Afa Walk's Out On Us Airways Management

[UWCactus]

"twicedbaked" and "proudf/a" Take your personal attacks somewhere else. Both of you are bickering little b@$@es (male or female). This is a serious issue that means a lot to everyone on both sides of the country. For US East people...don't let the fence thing get you worked up..it's only the ignorance of US west that turns this into a major issue.

 

[TheNewLowFare]

Twicebake,

I'm not going to argue with you since it's not worth it. But basically by the sound of your posting, you are agreeing with the company to not give us any type of protection or adjust our payscale to match yours.

To add insult, the company wants the furloughed US F/As at higher pay rates and pay them during training at 3-5 AWA rates and no fence protections for any AWA F/As.

I have been here 14 years and never got paid training. You know what we got? $20 a day during our flight attendant training. We've already lost the seniority issue and now you want us to lose our pay and fence issue too. This is like a slap in the face to all AWA F/As.

This is not about fence protection anymore, this is about our payscale, our flexibility and everything else.

 

[proudf/a]

"twicedbaked" and "proudf/a" Take your personal attacks somewhere else. Both of you are bickering little b@$@es (male or female). This is a serious issue that means a lot to everyone on both sides of the country. For US East people...don't let the fence thing get you worked up..it's only the ignorance of US west that turns this into a major issue.

I have been in the business way too long to take anything someone thinks about me personally, but ty anyhow. My little dig about PHX was meant light heartedly, my apologies to those w/o a sense of humor. There are much bigger fish to fry then a PHX fence, the sooner it is realized by the f/a group, the better off we will all be.

Twicebake,

I'm not going to argue with you since it's not worth it. But basically by the sound of your posting, you are agreeing with the company to not give us any type of protection or adjust our payscale to match yours.

To add insult, the company wants the furloughed US F/As at higher pay rates and pay them during training at 3-5 AWA rates and no fence protections for any AWA F/As.

I have been here 14 years and never got paid training. You know what we got? $20 a day during our flight attendant training. We've already lost the seniority issue and now you want us to lose our pay and fence issue too. This is like a slap in the face to all AWA F/As.

This is not about fence protection anymore, this is about our payscale, our flexibility and everything else.

Well there is always another way to settle this...if PHX needs 100 f/a's (example) then open it up for transfers, let the senior f/a's in. Call back the furloughs send them to LGA or wherever on the east side needs covered, then be done with it. There is no arguing over what they are paid, where they fit in, etc etc. Those furloughees just want their jobs back, none of this is their fault. If they get sent into PHX it will be like walking into the lions den for them, an all they want to do is come back to work.

 

[Dog Wonder]

Lock this bunch in a room with no doors and charge admission.

 

[proudf/a]

Lock this bunch in a room with no doors and charge admission.

Will seniority prevail in this room? (its a joke) 😀

 

[IpourNotCan]

Well there is always another way to settle this...if PHX needs 100 f/a's (example) then open it up for transfers, let the senior f/a's in.

I don't think so! That's probably the stupidiest idea I have ever heard. We also know this is not the Furloughed US F/As fault, but to pay them during their training??? We didn't get paid for training, what's so special about them? If the company wants to pay them for training then they owe ALL America West Flight Attendant paid training pay then. We got freaking $20 a day! What a joke!

 

[PITbull]

I'm sorry...but when I was in training on U-East side, we received $80 PER WEEK, and not permitted to go home on weekends.

Times change. Anyone who goes through training for 8 hour per day should be paid a decent hourly wage, AND ALL F/AS SHOULD BE AT PAY PARIETY BEST-NATION, and that includes U-West f/as and Invols who get recalled back.

USAirways DOES have the money for this. And the U-West f/as deserve pay pariety with the INVOLS.

