it's not my fight, and will have little effect on me and my family.
Respectfully,
USA320Pilot
USApilot,
What did the mechanics have to win by bargaining, seems to me, that the powers that be was already decided. When the first airplane left, they negated to uphold the contract they had written, not exactly an honest move. Secondly, the mechanics ranks has already seen reduction and some of those moves has been pretty harsh, ie the station in Florida. One thing is doing it, another thing is doing it in a reasonable fashion.
You vacilate between defending the company and being against the company. When it involves the pilots and underhanded moves you are against, yet when it comes to every other group, you persist in saying take it or else. Now you are alluding, that the mechanics better come to the table quickly or mgnt will be "vindictive", I must be missing something here, but is this grade school and someone is taking the ball and going home? Further, this should give you pause to think, how this mgnt will react, or more likely, what they will impose on you in the future, contracts notwithstanding.
The U employees wish to see the company succeed, for obvious reasons, however, the company needs the esprit the corps, to make this happen. Apparently it must be an accountant running the show, because it apears this is all about the bottom line, not understanding the human element. reminds me of the movie "Office Space".
Further, and this is not really meant as harsh as it sounds, but there is a big difference between going from 40k to 25K as opposed to going from 200k to 125k.
Just my two cents.
What did the mechanics have to win by bargaining, seems to me, that the powers that be was already decided. When the first airplane left, they negated to uphold the contract they had written, not exactly an honest move. Secondly, the mechanics ranks has already seen reduction and some of those moves has been pretty harsh, ie the station in Florida. One thing is doing it, another thing is doing it in a reasonable fashion.
You vacilate between defending the company and being against the company. When it involves the pilots and underhanded moves you are against, yet when it comes to every other group, you persist in saying take it or else. Now you are alluding, that the mechanics better come to the table quickly or mgnt will be "vindictive", I must be missing something here, but is this grade school and someone is taking the ball and going home? Further, this should give you pause to think, how this mgnt will react, or more likely, what they will impose on you in the future, contracts notwithstanding.
The U employees wish to see the company succeed, for obvious reasons, however, the company needs the esprit the corps, to make this happen. Apparently it must be an accountant running the show, because it apears this is all about the bottom line, not understanding the human element. reminds me of the movie "Office Space".
Further, and this is not really meant as harsh as it sounds, but there is a big difference between going from 40k to 25K as opposed to going from 200k to 125k.
Just my two cents.
delldude
Veteran
funny after 2 days of asking what you refer too,and you still dodge the bullet because there is no Painful Clause".USA320Pilot said:
"That's why I have encouraged IAM members to cut a deal, but in the end, it's not my fight, and will have little effect on me and my family."
If that truly is the case, then why not let the IAM members do what they feel is right and stay out of the fight. They are adults, it affect their lives, let them make their decision. I am sure they are knowledgeable about the contract, unless you can post a reference to the contrary, which you have declined to do. That leads me to think, that it does not exist, outside of a courtroom that is.
If that truly is the case, then why not let the IAM members do what they feel is right and stay out of the fight. They are adults, it affect their lives, let them make their decision. I am sure they are knowledgeable about the contract, unless you can post a reference to the contrary, which you have declined to do. That leads me to think, that it does not exist, outside of a courtroom that is.
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Nov 9, 2003
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USA320Pilot said "it's not my fight, and will have little effect on me and my family."
I agree, it's not my fight either. As for the rest of that statement, I disagree. The quality of the maintenance on the airplane I strap on could have a very large effect on not only me and my family, but on my crew, my passengers, and all their families.
As I have said in the past, outside maintenance is not necessarily good or bad. It is the quality of the maintenance that afffects safety, not where it is done. Judging by the posts concerning the first airplane STS worked, I'm not reassured.
Before any IAM members jump all over me, I hope you win this fight. Your work is of known quality, whereas the "lowest bidder" is not. Besides, having you do this work is the "right" thing to do.
And for those that say losing this fight won't have an effect on the IAM members - no lost jobs, etc. - I say just wait. USA320Pilot says something else that is correct. This management can be vindictive, and they have proven that they will push every contract to the breaking point and beyond. We'll see how long it takes them to try to outsource the Boeing heavy maintenance.
Jim
I agree, it's not my fight either. As for the rest of that statement, I disagree. The quality of the maintenance on the airplane I strap on could have a very large effect on not only me and my family, but on my crew, my passengers, and all their families.
As I have said in the past, outside maintenance is not necessarily good or bad. It is the quality of the maintenance that afffects safety, not where it is done. Judging by the posts concerning the first airplane STS worked, I'm not reassured.
Before any IAM members jump all over me, I hope you win this fight. Your work is of known quality, whereas the "lowest bidder" is not. Besides, having you do this work is the "right" thing to do.
And for those that say losing this fight won't have an effect on the IAM members - no lost jobs, etc. - I say just wait. USA320Pilot says something else that is correct. This management can be vindictive, and they have proven that they will push every contract to the breaking point and beyond. We'll see how long it takes them to try to outsource the Boeing heavy maintenance.
Jim
delldude
Veteran
thanks boeing boy...you are on the mark....say, lets expedite the delivery of 190's for example?
then i guess we wouldn't need these old boeings.....
then i guess we wouldn't need these old boeings.....
Dilligas
Veteran
Jim,BoeingBoy said:
I don't think you'll see any Boeing work outsourced. However, look for accelerated retirement of the remaining Boeing fleet and that's where I believe the "60 additional Airbii" carrot comes from.
The fleet isn't growing, its being substituted.
Dilligas,Dilligas said:
I have to agree with you...nothing to date has been said that doesn't support that theory.
Until an announcement is made stating that U will grow the mainline fleet beyond 279 Acft , excluding any possible EMB's they might try to pull over on us , the Boeings future with us is bleak and limited at best.
The ruling on the Airbus Maintenance arbitraition will seal the fate of the Aircraft and many workers as well.
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