AMFA Organizing Drive to Replace Association

[iluvaa]

We’ve hired like 500 new hires in Tulsa this year and I won’t vote for them to be in IAM pension fund. I was a yes voter until this

 

[Vortilon]

Look at this latest Association update. Somehow in 8 months time, the Asssociation has lost the Delta or SWA plus 3%, they have lost the pathetic $3K signing bonus to a interst free $3K loan. The annual raises guarantees have been reduced to allow for us to be surpassed by Delta or Southwest. Where has the value in those losses been redistributed to? No transparency Association strikes again. No mention of the TWU holding out for their pipe dream of future title II headcount guarantees. Or the IAM thinking they will somehow be the only group out of 120k employees with the Cadillac health insurance plan.

We are no closer to an AIP than we were 3 years ago. Look the company isn't without guilt in this matter, as they have lied all the way through the process. We expect that though. The Association has it's own priorities, and they don't align with the current members - as we stand to lose another $30k in pay and benefits - moving another day closer to the next "force majeure" event or BK filing.

 

[swamt]

With updates like this how can we be almost wrapped up? These are big issues still to be worked out.
Pay raises? Vacation? Payroll changes? 401k vs IAMPF, retro, signing bonus?

Problem is it's an all me too for all association groups. All for one and one for all.

THIS IS THE ONE AND ONLY MAJOR REASON WE ALL NEED TO NEGOTIATE FOR OUR TITLE GROUPS SEPARATELY.

Let's get these cards signed at a record pace. I can't see guys not pissed enough to say let's wait or we are almost there.

Sign, sign, sign!!

Agree. You forgot one of the biggest of them all Scope for not just one group but all groups in this contract that is huge still.

 

[1AA]

Maybe AA is dragging their feet so we can have enough time to separate ourselves from the ramp. Do we want that 7th week of vc?
Won't get it with the association because they want it for everyone.
We need to really test the waters and see how AA will negotiate with just us two title groups. Strength in numbers will work when it's title 1 and 2 together. It's not working in it's current form for the AMT'S and related. Ramp probably knows this and is terrified what might happen if we dump them and go on our own.

 

[swamt]

Last update from the association just got a bit more detailed on how we are getting hosed. Looks like the card drive is threatened the association. Keep them coming guys. Let's get a vote soon and see what AA has to offer us if we go in with just title 1 and 2 into negotiations. We need to explore that possibility. We know we got nothing with the association. Way too many groups lumped in together.

Indeed. It also reflects on their lies about going into the weekend with talks. These talks were done on Fri 13th. And I mean earlier than most think. This update was discussed at length by cmte members, written, approved by union leadership so not to reveal too much info., and then posted to the bulletin boards all on Fri after talks died. It just proves that the nego's ended earlier that day. Probably a typical early release on a Fri. before the weekend. But as someone (maybe you 1AA) posted before that the talks would continue "as long as there was progress", speaks volumes on how much progress was not made yet again. They just keep stringing along the membership. Don't be fooled by the asso. lies and misinformation keep those cards coming in fast and furious in this very energetic drive for AMFA representation. but ya might wanna hurry, there are two other airlines doing the same now.
Here's the official update and time stamped that progress came to a halt. I will add that at least AMFA and our new co nego cmte really did hammer ours out over a weekend. There is no reason why AA and the asso. couldn't as well, unless they are just hitting brick walls with this asso.;

Sisters and Brothers,

Over the past several weeks, the Association, the NMB and American Airlines have been working to reach the tentative agreement our members have been promised and rightfully deserve. As most of you know, we also agreed to limit communications in a manner that would not create more rumor or inuendo from either side.

Management Negotiators are frequently absent from these negotiations which was the primary reason for not continuing face-to-face negotiations this week. We also had requested that the NMB allow us to negotiate the week of Thanksgiving, but the Company Negotiators passed on that opportunity as well. We have yet to see Robert Isom or Doug Parker, who we believe are calling the shots from Texas, engage in any negotiating session since the day negotiations started.

With that said, we felt it was imperative at this point to provide a fact-based update to our members about some of the key items that remain open. Below represents a few of the outrageous items Management Negotiators have not provided acceptable solutions to. Please keep in mind that while you may not see an issue listed, others are open, and we cannot agree to a Tentative Agreement until they are all resolved.

Compensation: Management negotiators have walked backwards from their previous public statements and are now only offering the Pay of Delta or Southwest, and with managements 2% out year raises, our members will fall behind in pay once again. This is something CEO Parker has stated would not happen.

Retro Pay: Company Negotiators have flat out insulted our members with their demand for a zero retro payout and have offered a “bonus” that will not cover the missing payday loan they are asking of nearly three quarters of the Association Membership. Remember, retro is a one-time payment to our members for the labor we provide that earns billions of dollars for this company. Our retro pay is no different than management’s stock buy backs of 3.8 billion in 2015, $4.5 billion in 2016, $1.4 billion in 2017 and $2 billion in 2018, except it is in the millions – NOT BILLIONS!

