USAPA/ALPA US Pilot Labor Thread 5/10-5/17

[ableoneable]

Not totally correct. I personally don't care whether any west pilots join USAPA or not. Membership is not a requirement of anyone. However, dues will still be required from all pilots regardless of affiliation.

Good luck with that.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Until the company simultaneously threatens all west pilots with termination for not paying shop fees I don't see USAPA getting any west money.

I don't know the process in the west contract, on the east side the reference is:

SECTION 29 - AGENCY SHOP AND DUES CHECK-OFF:
(A) Each employee of the Company covered by this Agreement who fails to
voluntarily acquire or maintain membership in the Association shall be required, as a
condition of employment, beginning sixty (60) days after the effective date of this
Agreement or sixty (60) days after the completion of his probationary period, whichever
is later, to pay the Association each month a service charge as a contribution for the
administration of the Agreement and the representation of such employee. The service
charge for the first month shall be in an amount equal to the Association's regular and
usual initiation fees and monthly dues, and for each month thereafter in an amount
equal to the regular and usual monthly dues and periodic assessments (not including
fines and penalties), including MEC assessments (not including fines and penalties)
uniformly required as a condition of acquiring or retaining membership.
(B.) If any employee of the Company covered by this Agreement becomes delinquent
in the payment of this service charge or any Association member becomes delinquent
in payment of his initiation fees and/or dues, and/or periodic assessments (as defined
in Paragraph (A) above), the Association shall notify such employee by certified mail,
return receipt requested, copy to the Company's Vice President - Labor Relations, that
he is delinquent in the payment of such service charge, initiation fee and/or
membership dues and/or periodic assessments as specified herein and is subject to
discharge as an employee of the Company. Such letter shall also notify the employee
that he must remit the required payment within a period of fifteen (15) days or be
discharged.
(C.) If, upon the expiration of the fifteen (15) day period, the employee still remains
delinquent, the Association shall certify in writing to the Company's Vice President -
Labor Relations, copy to the employee, that the employee has failed to remit payment
within the grace period allowed and is therefore to be discharged. The Company's Vice
President - Labor Relations shall thereupon take steps to discharge such employee
from the service of the Company.

As a divided pilot group works to managements advantage I doubt that they are going to threaten 1800 pilots.

Thats OK. Then we'll let the company make up for the dues shortfall. I don't think that will last too long, do you?

Even if this comes to pass there are already grounds for a DFR suit. This will probably be an advantageous time to file the suits and seek injunctive relief for shop fee collection.

Good luck with that. You're going to need it.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

My guess is that the company may be looking to downsize anyway very shortly. What a great way to do it and avoid all the nasty furlough stuff. Best of all, folks wouldn't have a legal leg to stand on.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Good luck with that.

Thanks, but not needed in this case.

 

[ableoneable]

Thanks, but not needed in this case.

So you indicate that you are involved with USAPA but you are not familiar with one of the contracts that you administer. Interesting.


Our section 29 verbiage is similar to the east's.

Of course in ours the "association" mentioned in section 29 is specifically defined as ALPA.

My contract says that if I choose to not be a member of ALPA I have to pay agency shop fees to---- ALPA.

Until USAPA signs a CBA with the company they do not reap the agency shop fee.

USAPA is out of luck and short of funds.

 

[dariencc]

Our section 29 verbiage is similar to the east's.

Of course in ours the "association" mentioned in section 29 is specifically defined as ALPA.

My contract says that if I choose to not be a member of ALPA I have to pay agency shop fees to---- ALPA.

Pure genius. Surely, you missed your calling. To think that one of the great legal minds of the 21st century will go to waste crisscrossing the West in a narrow body jet is tragic beyond words.

USAPA is out of luck and short of funds.

It would save time and effort if Prechillil and yourself would make the above your signature line, since you've been repeating it for months. <_<

 

[ableoneable]

Pure genius. Surely, you missed your calling. To think that one of the great legal minds of the 21st century will go to waste crisscrossing the West in a narrow body jet is tragic beyond words.



It would save time and effort if Prechillil and yourself would make the above your signature line, since you've been repeating it for months. <_<

Typical response. No facts just sarcasm.

To borrow from EastUS's playbook; Insert heavy sigh here.

I guess we just have to learn to tolerate your attitudes until you grow up.

Insert Heavy sigh, crotch scratch, stretch and yawn.

 

[luvn737s]

All USAirways pilots are represented by the elected new bargaining agent USAPA.

Whether they like it or not. Even the ones acting like 6 year olds. That's the law.

