Aircraft maint issues

[MetalMover]

I think and I really mean this. You guys should set the bar that those other two need to follow. Pay, benefits AND jobs.

If the company want's those airlines work rules, then just come out and say it..Or maybe they did, hence the suggestion of a mediator.

 

[Vortilon]

So you want to discard the median income for your specific occupation and only accept the information that is convenient for you. I get it.

What makes you any better than an A&P at Eagle, JetBlue, or Omni? Don't all of you work on commercial passenger aircraft? Don't all of you have a license?

Also I love it when a mechanic at American Airlines makes a claim his pay reflects his "experience and expertise" when his pay is solely dependent on seniority rather than productivity, knowledge, or aptitude. That is always good for a laugh.

Why don't you get real?

What you don't get "for whatever reason" is that neither the company or the union uses that median average because it is too vague. It's not a matter of being better than AMTs at the carriers you mentioned so much as choices made by each individual. Why do think there is a revolving door at eagle? Last I checked, the Jetblue AMTs were doing pretty good - so no issue there. Omni? Gimme a break - a charter outfit. No sane AMT is gonna go to school, get his or hers licenses and settle for a lesser paying job. They are stepping stone jobs - resume' builders. We all had to do it, well, most of us. As far as productivity goes, there is a big difference in what being productive is - working live trips on the line versus working in a structured overhaul environment. That line AMT may sit in the ready room like a firemen waiting for a fire, so when his crew chief hands him an assignment - that's where having been there, and done that over the course of 30 years makes a difference. Trust me, it matters, and there is a lot at stake.

 

[Buck]

If the subject of this forum were computer networking and an aircraft mechanic visited their forum to deviate from the subject just to attack than those in computer networking would be upset.

 

[AANOTOK]

I'm a "medium rare" guy...Just kidding Vort.

 

[Hacksawbob]

If the company want's those airlines work rules, then just come out and say it..Or maybe they did, hence the suggestion of a mediator.

Coming out of the ATD meeting in Dallas last week my President is reporting back that Lombardo is totally unprepared for these negotiations and doesn't know a whole lot. The officers in my local seem very concerned. As I said I'm new around here and still trying to learn but this doesn't seem very good.

 

[WeAAsles]

Coming out of the ATD meeting in Dallas last week my President is reporting back that Lombardo is totally unprepared for these negotiations and doesn't know a whole lot. The officers in my local seem very concerned. As I said I'm new around here and still trying to learn but this doesn't seem very good.

Aren't you also the guy that came on a few weeks back and were asking if they were going to be kicking some guy out of the ATD?

They're not.

Which local are you out of? Let's see if we can get this comment of yours checked out?

But I also doubt Harry Lombardo would know all of the exact particulars of any of our contracts but he'll have all the Maintenance and Fleet Presidents and in particular Gary Peterson, Dale Danker, Sean Doyle and Mike Mays to help him to understand areas of importance.

 

[Hacksawbob]

Aren't you also the guy that came on a few weeks back and were asking if they were going to be kicking some guy out of the ATD?

They're not.

Which local are you out of? Let's see if we can get this comment of yours checked out?

But I also doubt Harry Lombardo would know all of the exact particulars of any of our contracts but he'll have all the Maintenance and Fleet Presidents and in particular Gary Peterson, Dale Danker, Sean Doyle and Mike Mays to help him to understand areas of importance.

its good to know that Gary Petersons is going to be there, I have faith Gary Peterson

 

[WeAAsles]

its good to know that Gary Petersons is going to be there, I have faith Gary Peterson

President Peterson has really grown to impress me and I think you guys are lucky to have him as your President. He's putting himself out there to update the members more than any of the other guys in both groups have since the talks started and now with the direct video updates he's getting out the message even more.

Every Local in the TWU should be putting out a once a month Presidents message to inform their members IMO.

 

[swamt]

Not sure about a "setup", but the leaders getting involved now doesn't give me too warm and fuzzy a feeling. For the company NOW to say that mediation probably would be needed means they are far apart on key issues. Sounds to me like they aren't budging on these items and I do not see the leaders changing their positions. For us to get a decent contract seems more likely now that we will all have to give somethings up or concede on certain issues. Otherwise we can find ourselves going on for years without a contract. If the association chooses to dig in and not change their positions, then we will be living under current conditions for quite some time.

