Transport Workers and Machinist Union to Jointly Represent Ground Workers at the "New" American Airl

[WNMECH]

No comparison. Ask how many SWA get the 9.3% match, not even 25% do because they don't contribute the max.

Where do you get this from?
Everyone I know puts in at least 10% to their 401k and get the full match, plus most put something into the employee stock purchase program also.
I put over 15% in my 401 k.

 

[swamt]

Where do you get this from?
Everyone I know puts in at least 10% to their 401k and get the full match, plus most put something into the employee stock purchase program also.
I put over 15% in my 401 k.

I was going to ask the same but I didn't have exact numbers to respond with. If I were to guess it would be around 85-90% of members are putting into the 401K. Not all are putting the same, but most are anywhere from 10% to 25% and a small percentage of "old timers" are catching up with 50% contributions going in. My percentiles are actually low, but I do remember an article talking about the SWA 401K's comparing them to other employers 401K's and I remember reading a 90-95% input from the members. Where the heck he got this 25% number is beyond me. More than likely just another person spouting off with out facts on SWA.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Where do you get this from?
Everyone I know puts in at least 10% to their 401k and get the full match, plus most put something into the employee stock purchase program also.
I put over 15% in my 401 k.

Most at WN put in and get the max match. regards,

 

[FWAAA]

Any mechanic at WN who isn't maxing out their 401k and getting the maximum match either needs financial counseling or is just too stupid to be allowed to work on airplanes. When you're making nearly $100k (easily with a little overtime), and you're making far more than the typical UA/US/DL/AA mechanic, there's no excuse for living paycheck to paycheck and not saving for your retirement.

 

[Kev3188]

The bottom line is the IAM pension will provide USA and AA employees to retire with security. What do you propose? Let me guess a 401k.

Sounds good to me.

* Members have control over their money NOW, not "someday."

* Survivorship benefits aren't reduced like they are w/a pension

* No more "we gotta save the pension" sword of Damocles hanging over labor's head

...And yeah, I have a pension. Two, of them, actually.

No comparison. Ask how many SWA get the 9.3% match, not even 25% do because they don't contribute the max.

Source?

 

[blue collar]

Any mechanic at WN who isn't maxing out their 401k and getting the maximum match either needs financial counseling or is just too stupid to be allowed to work on airplanes. When you're making nearly $100k (easily with a little overtime), and you're making far more than the typical UA/US/DL/AA mechanic, there's no excuse for living paycheck to paycheck and not saving for your retirement.

I know one or two who aren't, but they have families and they took a pay cut to come to swa. I took a paycut to come here, but I am putting 10% in. It's free money, it'd be stupid not to.

 

[Socplat13]

The fleet rate of $81 was true but stick with the facts as we move forward. The IAM penstion trustees agreed to slash the schedule so on January 1 fleet goes to about $45 bucks. More importantly, once bitten twice shy! Gosh I hope our NC is negotiating company contributions into the 401k and leaving the IAM pension rate the same. It honestly doesn't make any sense to allow the company to give our hard earned money to the IAM pension only for the IAM pension to determine future benefit amounts that can be slashed again and again. There is NO SECURE future with the IAM pension as we have already seen it can be whacked. regards,

You didn't answer the question, so I'll ask it again: How much money would one have to save in a 401k to buy an annuity that pays a monthly benefit of, let say, $2500 per month for life at 62 years of age? I will tell you, because you will definitely not answer that one, so you can educate yourself on retirement security.

Let's say Joe wants to retire at 62 and he figures that to have a nice retirement he needs about 2500 bucks per month to do so. He's married and wants his wife to be cared for if something happens to him. Let's say Joe lives to 78, the average life expectancy for males and his wife lives to 81, the average for females in the US. Joe then goes shopping for a 19 year annuity that guarantees $2500 per month. The actuary from Insurance company x says, we'll fix you at an 8% growth rate on your money--the average for the stock market--for 19 years at $2500 per month guaranteed. Joe needs to fork over $292,018.74.

You know what the average 401k savings is in this country? In 2012 in reached a record high of $77,300. So, can you see the problem?

