American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[WeAAsles]

Our official Representatives haven’t had any opportunity to actually say no to anything yet though.

 

[aintgotnotimefodat]

Our official Representatives haven’t had any opportunity to actually say no to anything yet though.

The TWU needs to put out their proposals or counters to the company's offer...let the membership see what we are fighting for and raise our expectations...instead of the company putting stuff out and members not thinking we deserve more...

We ultimately need a new union!!!

It doesn't matter which one, they don't do their job, we boot them and get another....sooner or later, whomever represents us will know we mean business...and will put up a fight...

Under the TWU, theirs no leadership...Gary means well, but he's only a cogg, in a dues collecting machine....I don't think the international has his back...they just want the contract settled and get their $$$ dues...

 

[PIEDMONT784]

For LAA, the medical for all work groups have been in the mix for the last 10 years. It has been a target and something they worked towards for a quite some time and they're now on the final lap in their quest.

In this case "they" were LAA pressuring the TWU on medical. "They" no longer exist.
"They" are an entirely NEW company run by someone else. The TWU is no longer the only factor for "them" to deal with...
They could have ended their "quest" once, and for all in BK!

Remind me again how many small stations were wiped off the map in exchange for catering? Keeping catering was a steal for the company.

How would you know? Why would you care? I thought you were a DL nonunion worker?!

The difference of now vs. then on catering could be simply attributed to the substantial topped-out wage differences of less than $20/hour vs. more than $30/hour. Not sure it would be a Company "must have" due to its negligible impact upon other work groups. I am certain if the Association were willing to sacrifice out stations to keep catering in the LUS hubs, then the Company negotiators would willing accept such a proposition (it has happened before with the US/AW JCBA)-- I hope this does not happen.

This explanation 'almost' made sense-- However-- the raises the company decided to administer were volunteered OUTSIDE of the JCBA. They had to know the IAM would NOT give up scope for it. Second-- LUS was in secret talks for YEARS with both UA, and AA, neither of which have catering. They had to know where wages were heading in future fleet talks industry wide as well. LUS could have easily ditched the jobs under BK provisions. This would have allowed a smoother melding later. They didn't, so that tells me it's not critical to the business model. It's simply being used as bargaining chip that is already in fleets pocket to begin with!

In essence, the Company is telling you that they will let you keep that shiny coin you earned in past negotiations safely in your pocket -- "IF" you give them one of a larger denomination from the other pocket!

 

[PIEDMONT784]

Ok Rusty if you need to reference a cargo companies contract or some propaganda that the AA is floating that’s certainly not an offer and barely a proposal yet you’re ready to swallow it hook line and sinker without even reading it,then I guess I got nothing for you

Mark my words you’ll be wearing depends and crapping yourself before the IBT is ever on th property at AA
If you want a change maybe you need to look AMFA not the thieving teamsters

Now, that right there is some FUNNY chit! (and TRUE)
>SPIT<

 

[Kev3188]

How would you know? Why would you care? I thought you were a DL nonunion worker?!

Easy. It was talked about endlessly on here.

Excellent non answer, though, and thanks for proving me right.

 

[PIEDMONT784]

Easy. It was talked about endlessly on here.

Excellent non answer, though, and thank for proving me right.

That brings me to the next question... why are you in this AA labor forum? Are you thinking of applying for an AA position? You have posted over 16,000 times over 15 years mostly about LUS and AA...
Are you trying to immerse yourself in our culture simply to debate us? Makes NO sense dude!
It's just like that supposed "Banker" that is infatuated with our affairs, and a diehard Tim cheerleader!

>SPIT<

 

[Kev3188]

Because I can be. Don’t let it threaten you.

 

[Racer X]

A mediator can certainly influence an outcome by instituting several techniques.

They can put us on ice, not schedule any meetings for months. That creates tension and pressure on the negotiators to get something done as the Members become restless. To get something scheduled the Mediator would need an indication the Association is ready to move on certain positions rather than just saying no at everything.

Ok

 

[NYer]

I guess I’d have to agree with your opinion here to a degree.

The only area that could be a cause but maybe not much of one of raised eyebrows is the Company bypassing the Negotiating Committee to Negotiate directly with the Members?

But technically if you think about it they haven’t really moved yet if they never presented a full comprehensive proposal on all remaining articles to our Negotiating Representatives.

Would the online “tester” offers in April and May actually be accepted by the Mediator as any formal offers? This Month may bring the first and only formal offers.

But I do agree with you that the Company is doing a mighty fine and dandy job at trying to make it appear like they’ve been moving.

