twu international unaccountable

[Anomaly]

They fell for the teamsters lies and campaign reteric which they have not delivered on (as I have read here) one item promised except for, drum role pls, yes the increase of their dues to 2.5 times base, but oh, wait, it's actually more than 2.5 times base, as the teamsters also include some premium pay as part of the dues payment, at least I know they did here at SWA.
Now they are really regretting voting the teamsters in. I really think the membership at UAL should have voted in new local level officers, rather than a new union. I am sure the UAL mechs are wishing they never did this now. You know the ole saying, "you never know what you got until it's gone" I believe this fully applies at UAL currently. Bottom line is, UA is even more unsatisfied with the teamsters. Too bad they are stuck with them for a couple of years now.

Where do you get this from? As Far as I know there are two regular posters on this thread from United Airlines. TSH and me. One hates the IBT and the other thinks they are doing a decent job. The lack of other opinions for either position would suggest that most UA mechanics either simply do not care, or are quite content. At my station, there are a few who try to keep up the argument to switch unions once again, but most of us are done with this nonsense especially since for the most part we are all better off now than we were just a year ago thanks to the Teamsters. No other work group at UAL can say that.

 

[737823]

Josh, quite admirable to come to Bob's defense. I have no international position. Expose all the facts you want. What am I covering up? The membership is unhappy with the TWU because the spineless line local presidents choose to misrepresent the facts and lie to the membership. Many members on the floor contact the ATD directly because our local officers are too worried about going back to the floor and actually having to bid a crew.

I am a union member working the line and I approved this message.

Say what you want but its clear most here think you are an international rep that comes on bombasting Bob Owens and defending ineffective strategy used by the international and cheering on concessions. I've found many of Bob's "facts" and assertions suspect over the years and I call him out when that is the case. It's fine to disagree with someone but you should recognize and respect a different point of view. Why are you such a staunch supporter of the TWU? Do you have some interest in them representing AA mechanics?

Josh

 

[AA89]

last post on this, sorry about the highjack.

I believe the hard working folks who joined the scumbags of occupy, are all liberial zombies who want more liberials in power period.

Show me a conservative who fell for this "divide the country" between the 1% and 99% crap.

So do you blame ALL your problems on the top 1% too?

Your tendancy to pigeonhole someone over a single issue is at least consistent. It might surprise you that there are a lot of hard working people that sympathise with the occupy issues. Zombies? Or people open minded enough to think outside the "conservative" blowhard talking heads bs.Only that line of thinking would lead to you ask your closing question. Zombie indeed.

 

[WNMECH]

Your tendancy to pigeonhole someone over a single issue is at least consistent. It might surprise you that there are a lot of hard working people that sympathise with the occupy issues. Zombies? Or people open minded enough to think outside the "conservative" blowhard talking heads bs.Only that line of thinking would lead to you ask your closing question. Zombie indeed.

You prove my point.
Liberial.

 

[DNTULSA]

I am a union member working the line and I approved this message.

I doubt that you have WORKED for AA longer than 6 months!

What local union post do you hold?

 

[AA89]

You prove my point.
Liberial.

LIBERIAL? That's a new one. Did rush invent that?

 

[TWU informer]

LIBERIAL? That's a new one. Did rush invent that?

Just as the Airline Industry divides us into different unions bickering instead of fighting, so too do the Politicians, Media, and US Government.

We are mostly our own worst enemy against one another.

 

[WNMECH]

LIBERIAL? That's a new one. Did rush invent that?

Sorry I misspelled Liberal.
Try thinking outside that little box of yours.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Back to the topic's title...

Enjoy our raises in medical costs as those who are appointed will enjoy no raise in their medical costs.

 

[Overspeed]

Back to the topic's title...

Enjoy our raises in medical costs as those who are appointed will enjoy no raise in their medical costs.

The pilots and FA's are getting the same deal. But that must be the TWU's fault as well right Ken? It couldn't be the BK process that screwed everyone over. You are getting the shaft because Corporate America is succeeding at selling to the public that union workers are the reason the economy sucks. It can't be that government reduced regulation to a level that allows pretty much unrestricted outsourcing of good paying jobs while execs and bankers get richer and we get poorer. I'm sure all of that is Jim Little's fault too.

 

[Vortilon]

The pilots and FA's are getting the same deal. But that must be the TWU's fault as well right Ken? It couldn't be the BK process that screwed everyone over. You are getting the shaft because Corporate America is succeeding at selling to the public that union workers are the reason the economy sucks. It can't be that government reduced regulation to a level that allows pretty much unrestricted outsourcing of good paying jobs while execs and bankers get richer and we get poorer. I'm sure all of that is Jim Little's fault too.

Well, just what group does Jim Little and his fellow TWU International elite fit into? They can talk the talk, but the rest of us don't see them walking the walk! Double digit raises every year, expense accounts, with a benefits package that would make most business executives blush. Try your spin somewhere else. PS, I really doubt you're a line mechanic.