Let's look at the USA Fleet IAM pension. You were in, I think, in 2008. So, Let's say you averaged 80 bucks per year from 2008-2013.
6X80=480, vested.
Now, in 2014 the the switch to Scedule B occurs. Lets say the IAM increases the COMPANY's current contribution from $1.05 per hour to $1.20 per hour. That brings you up to $54.05. Then let's you receive an average of $.10 per year for 20 years until you retire.
Consevatively, for a USA Fleet that would be $2629 per month for life. LIFE. Not 19 years. Best part, you don't fund it, the company does.

Also, Tim, how many proposals were submitted to the USA Fleet negotiating committee to get out of the IAMNPP? You act like the IAM forces its members into the plan. If you want out, why not reject any agreement in which the IAMNPP is part of? If switching to a 401k match BS plan is what the USA Fleet membership then it should be negotiated. I have a funny feeling not too many proposals were submitted to get out of the IAMNPP. Just sayin.

 

[700UW]

Actually fleet was in the plan before 2008 if I remember correctly.

 

[Tim Nelson]

You didn't answer the question, so I'll ask it again: How much money would one have to save in a 401k to buy an annuity that pays a monthly benefit of, let say, $2500 per month for life at 62 years of age? I will tell you, because you will definitely not answer that one, so you can educate yourself on retirement security.

Let's say Joe wants to retire at 62 and he figures that to have a nice retirement he needs about 2500 bucks per month to do so. He's married and wants his wife to be cared for if something happens to him. Let's say Joe lives to 78, the average life expectancy for males and his wife lives to 81, the average for females in the US. Joe then goes shopping for a 19 year annuity that guarantees $2500 per month. The actuary from Insurance company x says, we'll fix you at an 8% growth rate on your money--the average for the stock market--for 19 years at $2500 per month guaranteed. Joe needs to fork over $292,018.74.

You know what the average 401k savings is in this country? In 2012 in reached a record high of $77,300. So, can you see the problem?

Let's look at the USA Fleet IAM pension. You were in, I think, in 2008. So, Let's say you averaged 80 bucks per year from 2008-2013.
6X80=480, vested.
Now, in 2014 the the switch to Scedule B occurs. Lets say the IAM increases the COMPANY's current contribution from $1.05 per hour to $1.20 per hour. That brings you up to $54.05. Then let's you receive an average of $.10 per year for 20 years until you retire.
Consevatively, for a USA Fleet that would be $2629 per month for life. LIFE. Not 19 years. Best part, you don't fund it, the company does.

Also, Tim, how many proposals were submitted to the USA Fleet negotiating committee to get out of the IAMNPP? You act like the IAM forces its members into the plan. If you want out, why not reject any agreement in which the IAMNPP is part of? If switching to a 401k match BS plan is what the USA Fleet membership then it should be negotiated. I have a funny feeling not too many proposals were submitted to get out of the IAMNPP. Just sayin.

That "IAM math" is just outright silly. First off, our members have been in the plan since 2003 and nobody was really complaining about it until the IAM betrayed our members and slashed 40% of their future benefits. You left that part out. And the trustees sent us a letter saying it could happen again, which is reasonable to assume. The NC does what Delaney insist so you are probably correct in saying that the NC didn't submit one proposal asking to increase the 401k we already have. I know many, including myself submitted survey responses asking the NC not to give any more money to thieves who steal our pensions. Our 'current' future benefits which are subject to change and be slashed once again is only $46 a month. The insecurity of the situation of having no control on this money is also a big risk. Your math is fuzzy since you have some huge assumptions that have never happened. 1. Over ten years, the company only put in an additional nickel. Not the .10 yearly increases. Besides, put the increases in my base wage instead of the IAM coffers anyways. 2. You forgot the spousal offset that whacks the benefit further for anyone who wants to provide for their spouse. 3. You forgot to mention how the benefits can be SUSPENDED if someone wants to retire and find another job. It's a scam for sure. I'm tired of the BS. Am I stuck with the IAM pension? Yes but there is no logical reason to dump the AMR agents into it and subject their money to the IAM pension trustees to do what they see fit. Given the trend of these dinosauric defined pensions, they are in bigtime warning zones!!! Laws in Washington are attempting to be changed right now to even steal 'current' benies from retirees. So, once again as in social security, I would rather be in something that I can control as opposed to losing my benefits to an entity that needs to stay green on my dime. regards,

