2014 Pilot Discussion

[Claxon]

In about three months our new CBA will take over. At that point, we (east and west) will have a CBA that doesn't have an issues with Nicolau- our new CBA will move forward with the least liability for us all
Nicolau
Let's all be good union pilots

Sure. And you are moving to Asheville along with Move2CLT.
You may move, but you will continue to be based in PHX.
Tick tick tick......

 

[Claxon]

Don't worry about AOL, it wil remain in place long after USAPA is gone. Leonidas recently got a number of bonuses. That includes a $1000 check from Mitch. I remember some of you questioning his support. Well...there you have it.
 
Here's an estimate of what USAPA has cost all US Airways pilots. There has been some number crunching and most come to a similar conclusion. I picked the conservative estimate. I don't care for anything liberal, btw.
 
I do have formal education and experience in economic analysisThis result is based on conservative assumptions and therefore should be viewed as inaccurate and very likely lower than the actual number. The result includes adjustment for the retro pay back to February 2013 and probable lost contributions to the 401K. The result does not assume any value loss or gain to the 401K. No adjustment for State or Federal Tax.I will not explain how this result was achieved. No data was provided by the carrier.The USAPA experiment has cost the US Airways Pilots $854,855,040.00.The USAPA gift to the carrier would likely be north of this number. Very generous indeed.
 
Comments:
Any satisfaction might be...It cost the east more than us.
 
I for one would like to see the number. The Eastholes claim to be so proud of their "profession", I look forward to rubbing it in their faces. God forbid I ever have to fly with one, I'll put the $number on every piece of paper in the cockpit.
 
The sadest part is....is that seniority was settled, years ago, by and through an agreed upon, followed to the letter process. And those c---ks--kers did what they did and got us. Nothing we could do, except for what we did, due to their greater numbers. Life would have been different for many of us......Never, Ever, Ever forget!
 
I'll want to know why, when I'll have to fly with some Easthole, why I'm still so pissed at him/her.
 
I have no obligation to ever go out of my way for any of them. Nor will I consort with any of them. The harm they have caused is irreparable. They demonstrate no remorse, to the contrary, they are entitled. Just not entitled to the time of day from any of us.
 
Labor union leadership should be accountable for their policies and decisions. The membership pays the bill. I am astonished that a collection a long standing labor union members (doesnt matter the name of the union) would tolerate this level of failure to the membership. Yet.Those directly responsible for the loss of this magnitude to the membership are actually holding leadership positions in a labor organization.
The exception being our (PHX) elected reps. This money will never be recovered. Never.

1000 from Mitch, the loss of thousands from hundreds of others. Your senior west pilots are tired of Ferguson and Koontz keeping them from 330 pay. The Leonidas Ponzi scheme is unraveling. Ferguson has been seen in heated arguments with west pilots alarmed at the MOU vote. Koontz practically resides in CLT to avoid his fellow disappointed west pilots, angry ones. Your attempt to unseat Bradford failed. Silver cast you aside.
Marty Harper gave the sorrowful news to his family that the Leonidas Gravy Train is coming off the tracks.

The American pilots know the west heritage. One that is constantly at odds with real airline pilots. Your heritage is stealing Ansett jobs, USAir pilot seniority, Wien jobs. That is what will NEVER be forgotten.
Your group will be known as the line cutters, the ones who worked with no benefits, no pensions. The ones who brought American down ultimately.

 

[luvthe9]

This money will never be recovered. Never. [/font]

You think you idiot scabs would have would have learned by now, and you want more money, you would have to be stupid to spend a penny more. You have nothing to show for all the money spent and damage to your group has been done. Oh well. Seek help for your inability to handle this defeat in your life son. Make peace within yourself.

 

[EastUS1]

Of course they won't have problems with the Nicolau. By then it will be months since it was abandoned(your psuedo unions word) and that abandonment found to not be a DFR. Your current union will have presented it's listS. If the APA were to take over and submit an abandoned seniority list, one that doesn't meet the language of the MOU, then they will face a DFR challenge from the east pilots, just like USAPA did with you!