Payroll System: Management is also demanding our members who aren’t paid two weeks in arrears agree to a self-funded Company payday loan demand, so they can switch payroll systems. Obviously, we are fighting this demand since they must pay members weekly by law in some locations. We know the system will accommodate the way our members are currently paid, it just takes more effort on Management’s part to do. Management Negotiators have not offered any other solution to their payroll problem, other than demand our members accept the change to two weeks’ pay in arrears. Just this past week, they made another insulting attempt to convince us the switch was not as bad as we say. Later, Management finally admitted they are demanding TWU members, who are paid biweekly, would be funding an 80 hour payday loan to themselves in order for American to make the payroll change.

Scope Protection: We also remain apart on Scope Protection for our members. Management Negotiators continue to make demands that we accept their proposal that we do significantly less work in the future than we do today. These open items are Scope provisions that we currently have, and are fighting to protect, not additional items.

Vacation: Finally, we are so significantly apart on Vacation that every member should be disgusted with how American views us compared to Management. Their proposal insults all of us by demanding a 5th week of vacation at 25 years and a 6th week of vacation at 30 years, even though management enjoys a 5th week of vacation at 17 years “right now.” Our members have earned the 6th week of vacation at 25 years through the sacrifices made in the work we do.

We are in ongoing discussions with the NMB to solidify additional days and continue negotiations in person or by phone. We remain willing to meet anytime and anywhere, for as long as it is necessary, to achieve the long overdue JCBA our members deserve.

Please Post on All TWU- IAM Bulletin Boards

PDF Version: Association-Bulletin-12/13/19Download
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[TWU informer]

And still today we have some that believe everything these liars tell them!
Can't Fix Stupid

 

[JREwing]

Indeed. It also reflects on their lies about going into the weekend with talks. These talks were done on Fri 13th. And I mean earlier than most think. This update was discussed at length by cmte members, written, approved by union leadership so not to reveal too much info., and then posted to the bulletin boards all on Fri after talks died. It just proves that the nego's ended earlier that day. Probably a typical early release on a Fri. before the weekend. But as someone (maybe you 1AA) posted before that the talks would continue "as long as there was progress", speaks volumes on how much progress was not made yet again. They just keep stringing along the membership. Don't be fooled by the asso. lies and misinformation keep those cards coming in fast and furious in this very energetic drive for AMFA representation. but ya might wanna hurry, there are two other airlines doing the same now.
Here's the official update and time stamped that progress came to a halt. I will add that at least AMFA and our new co nego cmte really did hammer ours out over a weekend. There is no reason why AA and the asso. couldn't as well, unless they are just hitting brick walls with this asso.;

Sisters and Brothers,

Over the past several weeks, the Association, the NMB and American Airlines have been working to reach the tentative agreement our members have been promised and rightfully deserve. As most of you know, we also agreed to limit communications in a manner that would not create more rumor or inuendo from either side.

Management Negotiators are frequently absent from these negotiations which was the primary reason for not continuing face-to-face negotiations this week. We also had requested that the NMB allow us to negotiate the week of Thanksgiving, but the Company Negotiators passed on that opportunity as well. We have yet to see Robert Isom or Doug Parker, who we believe are calling the shots from Texas, engage in any negotiating session since the day negotiations started.

With that said, we felt it was imperative at this point to provide a fact-based update to our members about some of the key items that remain open. Below represents a few of the outrageous items Management Negotiators have not provided acceptable solutions to. Please keep in mind that while you may not see an issue listed, others are open, and we cannot agree to a Tentative Agreement until they are all resolved.

Compensation: Management negotiators have walked backwards from their previous public statements and are now only offering the Pay of Delta or Southwest, and with managements 2% out year raises, our members will fall behind in pay once again. This is something CEO Parker has stated would not happen.

Retro Pay: Company Negotiators have flat out insulted our members with their demand for a zero retro payout and have offered a “bonus” that will not cover the missing payday loan they are asking of nearly three quarters of the Association Membership. Remember, retro is a one-time payment to our members for the labor we provide that earns billions of dollars for this company. Our retro pay is no different than management’s stock buy backs of 3.8 billion in 2015, $4.5 billion in 2016, $1.4 billion in 2017 and $2 billion in 2018, except it is in the millions – NOT BILLIONS!