 

[WNMECH]

Let's say Joe wants to retire at 62 and he figures that to have a nice retirement he needs about 2500 bucks per month to do so. He's married and wants his wife to be cared for if something happens to him. Let's say Joe lives to 78, the average life expectancy for males and his wife lives to 81, the average for females in the US. Joe then goes shopping for a 19 year annuity that guarantees $2500 per month. The actuary from Insurance company x says, we'll fix you at an 8% growth rate on your money--the average for the stock market--for 19 years at $2500 per month guaranteed. Joe needs to fork over $292,018.74.

I have more than that in my SWA 401k and profit sharing accounts now and am about 15 years from retirement.

My 401k website says I am on track to receive over $82k a year at retirement if I don't raise my contributions, but I will in the next couple years.

I have complete control of my money and investments.

Most people here at SWA understand perfectly how to use their 401k to save for the future because that is the vehicle we use.
Not everyone is financially stupid as you would like to claim.

 

[FWAAA]

I know one or two who aren't, but they have families and they took a pay cut to come to swa. I took a paycut to come here, but I am putting 10% in. It's free money, it'd be stupid not to.

Good point. Your post brings up the acceptable exception to my overly broad characterization - and that's the few relatively new hires at WN who took big paycuts to start over at the bottom. My comment relates to those who are topped out and thus earning far more money than the comparable legacy network mechanics.

 

[WNMECH]

Good point. Your post brings up the acceptable exception to my overly broad characterization - and that's the few relatively new hires at WN who took big paycuts to start over at the bottom. My comment relates to those who are topped out and thus earning far more money than the comparable legacy network mechanics.

You are correct.
I checked the mechanics seniority list and over 83% are topped out, which includes the ex-AirTran folks.

 

[Tim Nelson]

I have more than that in my SWA 401k and profit sharing accounts now and am about 15 years from retirement.

My 401k website says I am on track to receive over $82k a year at retirement if I don't raise my contributions, but I will in the next couple years.

I have complete control of my money and investments.

Most people here at SWA understand perfectly how to use their 401k to save for the future because that is the vehicle we use.
Not everyone is financially stupid as you would like to claim.

you are absolutely correct. The IAM thinks people are dumb. But again, the IAM pension is on shifting sand that you can't control. The trends and history of defined benefits also STRONGLY suggest everyone in these dinosauric plans are at risk of losing most of their benefits. If the new legislation in congress becomes law then even when you retire, the IAM pension trustees can steal your benefits to stay 'green'. LMAO

 

[FWAAA]

Of all the reasons to select a union to represent you, the maintenance of a defined benefit pension appears to be a pretty poor justification, IMO. A better union would be one that has successfully negotiated and maintained a meaningful, substantial defined contribution retirement program, along with substantially higher wages with which to fund that DC retirement. AMFA and the experience of WN mechanics looks like a successful model to follow.

An industrial union like the IAM? Meh.

 

[swamt]

Of all the reasons to select a union to represent you, the maintenance of a defined benefit pension appears to be a pretty poor justification, IMO. A better union would be one that has successfully negotiated and maintained a meaningful, substantial defined contribution retirement program, along with substantially higher wages with which to fund that DC retirement. AMFA and the experience of WN mechanics looks like a successful model to follow.

An industrial union like the IAM? Meh.

This was taken right off the teamsters for US airways front page:











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IMPORTANT PENSION INFORMATION



With a strong track record of fighting for and winning safe, stable pensions, the Teamsters are our best choice to secure a retirement plan at the new combined carrier. Get the facts on our pension at US Airways. Click here to read the factsheet.

How can they print that when Hoffa has already signed off on reducing the benefits of the pensions the teamsters are a part of. Good god when will it stop? It's already out in the public and they have the balls to post this. You guys DO NOT want the crooked teamsters anywhere near your pensions, this is fact. If you bring the teamsters in you can say bye-bye to your pensions...