 
Nonsense! Be reasonable here Pi. It's axiomatic that the entire APA's just eagerly awaiting their first chance to elevate all "spartans" to captain slots (their own people be dammed/etc) and even as we speak; are doubtless planning a huge festival just to celebrate their very arrival onto American Airlines turf! No other assumption's even reasonably possible. It's equally obvious that all stand in utter awe of the unbroken chain of devastating legal triumphs their "crack" team brings forward! Personally?...I'd think any "spartan" foolish not to immediately transfer at least another 10 grand to their mighty "army". 🙂

 

[snapthis]

In about three months our new CBA will take over. At that point, we (east and west) will have a CBA that doesn't have an issues with Nicolau- our new CBA will move forward with the least liability for us all
Nicolau
Let's all be good union pilots

 Let's keep reminding them who will represent all the pilots of AA.
 
Petition for Single-Carrier Status
Your APA leadership has received several inquiries from members regarding our filing of a petition for single-carrier status with the National Mediation Board (NMB) earlier this week. Some members have also read the update that the US Airline Pilots Association (USAPA) issued yesterday, which characterized the filing as "premature" and asserted that a single-carrier filing would be timely only after an integrated seniority list is completed.
 
To be clear, APA's filing complies with the Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) mutually agreed to by American Airlines, US Airways, APA and USAPA. The MOU stipulates the following:The term "Effective Date" refers to the date of the merger between American Airlines and US Airways, which was Dec. 9, 2013.
 
APA shall file a single carrier petition with the NMB as soon as practicable after the Effective Date, when APA determines that the facts support the legal requirements for the filing of a petition but in no event later than four months after the Effective Date.
Consistent with that provision of the MOU and based on information American Airlines filed with the NMB last week, APA determined that the facts support the legal requirements for the filing of a petition. The completion of an integrated seniority list is not a mandatory pre-condition for a single-carrier finding by the NMB. Actually, in the vast majority of significant airline mergers, the NMB has found a single carrier before the completion of seniority integration.
The USAPA update also asserted that "the McCaskill-Bond Amendment contemplates the continued independent representation of each pre-merger bargaining unit throughout the process of seniority integration." This statement suggests that USAPA would continue to serve in its current capacity even after the NMB certifies a single bargaining representative. However, as Judge Silver notes in her Jan. 10 decision in the Addington case, "when USAPA is no longer the certified representative, it must immediately stop participating in the seniority integration."
The APA Seniority Integration Committee will continue to pursue the negotiation of a seniority integration protocol with USAPA and American Airlines, as required by the MOU. This protocol will establish the rules of engagement for APA and USAPA going forward.
APA will provide updates as appropriate during what will likely be a lengthy and complex seniority integration process.
Posted in: President

 

[EastUS1]

 Let's keep reminding them who will represent all the pilots of AA.
 

 
It goes without saying that they'll be doing nothing other than worrying themselves silly over whether or not all "you'se" are given whatever you desire on a silver platter, (as was so kindly done for all their previous assimilations/TWA/etc)...or are "you'se" nowadays demanding solid 24K gold? Might want to open both your eyes and nostrils, and at least take even the smallest sniff of your own, insane BS. Just a kindly suggestion. Ah, but heck!...What do I, or anyone out east really know? We're all brand new to this merger thing, and you AWA folks must know better...Right? 😉

 

[Pi brat]

The APA Seniority Integration Committee will continue to pursue the negotiation of a seniority integration protocol with USAPA and American Airlines, as required by the MOU. This protocol will establish the rules of engagement for APA and USAPA going forward.
APA will provide updates as appropriate during what will likely be a lengthy and complex seniority integration process.
Posted in: President

 

[snapthis]

The APA Seniority Integration Committee will continue to pursue the negotiation of a seniority integration protocol with USAPA and American Airlines, as required by the MOU. This protocol will establish the rules of engagement for APA and USAPA going forward.
APA will provide updates as appropriate during what will likely be a lengthy and complex seniority integration process.
Posted in: President

The West pilots will be more than happy to assist our union with those efforts.

USAPA can continue being.......USAPA

 

[EastUS1]

The West pilots will be more than happy to assist our union with those efforts.
 

 
Sigh! Just have cactusboy53 leap heroically into the room and shout out his classic line; "This is sparta!" Follow that up with "cap'n aux" in some "classy", full-dress T-shirt, describing at length the fearsome forces of your "army". Just tell 'em who "you'se" really are and what's what immediately. That should do it....Good Luck! 😉 The only possible snag I can see for your noble cause here is that, from what I've heard, AMR did evaluate intelligence when hiring.
 