Heard the line about them negotiating directly with Members, but not sure that will carry much weight with the Mediator since the Association can also be blamed for similar action by giving their opinion of the comprehensive proposal being "garbage" or "disrespectful." That may be true, but it can also be seen as negotiating since it gives a reflection of what's been offered. The Executive Committee could have that opinion but once they make it public does that open the door for the other side to also share their thoughts? That would be an interesting point for the NMB to ponder.

Formal offers? Are we in formal negotiations? No, we each have a CBA that is in force and doesn't become amendable until September. These are voluntary negotiations with doesn't hold the moniker of formal. That being said, in their attempt to show they've moved on their original positions they can certainly point towards the changes they've made since July. In order to counter that, we'd need to hope the Association has moved accordingly.

If not, it is reasonable to assume the Mediator will look towards the Association to take steps towards the airline. Where would those steps come from?

 

[NYer]

Our official Representatives haven’t had any opportunity to actually say no to anything yet though.

There is a bevy of letters and videos explaining their position if the airline and NMB decide to use it to make their points. Somehow we believe only the information in a scheduled meeting will be used during the Section 6 process. They use letters, videos, newspaper articles, emails and anything they can get their hands on.

Remember, they're there to get a deal. They're not looking for a fair deal, a favorable deal, an industry comparable deal. They just want a deal and their will pressure the side they believe needs to move. Under the current Federal government conditions, the advantage goes to the corporate world.

 

[NYer]

In this case "they" were LAA pressuring the TWU on medical. "They" no longer exist.
"They" are an entirely NEW company run by someone else. The TWU is no longer the only factor for "them" to deal with...
They could have ended their "quest" once, and for all in BK!

The names are different in some positions, but they're the same in others. You can choose to look at the names since that suits your arguments but those of us on the LAA side have heard those different names say almost word for word what we've heard over the last 10 year as it concerns the medical. Parker has been very clear in his position and has echoed the same as has Gerard Arpey and Tom Horton, they want everyone in the same LAA plans.

 

[aintgotnotimefodat]

That brings me to the next question... why are you in this AA labor forum? Are you thinking of applying for an AA position? You have posted over 16,000 times over 15 years mostly about LUS and AA...
Are you trying to immerse yourself in our culture simply to debate us? Makes NO sense dude!
It's just like that supposed "Banker" that is infatuated with our affairs, and a diehard Tim cheerleader!

>SPIT<

Lol..I would never go on another forum, no reason to...don't care to put my 2c in, when I'm not even working there...no life

 

[B737 driver]

A mediator can certainly influence an outcome by instituting several techniques.

They can put us on ice, not schedule any meetings for months. That creates tension and pressure on the negotiators to get something done as the Members become restless. To get something scheduled the Mediator would need an indication the Association is ready to move on certain positions rather than just saying no at everything.

We have already gone through that, she was going to put us on ice again, if we didn't send this out for a vote. I personally think AMFA is dragging this AIP out, to make the company look bad, as payback. However I guarantee if we vote it down, she will put us on ice for six months. They the union has said they will not take a strike vote, because everyone would rather stay where they are, than have a Northwest situation.

 

[Kev3188]

The TWU needs to put out their proposals or counters to the company's offer...let the membership see what we are fighting for and raise our expectations...instead of the company putting stuff out and members not thinking we deserve more...

We ultimately need a new union!!!

It doesn't matter which one, they don't do their job, we boot them and get another....sooner or later, whomever represents us will know we mean business...and will put up a fight...

Under the TWU, theirs no leadership...Gary means well, but he's only a cogg, in a dues collecting machine....I don't think the international has his back...they just want the contract settled and get their $$$ dues...

I like where your head is at, but most people have been hammered into complacency. Sure, the breakroom warriors will stomp their feet, but most people in our industry are either to apathetic or afraid to actually do anything courageous. I would be very happy to be proven wrong, though.

Lol..I would never go on another forum, no reason to...don't care to put my 2c in, when I'm not even working there...no life

What happens at one carrier affects all of them. I make no apologies for being interested in our collective future(s).

Piedmont’s just shook that I posted an uncomfortable truth.

I also make no apologies for calling out shitty contracts or labor leaders. No one should.

 

[NYer]

We have already gone through that, she was going to put us on ice again, if we didn't send this out for a vote. I personally think AMFA is dragging this AIP out, to make the company look bad, as payback. However I guarantee if we vote it down, she will put us on ice for six months. They the union has said they will not take a strike vote, because everyone would rather stay where they are, then have a Northwest situation.

There will never be a strike at LAA, UA, SWA, DL or any other large airline.

Voting it down is one of the few ways to get something enhanced, not usually a big item, but something.