Payroll System: Management is also demanding our members who aren’t paid two weeks in arrears agree to a self-funded Company payday loan demand, so they can switch payroll systems. Obviously, we are fighting this demand since they must pay members weekly by law in some locations. We know the system will accommodate the way our members are currently paid, it just takes more effort on Management’s part to do. Management Negotiators have not offered any other solution to their payroll problem, other than demand our members accept the change to two weeks’ pay in arrears. Just this past week, they made another insulting attempt to convince us the switch was not as bad as we say. Later, Management finally admitted they are demanding TWU members, who are paid biweekly, would be funding an 80 hour payday loan to themselves in order for American to make the payroll change.

Scope Protection: We also remain apart on Scope Protection for our members. Management Negotiators continue to make demands that we accept their proposal that we do significantly less work in the future than we do today. These open items are Scope provisions that we currently have, and are fighting to protect, not additional items.

Vacation: Finally, we are so significantly apart on Vacation that every member should be disgusted with how American views us compared to Management. Their proposal insults all of us by demanding a 5th week of vacation at 25 years and a 6th week of vacation at
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Maybe AA is dragging their feet so we can have enough time to separate ourselves from the ramp. Do we want that 7th week of vc?
Won't get it with the association because they want it for everyone.
We need to really test the waters and see how AA will negotiate with just us two title groups. Strength in numbers will work when it's title 1 and 2 together. It's not working in it's current form for the AMT'S and related. Ramp probably knows this and is terrified what might happen if we dump them and go on our own.

Knock yourself out

 

[1AA]

Knock yourself out

Before the company knocks both you and I out. I'm trying, what are you doing? Waiting for the next update that either says we are close or says nothing? We pay dues for representation that the TWU wants from us and to represent us. Is this the quality of representation we are paying them for? We have choices and this is a democracy not a dictatorship. Start exercising your choices.

 

[Topcat187]

Maybe AA is dragging their feet so we can have enough time to separate ourselves from the ramp. Do we want that 7th week of vc?
Won't get it with the association because they want it for everyone.
We need to really test the waters and see how AA will negotiate with just us two title groups. Strength in numbers will work when it's title 1 and 2 together. It's not working in it's current form for the AMT'S and related. Ramp probably knows this and is terrified what might happen if we dump them and go on our own.

I'm not a fortune teller, but I'm pretty sure the companys master plan isn't to wait so they can give more. These clowns running the place dont want to pay anyone but themselves. Dont fool yourself into thinking the company is going to give you everything you want.

 

[1AA]

I'm not a fortune teller, but I'm pretty sure the companys master plan isn't to wait so they can give more. These clowns running the place dont want to pay anyone but themselves. Dont fool yourself into thinking the company is going to give you everything you want.

Did I say I want everything?
Funny.

 

[Topcat187]

Did I say I want everything?
Funny.

I do agree that there is no reason why the AMTs shouldn't be able to match UAL with 7 weeks of VC.

 

[Duke787]

I'm not a fortune teller, but I'm pretty sure the companys master plan isn't to wait so they can give more. These clowns running the place dont want to pay anyone but themselves. Dont fool yourself into thinking the company is going to give you everything you want.

I think aa is willing to pay for the skill levels, but I don’t think aa is willing to give away their option to lay-off if needed, plus give guarantees that a auto mech will never get laid off from MCI, or that de icing in dfw or aus will be done by full time ramp, all things being negotiated by our union. Pretty sure our contract would have been wrapped up long ago like pilots and FAs if we weren’t in the association.

Strength in numbers is a proven falsehood. Strength in one union one voice.

Not 2 unions with 20 different jobs.

 

[swamt]

I do agree that there is no reason why the AMTs shouldn't be able to match UAL with 7 weeks of VC.

Agree. There is no reason not to get back that long lost 7th week. I could only wish we got 7 weeks here.

I think aa is willing to pay for the skill levels, but I don’t think aa is willing to give away their option to lay-off if needed, plus give guarantees that a auto mech will never get laid off from MCI, or that de icing in dfw or aus will be done by full time ramp, all things being negotiated by our union. Pretty sure our contract would have been wrapped up long ago like pilots and FAs if we weren’t in the association.

Strength in numbers is a proven falsehood. Strength in one union one voice.

Not 2 unions with 20 different jobs.

Well said Duke.

 

[1AA]

And still today we have some that believe everything these liars tell them!
Can't Fix Stupid

 

[robbedagain]

Maybe AA is dragging their feet so we can have enough time to separate ourselves from the ramp. Do we want that 7th week of vc?
Won't get it with the association because they want it for everyone.
We need to really test the waters and see how AA will negotiate with just us two title groups. Strength in numbers will work when it's title 1 and 2 together. It's not working in it's current form for the AMT'S and related. Ramp probably knows this and is terrified what might happen if we dump them and go on our own.

As a ramp agent i feel you mtr should have your own craft union. What i dont know is if its fleet or mtr holding the other up. I dont like hearing that but ive heard it. My response to that is its mgmt n union talking. Not talking. Personally id like to see mtr get their own union