Couldn't agree more with you. I too feel the 2 sides are way too far apart and that's usually one of the biggest reasons to ask for mediation, and one other is usually when one sides says "we can't move anymore." And this is what happened in our case. SWA will not move one iota, hence we have not met to nego for mechanics I believe since last year Nov or Dec. and we are not expected to nego mechanics agin even in April as the co. has promised. We were told the co. is still stuck on the instructors and the last week of March will not get them done so not even sure if we will talk mechanics in April or May.
In our case our National Director is in every single contract nego's that he can make. He is not required to be there but he is. He has been in there from the very beginning with some absences while Alaska was also finalizing their new contract that was overwhelmingly voted in. I too don't think it is a set-up. But one of my thoughts are, could it be that they are now calling on both top leaders from TWU and IAM to keep both sides at the table full time in order not to do the back and forth of different leaders from different sides taking over nego's every 2 years and backtracking all the time. Just a thought and would like to hear your take on this thought process.
I too think that the 2 sides are way too far apart especially when dealing with all the differences the way these 2 unions were operating as one. The TWU and IAM have very different ways of doing a lot of things and it will be harder than heck to get either side to concede the way they operate and switch to the other way of doing them unless there is some kind of meeting them half way on a lot of the issues, but I am not so sure there is a way, just too many large differences in the two contracts, seniority as leads and inspectors is just one of them and they still haven't came to any kind of conclusion on that yet and it was the first one they started to work on as far as differences. I hate to say it but I think you guys will go past the 2018 CBA date. We are going on 5 years and I would expect you guys to go as long if not longer than us.

 

[DallasConehead]

What you don't get "for whatever reason" is that neither the company or the union uses that median average because it is too vague. It's not a matter of being better than AMTs at the carriers you mentioned so much as choices made by each individual. Why do think there is a revolving door at eagle? Last I checked, the Jetblue AMTs were doing pretty good - so no issue there. Omni? Gimme a break - a charter outfit. No sane AMT is gonna go to school, get his or hers licenses and settle for a lesser paying job. They are stepping stone jobs - resume' builders. We all had to do it, well, most of us. As far as productivity goes, there is a big difference in what being productive is - working live trips on the line versus working in a structured overhaul environment. That line AMT may sit in the ready room like a firemen waiting for a fire, so when his crew chief hands him an assignment - that's where having been there, and done that over the course of 30 years makes a difference. Trust me, it matters, and there is a lot at stake.

Very well put V, it's difficult to explain to baggage handlers the concept, especially in the face of the fact that some don't comprehend very well.

It's difficult for them in their position to understand, for example when a full triple going over the pond air interrupts back to Dallas for a system failure on an etops required system and because of your knowledge and expertise you are able to get it back out in less then 60 minutes with no ots. Most of us working etops have played about in this very situation and done this very thing. This is just one thing that we do which makes us valuable.

You know, as an FAA Certificated Airman with the Ratings of Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic, I'm just not sure why we keep explaining things to morons.

 

[WeAAsles]

Very well put V, it's difficult to explain to baggage handlers the concept, especially in the face of the fact that some don't comprehend very well.

It's difficult for them in their position to understand, for example when a full triple going over the pond air interrupts back to Dallas for a system failure on an etops required system and because of your knowledge and expertise you are able to get it back out in less then 60 minutes with no ots. Most of us working etops have played about in this very situation and done this very thing. This is just one thing that we do which makes us valuable.

You know, as an FAA Certificated Airman with the Ratings of Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic, I'm just not sure why we keep explaining things to morons.

I agree with you 100% that Vortilon is an immensely qualified Professional that should be well compensated for the skills he presents to this company daily to keep our passengers flying safely and on time to their destinations.

But what the heck you do for the airline is where I'm stymied?

 

[DallasConehead]

Given the right circumstances many of you could end up working at an MRO for 25 an hour.

No,,,, that wouldnt happen. I'd take my tools home, take whats left of my pension, draw ss benefits, and starting drawing on my million+ 401k stash. Moron.

 

[WeAAsles]

No,,,, that wouldnt happen. I'd take my tools home, take whats left of my pension, draw ss benefits, and starting drawing on my million+ 401k stash. Moron.

I guess the 03 cuts didn't hurt you too bad. Must be nice living in DFW and being overpaid?

 

[swamt]

No,,,, that wouldnt happen. I'd take my tools home, take whats left of my pension, draw ss benefits, and starting drawing on my million+ 401k stash. Moron.

So nice to hear that some mechanics are more than prepared to retire at the drop of a hat if need be. I am in the same boat as you, however, at my carrier we have 65-80 year olds still working o/t just to get by, not all, but some. The others are just banking $$$ and slamming their 401K's, SPP's, and retirement. Great job on your saving for retirement, to this day I still read that almost 75% of people in their 50's only have approx. 150K-250K saved in retirement other than SS, sad but true.

 

[DallasConehead]

So nice to hear that some mechanics are more than prepared to retire at the drop of a hat if need be. I am in the same boat as you, however, at my carrier we have 65-80 year olds still working o/t just to get by, not all, but some. The others are just banking $$$ and slamming their 401K's, SPP's, and retirement. Great job on your saving for retirement, to this day I still read that almost 75% of people in their 50's only have approx. 150K-250K saved in retirement other than SS, sad but true.

Its a result of what an old guy told me years ago, " hey kid its not what you earn but what you spend." A lifetime of not owning new cars or big houses, but instead choosing to live below the means and not living in a high cost area, but instead packing up and leaving that area even though it was a nice place. Choices.