P.S. If there's anything more I can do to help "you'se" convince fellow "spartans" to immediately donate another 10 grand apiece; please let me know. Seriously. Click to Donate: http://leonidas.cactuspilots.us/Contributions/Leonidas_Contributions_OCT13.html

 

[end_of_alpa]

 Let's keep reminding them who will represent all the pilots of AA.
 
"The APA Seniority Integration Committee will continue to pursue the negotiation of a seniority integration protocol with USAPA and American Airlines, as required by the MOU. This protocol will establish the rules of engagement for APA and USAPA going forward.
APA will provide updates as appropriate during what will likely be a lengthy and complex seniority integration process.
Posted in: President"

If your going to quote at all, at least quote what APA WILL CONTINUE TO DO.

 

[EastUS1]

The Eastholes claim to be so proud of their "profession", I look forward to rubbing it in their faces.
 

 
Does anyone from the APA or any line American Pilots have any further questions?

 

[algflyr]

 
"10. a. A seniority integration process consistent with McCaskill-Bond shall begin as soon as possible
after the Effective Date. If, on the date ninety (90) days following the Effective Date, direct
negotiations have failed to result in a merged seniority list acceptable to the pilots at both airlines, a
panel of three neutral arbitrators will be designated within fifteen (15) days to resolve the dispute,
pursuant to the authority and requirements of McCaskill-Bond. That arbitration proceeding will
commence no later than 60 days after the designation of the arbitrators, or as soon thereafter as
practicable given the availability of the designated arbitrators, provided that it is understood that, in no
event, shall the seniority integration arbitration proceeding commence prior to final approval of the
JCBA pursuant to the deadlines and procedures in Paragraph 27 below. The panel of arbitrators will
render its award within six (6) months of the commencement of the arbitration, and in any event not
later than 24 months after the Effective Date."
 
"f. A Seniority Integration Protocol Agreement ("Protocol Agreement") consistent with
McCaskill-Bond and this Paragraph 10 will be agreed upon within 30 days of the Effective Date[extended by 30 days, I believe] The
Protocol Agreement will set forth the process and protocol for conducting negotiations and arbitration,
if applicable, and will include a methodology for allocating the reimbursement provided for in
Paragraph 7."
 
I'm kind of doubting single carrier status by then. It is the government after all.
 

 
You are correct that the 30 day protocol agreement was extended by 30 days. The USAPA Merger Committee update on Jan 7th stated:
 
"At the request of APA, the three parties to the MOU (USAPA, APA, and the Company) agreed last week to an extension of 30 days to complete the Protocol Agreement. This extension is only for completion of the Protocol Agreement and does not affect the rest of the seniority integration timetable. The additional time will allow the parties to complete the process without the pressure of an artificial time constraint and adjusts the schedule to allow for the fact that much of the original 30-day period fell over the holiday season."
 
So the protocol agreement should be completed by Feb. 7th, 2014. (60 days from POR of Dec. 9th, 2013). The extension does NOT affect the SLI timeline, so the SLI should be completed by March 9th, 2014 (90 days from the POR of Dec. 9th, 2013) according to the timline in the MOU. If there is not an agreed to integrated list on March 9th, 2014, the arbitration process will begin.
 
I think we will soon get very concise clarification of the process and who will be involved in the entire process until a completed list is created. My guess is by Feb. 7th... 🙂
 
And I also highly doubt the NMB will make a single carrier determination in the next 19 days...

 

[nycbusdriver]

 
 
And I also highly doubt the NMB will make a single carrier determination in the next 19 days...

 
Maybe AOL can take out second (third?) mortgages on their sandlots and convince Marty to ask Judge Silver to issue an injunction requiring the NMB to find single-carrier status before Feb 7.
 
Yeah!  That's the ticket!

 

[snapthis]

If your going to quote at all, at least quote what APA WILL CONTINUE TO DO.

You really are that stupid.

 
How Usapian of you not to understand I posted the whole update.
 
Refer to #1310

 

[Claxon]

If your going to quote at all, at least quote what APA WILL CONTINUE TO DO.

The lack of integrity is appalling. SNAPTHIS on a routine basis uses partial quotes out of context.
Res Judicata is a proven liar.
Ferguson and Koontz are slick ambulance chasers working for Marty Harper.
Harper and Jacobs. The slimiest of the bunch. Shoveling millions. Unripe case after another.