The below came from the MEC E-line from U-East, Mike Flores, so the issue and disagreement lays with the MEC-West side:

"The Company proposal does contain provisions for the hiring of Involuntary Furloughed US Airways flight attendants to fill approximately 225 vacancies in PHX during the period of Separate Operations. Those flight attendants would be considered America West employees during that period and would be at the bottom of the seniority list for bidding until integration or recall but would be credited with their US Airways longevity for pay and vacation purposes. The US Airways committee and the MEC agree with this part of the Company proposal. The America West AFA leadership however does not agree with allowing the longevity credit for pay and vacation purposes during the period of Separate Operations. Once we have a merged seniority list, CBA and Company that would happen anyway and we are in disagreement with their position".

I think that the MEC-West position is that their f/as on the West who would be in the same years of service as the INVOLS should be paid the same as the INVOLS (currently, the pay scale is lower on U-West in those lower years of service than our INVOLS would be)....And I believe their MEC is correct, and that all fa/s both West and East should support the MEC-West position in pay parity for all.

Remember, Company strategy is "divide and conquer". IMO, by management not giving pay parity to the U-West f/as in that same year of service as the INVOLS is a strategy to have the two MECs argue and divert, once again, the focus on the real issues.

 

[6 o'clock]

There will be no fence....It's technically inconceivable...you fence one base you fence them all...what a joke...Young Ladies and Gents of AWA, welcome to the REAL WORLD....of corporate mergers and big time concessions....USEast employees have been there and done that...guess thats why no one was too upset initially about WEST's proposals....The folks that have been around awhile knew NOTHING would come of the hysterical whining in PHX, now, WEST employees go try and sell people on screwing the men and women that were furloughed as a result of 9-11....I doubt you get too far....All of East is tired of the ME, ME, ME, West thing...you people need to get more creative! We aren't that hard to manipulate...LOL...ask Management or the AFA.

 

[IpourNotCan]

Whatever! You fenced your stupid international base for 12 years, years ago hello? We couldn't care less about that! We fly international too! BIG DEAL ! This is not about the fence anymore! This is about the payscale and other stuff! Why should you all get a higher payrates? They are turning the US West FA's morale around by standing firm on not matching US Easts current pay. What are we ? chopped liver? Dormats?


The company sure does not know what it has got itself into. The company wants to see this integration happen quickly in order to realize their financial synergies, but the Union has now halted the integration of the seniority list. We are going to drag this out to the detriment of the company!!!

 

[PITbull]

Whatever! You fenced your stupid international base for 12 years, years ago hello? We couldn't care less about that! We fly international too! BIG DEAL ! This is not about the fence anymore! This is about the payscale and other stuff! Why should you all get a higher payrates? What are we ? chopped liver?
The company sure does not know what it has got itself into. The company wants to see this integration happen quickly in order to realize their financial synergies, but the Union has now halted the integration of the seniority list. We are going to drag this out to the detriment of the company!!!

You are right. We have had fences before, and we did have International somicles/fenced, we also have a "division" with MAA f/as who are our Invol. furloughees.

There will be fences, we just don't know how long they will be for, yet, and what agreement can be reached. Again, a different and separate issue than pay parity.

 

[IpourNotCan]

You are right. We have had fences before, and we did have International somicles/fenced, we also have a "division" with MAA f/as who are our Invol. furloughees.

There will be fences, we just don't know how long they will be for, yet, and what agreement can be reached. Again, a different and separate issue than pay pariety.

Thank you. I'm glad you understand

 

[Bear96]

Sorry to jump in -- not trying to be rude, and I think it is tacky when people get picky about grammar and spelling on an internet discussion board -- but this needs to be nipped in the bud now since it will apparently be a topic we are reading about for some time to come. So forgive me for pointing this out but it's starting to drive me crazy.

There's no "e" in "parity."