 

[Bob Owens]

The pilots and FA's are getting the same deal. But that must be the TWU's fault as well right Ken? It couldn't be the BK process that screwed everyone over. You are getting the shaft because Corporate America is succeeding at selling to the public that union workers are the reason the economy sucks. It can't be that government reduced regulation to a level that allows pretty much unrestricted outsourcing of good paying jobs while execs and bankers get richer and we get poorer. I'm sure all of that is Jim Little's fault too.

They didn't get the same deal, they got better deals if you look at where they stand amongst their peer group.

I know, you are going to say we had to agree to bottom of the industry in everything to save jobs, but please don't insult our intelligence by saying that having one week less vacation than everybody else in the industry saves jobs, if anything it allows the company to get 40 more hours per year from every worker, thus eliminating one worker for every 50 workers that lost the week.

Tell us again, whats the limit as to how many jobs the company can outsource? Oh thats right, there is no defined number of jobs that are protected, because there is no system protection. They are limited, in theory, to 35 percent of the maintenance spend on outsourcing, subject to change driven by things we do not control. You try to spin that and make people believe that means 65% of the jobs are "protected" but you know thats a lie. The fact is they can and my dump a lot more than 35% of the headcount, Gless admits that we will drop below 8000, or around what they threatened if we rejected the LBO, the first one, then they had us vote again. Thing is even if we had rejected LBOII they still would not have had anyplace to send their MD80s. And when the MD-80s leave, so will many of the jobs you claimed we saved. But we will still be at the very bottom of the industry, even lower than non-union, and they dont have to pay $600 a year for that.

 

[Overspeed]

They didn't get the same deal, they got better deals if you look at where they stand amongst their peer group.

I know, you are going to say we had to agree to bottom of the industry in everything to save jobs, but please don't insult our intelligence by saying that having one week less vacation than everybody else in the industry saves jobs, if anything it allows the company to get 40 more hours per year from every worker, thus eliminating one worker for every 50 workers that lost the week.

Tell us again, whats the limit as to how many jobs the company can outsource? Oh thats right, there is no defined number of jobs that are protected, because there is no system protection. They are limited, in theory, to 35 percent of the maintenance spend on outsourcing, subject to change driven by things we do not control. You try to spin that and make people believe that means 65% of the jobs are "protected" but you know thats a lie. The fact is they can and my dump a lot more than 35% of the headcount, Gless admits that we will drop below 8000, or around what they threatened if we rejected the LBO, the first one, then they had us vote again. Thing is even if we had rejected LBOII they still would not have had anyplace to send their MD80s. And when the MD-80s leave, so will many of the jobs you claimed we saved. But we will still be at the very bottom of the industry, even lower than non-union, and they dont have to pay $600 a year for that.

The APA and APFA have always paid the lowest healthcare premiums. They will be with us in a matter of a few years. Read their deal. You are wrong again.

Bob we had everything you are crying about in the May 2010 TA. If we had followed the ATD's advice and voted yes we would have stayed status quo on the CBA and had to fight mainly on the scope language. Instead we are in the scare tactic BK and none of this is really happening. Move along, nothing to see here.

Again Bob. 65% of direct labor and mat'ls will equate to a lot of jobs. A LOT more than AMFA, IBT, and the IAM's scope language provide. The scope language protects more jobs than the system protection clause does over the long term. Not a lie, fact. You know it and it bothers you. Can't shed all those pesky overhaul jobs and their votes. You were so hoping that Judge Lane was going to abrogate and open the door to 50% outsourcing of work.

It will take more than 3 years to get rid of the all the MD80s and guess what. The wage adjustment provision kicks in and we will be making at least $37.20 and no possible way we will be at the bottom in pay. It's all in Attachment 4.5 and if UA, CO, US, or DL go higher in pay then we will also move up higher than $37.20 in pay ($36.65 for the base) since the wage adjustment moves us to the middle at least. You are the liar Bob. Read the CBA before trying lying about it. The new aircraft will need their first C Checks within 6 to 7 years and you also know that. 65% of the direct labor and material spend for those new C Checks will drive new jobs at the base where none of the other CBA's does that. If we have to have 4 check lines to cover the new fleets in seven years then at least 2.5 of those lines must be done in-house. A reasonable person would understand this but you Bob are obviously not reasonable or rational.

 

[Overspeed]

Well, just what group does Jim Little and his fellow TWU International elite fit into? They can talk the talk, but the rest of us don't see them walking the walk! Double digit raises every year, expense accounts, with a benefits package that would make most business executives blush. Try your spin somewhere else. PS, I really doubt you're a line mechanic.

Not defending raises but you do understand that Little represents more than just us? What raises did they get for other TWU represented groups?

OV getting $565K after the great representational successes at NW with almost all jobs outsourced, AS shutting down their entire base at OAK and outsourcing the work while not in BK, and not defending the scope language at UA allowing the rest of airframe overhaul to be outsourced was SO deserving of that huge pay day. Now THAT would make most executives blush.

Ok. I doubt you are too. Now what?

 

[TWU informer]

The pilots and FA's are getting the same deal.

Are you for real?
DO you seriously believe the Pilots and F/A's got the same deal we have?

What are you smoking?