So they will represent the west pilots at their section 6 negotiations? Oops, Braddy no likee.

What "Association" are you referring to, the 60's music group who had a hit single "No Fair At All"

http://www.google.com/musicl?lid=uKMcAo3rU...aid=ki_SvveBWxI

 

[prechilill]

We will have to see.

Until the company simultaneously threatens all west pilots with termination for not paying shop fees I don't see USAPA getting any west money.

As a divided pilot group works to managements advantage I doubt that they are going to threaten 1800 pilots.

Even if this comes to pass there are already grounds for a DFR suit. This will probably be an advantageous time to file the suits and seek injunctive relief for shop fee collection.

West pilots do not have to pay dues to the edentulous east union until a new CBA is negotiated.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

So you indicate that you are involved with USAPA but you are not familiar with one of the contracts that you administer. Interesting.


Our section 29 verbiage is similar to the east's.

Of course in ours the "association" mentioned in section 29 is specifically defined as ALPA.

My contract says that if I choose to not be a member of ALPA I have to pay agency shop fees to---- ALPA.

Until USAPA signs a CBA with the company they do not reap the agency shop fee.

USAPA is out of luck and short of funds.

I never said I was involved. Just a volunteer in the card collection. Maybe I should be. As I have been lumped into the group, why not? Thanks for pointing that out.

As so many west posters have pointed out, USAPA inherited the contract. In your mind we inherited only the sections that you feel is pertinent I guess. Very interesting indeed. Sorry for you, there is no free lunch today. Please keep believing that.

 

[luvn737s]

So you indicate that you are involved with USAPA but you are not familiar with one of the contracts that you administer. Interesting.


Our section 29 verbiage is similar to the east's.

Of course in ours the "association" mentioned in section 29 is specifically defined as ALPA.

My contract says that if I choose to not be a member of ALPA I have to pay agency shop fees to---- ALPA.

Until USAPA signs a CBA with the company they do not reap the agency shop fee.

USAPA is out of luck and short of funds.

The east's contract says " It means whatever we say it means which is also subject to change should circumstances require us to alter such definition so as to further benefit us at the expense of our fellow pilots. Please refer to the USAPA policy manual chapter 1 - Why Integrity is Overrated.

 

[prechilill]

I never said I was involved. Just a volunteer in the card collection. Maybe I should be. As I have been lumped into the group, why not? Thanks for pointing that out.

As so many west posters have pointed out, USAPA inherited the contract. In your mind we inherited only the sections that you feel is pertinent I guess. Very interesting indeed. Sorry for you, there is no free lunch today. Please keep believing that.

The law is quite specific regarding collection of agency fees by a new union. Sorry to disappoint, but you will not see much coming from the west until you deliver a contract, which, will probably never happen in the near future. Enjoy your contract.

 

[ableoneable]

I never said I was involved. Just a volunteer in the card collection. Maybe I should be. As I have been lumped into the group, why not? Thanks for pointing that out.

As so many west posters have pointed out, USAPA inherited the contract. In your mind we inherited only the sections that you feel is pertinent I guess. Very interesting indeed. Sorry for you, there is no free lunch today. Please keep believing that.

So if it is something that USAPA wants or needs, section 29 of our CBA they inherit it but if it is something they don't like, say an arbitrated seniority award, they don't inherit it and are free to invent their own list.

So please tell all of us, where is the line of demarcation between what USAPA inherits and what was "flawed" and discardable?


Since you seem to think that all CBA rights assigned to ALPA automatically transfer to USAPA why was it necessary for USAPA to negotiate new sideletters for the ASAP and FOQA programs? According to you USAPA inherited those agreements? Right?

 

[luvn737s]

As so many west posters have pointed out, USAPA inherited the contract. In your mind we inherited only the sections that you feel is pertinent I guess. Very interesting indeed. Sorry for you, there is no free lunch today. Please keep believing that.

No you inherited the whole thing, which happened to have one part with a specific definition.

Too bad. A 10 minute break from the hysteria of rushing to oust ALPA, just to look at the west contract, would have saved a lot of heartache.

Less than 703 days until the next representation election.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

West pilots do not have to pay dues to the edentulous east union until a new CBA is negotiated.

Please keep believing that. Just because your attorney du jour wrote a letter saying past practice of other unions had the same policy you espouse, guess what? We're not other unions. In fact the past egregious behavior of ALPA is the reason why the policy has changed toward dues scofflaws. Believe me, there will be no free representation. Think about it.