 

[UWCactus]

Let me explain what is going on in Phoenix to those that don't understand. America West, operating under it's own certificate, needs to hire approximately 270 FA's beginning to in 2006 to support attrition and some eq changes. Someone suggested hiring furloughed US East FA's (to get them back to work). In my opinion this is viewed as a call back, because technically it's one company, two different carriers. So US East are called back to train to work AWA, so they go to the bottom of the seniority list in Phoenix, because of the HP certificate. When the carriers are combined, they would probably be slotted in at their original seniority. They should be paid at their longevity rates, even though it's not compatible with HP, after all, they are US East furloughees. Training is a non-fly assignment. If youre an active FA, whenever you work ground, you are paid 1 for 2 duty rig, thus paying them for training. This would amount to about 4.5 credits per day of training. AWA employees would probably let this work out, if the current 3-5 year pay rates were the same as US East. As a result of the talks, my guess is...America West will end up hiring off of the street. Keep in mind, a single contract takes parts of both contracts to create one. Unless the company agrees to changes in pay rates, this option for furlougnhed US FA's is not going to be considered. This is about equalizing pay rates, which is the miniumu they can do since AWA is in contract negotiations. If the pay rates remain the same until a single contract is reached, the AWA will not see much in the way of pay increases, which for more senior groups, dates back to 2002. As far as fence protections go...I dont see the point of having a fence to prevent US East from transferring into Phoenix during separate operations. Why would anyone want to transfer to Phoenix during separate operations? Doesn't make much sense to me. The union has some very tough work ahead of them and the company must come around to be fair. Clearly the company realizes any improvements in the AWA current contract will result in greater cost during a single contract, therefore all FA's must come together to support AWA quest for a current contract with the minimum of increased pay rates.

 

[proudf/a]

Let me explain what is going on in Phoenix to those that don't understand. America West, operating under it's own certificate, needs to hire approximately 270 FA's beginning to in 2006 to support attrition and some eq changes. Someone suggested hiring furloughed US East FA's (to get them back to work). In my opinion this is viewed as a call back, because technically it's one company, two different carriers. So US East are called back to train to work AWA, so they go to the bottom of the seniority list in Phoenix, because of the HP certificate. When the carriers are combined, they would probably be slotted in at their original seniority. They should be paid at their longevity rates, even though it's not compatible with HP, after all, they are US East furloughees. Training is a non-fly assignment. If youre an active FA, whenever you work ground, you are paid 1 for 2 duty rig, thus paying them for training. This would amount to about 4.5 credits per day of training. AWA employees would probably let this work out, if the current 3-5 year pay rates were the same as US East. As a result of the talks, my guess is...America West will end up hiring off of the street. Keep in mind, a single contract takes parts of both contracts to create one. Unless the company agrees to changes in pay rates, this option for furlougnhed US FA's is not going to be considered. This is about equalizing pay rates, which is the miniumu they can do since AWA is in contract negotiations. If the pay rates remain the same until a single contract is reached, the AWA will not see much in the way of pay increases, which for more senior groups, dates back to 2002. As far as fence protections go...I dont see the point of having a fence to prevent US East from transferring into Phoenix during separate operations. Why would anyone want to transfer to Phoenix during separate operations? Doesn't make much sense to me. The union has some very tough work ahead of them and the company must come around to be fair. Clearly the company realizes any improvements in the AWA current contract will result in greater cost during a single contract, therefore all FA's must come together to support AWA quest for a current contract with the minimum of increased pay rates.

Very well said. I realize the furlouhee issue is a sore spot for the Uwest group. Please keep in mind the sacrafices that people make for their jobs when they do get laid off, regardless of what industry they are in. As union brothers and sisters, you need to project a solid front. Most of those that are on Invol furlough have moved on and probably will not come back, but for those that have been holding onto the hope of returning to this career, lets get them back to work, and move fwd.

 

[PITbull]

Sorry to jump in -- not trying to be rude, and I think it is tacky when people get picky about grammar and spelling on an internet discussion board -- but this needs to be nipped in the bud now since it will apparently be a topic we are reading about for some time to come. So forgive me for pointing this out but it's starting to drive me crazy.

There's no "e" in "parity."

Just out of curiosity Bear, is that the only opinion you derived out of that post??? Do you think a PM would have sufficed? Simple.

Until the forum gets a "spell check", expect many more spelling errors. In fact, I think for your sanity, just hit "ignore".