American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[Jester]

View attachment 13049

I'll tell him and anyone else differently... "Pew Research Center defines middle class as those earning between 67 percent and 200 percent of the median income, which works out to income between $39,560 and $118,080. While the middle class is by far the largest, it makes up approximately half of all Americans, at 51 percent."
https://finance.zacks.com/lower-middle-upper-class-income-levels-9877.html

And yet... "The share of American workers belonging to labor unions held steady in 2017, matching the historic low of 10.7 percent set in the prior year, according to a Labor Department..." https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-rate-in-u-s-held-at-record-low-of-10-7-in-17

So 10% of the workforce would be unionized (and includes those earning poverty wages of $12/hour for ramp contractors), but half of American workers are middle class? How did 40% of American workers manage to become middle class without a union? This is how union advocates lose credibility, as it smacks of pandering and fake news.

 

[WeAAsles]

View attachment 13050

I'll tell him and anyone else differently... "Pew Research Center defines middle class as those earning between 67 percent and 200 percent of the median income, which works out to income between $39,560 and $118,080. While the middle class is by far the largest, it makes up approximately half of all Americans, at 51 percent."
https://finance.zacks.com/lower-middle-upper-class-income-levels-9877.html

And yet... "The share of American workers belonging to labor unions held steady in 2017, matching the historic low of 10.7 percent set in the prior year, according to a Labor Department..." https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-rate-in-u-s-held-at-record-low-of-10-7-in-17

So 10% of the workforce would be unionized (and includes those earning poverty wages of $12/hour for ramp contractors), but half of American workers are middle class? How did 40% of American workers manage to become middle class without a union? This is how union advocates lose credibility, as it smacks of pandering and fake news.

Would you like to argue with Government data when all branches of the Government and the SCOTUS are in the hands of Republicans?

https://www.bls.gov/news.release/union2.nr0.htm

 

[ALUS78]

View attachment 13050

I'll tell him and anyone else differently... "Pew Research Center defines middle class as those earning between 67 percent and 200 percent of the median income, which works out to income between $39,560 and $118,080. While the middle class is by far the largest, it makes up approximately half of all Americans, at 51 percent."
https://finance.zacks.com/lower-middle-upper-class-income-levels-9877.html

And yet... "The share of American workers belonging to labor unions held steady in 2017, matching the historic low of 10.7 percent set in the prior year, according to a Labor Department..." https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-rate-in-u-s-held-at-record-low-of-10-7-in-17

So 10% of the workforce would be unionized (and includes those earning poverty wages of $12/hour for ramp contractors), but half of American workers are middle class? How did 40% of American workers manage to become middle class without a union? This is how union advocates lose credibility, as it smacks of pandering and fake news.

Now you did it Weez is going to empty the equivalent in volume of the library of Congress on you butt

 

[ALUS78]

Weez has this week's union/ company meetings concluded and can we expect an update?

 

[WeAAsles]

Now you did it Weez is going to empty the equivalent in volume of the library of Congress on you butt

No need. The BLS report says all I need.
$212.00 x 52 = $11,024 One year.

 

[gulfcoast1]

If you took a survey of association membership it woul probably be 40%dem and 40% rep and 20% wouldnt know what you are talking about.As As Republican I would hate for my dues to go to a Democrat something the unions are going to have to look at.How not to piss off Half their membership and lose their revenue I mean dues

I do not think your numbers are close to correct, even at many of our stations in the South. I seriously doubt they are true in a NY union shop job. I have many friends in NY who work for AA, and all of them are very open about voting for Democrats. The one republican I knew even got so turned off after Bush and with the recession he voted for Obama. He did not like Hillary at all, as many others obviously did not either, but he voted for the Libertarian and is repulsed by trump.

Even here, the Democrats outnumber the gop at my location by far. There are many people from Puerto Rico who work for AA at Southern locations and in NYC also. That probably skews things to the Democrats because they are reliable blue votes for the most part. Many keep moving to MIA and MCO and will probably have a major effect on the vote in 2020.

Some of the republicans here are very defensive and vocal because they are often engaged due to their votes against our jobs, but even half the vocal ones say nothing now when anything about trump is on the news. Right after they were elected they said a lot. Now most of them avoid even talking about politics. Of course it does not help when trump separated children from their parents and refers to some racists as good people. Even if Democrats were not helping to fight for union jobs, I don't think I could ever support a party whose leader says that some racists are good people.

 

[gulfcoast1]

View attachment 13050

I'll tell him and anyone else differently... "Pew Research Center defines middle class as those earning between 67 percent and 200 percent of the median income, which works out to income between $39,560 and $118,080. While the middle class is by far the largest, it makes up approximately half of all Americans, at 51 percent."
https://finance.zacks.com/lower-middle-upper-class-income-levels-9877.html

And yet... "The share of American workers belonging to labor unions held steady in 2017, matching the historic low of 10.7 percent set in the prior year, according to a Labor Department..." https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-rate-in-u-s-held-at-record-low-of-10-7-in-17

So 10% of the workforce would be unionized (and includes those earning poverty wages of $12/hour for ramp contractors), but half of American workers are middle class? How did 40% of American workers manage to become middle class without a union? This is how union advocates lose credibility, as it smacks of pandering and fake news.

Are you saying you would rather work a non-union job and receive non-union wages? I find that hard to believe but it sounds like what you are saying?

 

[WeAAsles]

Are you saying you would rather work a non-union job and receive non-union wages? I find that hard to believe but it sounds like what you are saying?

If that’s what his ambitions were, this would be a bit closer to the reality he would be living today remaining in the current line of work.

https://www.bls.gov/ooh/transportat.../mobile/hand-laborers-and-material-movers.htm

 

[chilokie1]

I would love to rejoin the Dems but they are as bad as the republicans, a lot worse actually. Sure the Dems support big labor unions when it affects the unions bottom line, but they could care less about the union members. All the Washington polatitions care about its money & votes. The biggest threat to the US middle class is not controlling the southern border, how can a person support a party with Maxine Waters as a party leader. Like him or not you have to admit that President Trump is doing exactly what he said he would do, show me another president in your lifetime that has done that

 

[ALUS78]

I do not think your numbers are close to correct, even at many of our stations in the South. I seriously doubt they are true in a NY union shop job. I have many friends in NY who work for AA, and all of them are very open about voting for Democrats. The one republican I knew even got so turned off after Bush and with the recession he voted for Obama. He did not like Hillary at all, as many others obviously did not either, but he voted for the Libertarian and is repulsed by trump.

Even here, the Democrats outnumber the gop at my location by far. There are many people from Puerto Rico who work for AA at Southern locations and in NYC also. That probably skews things to the Democrats because they are reliable blue votes for the most part. Many keep moving to MIA and MCO and will probably have a major effect on the vote in 2020.

Some of the republicans here are very defensive and vocal because they are often engaged due to their votes against our jobs, but even half the vocal ones say nothing now when anything about trump is on the news. Right after they were elected they said a lot. Now most of them avoid even talking about politics. Of course it does not help when trump separated children from their parents and refers to some racists as good people. Even if Democrats were not helping to fight for union jobs, I don't think I could ever support a party whose leader says that some racists are
Actually I think your numbers are way off from what I gather.Pretty sure Obama met with some who called the whites devils but that not racism to a liberal

 

[MetalMover]

Tim why are they handing out Association T shirts here at LGA? Is it system wide

Can't wait for mine...I could always use a new rag for my oil changes.

 

[ALUS78]

I do not think your numbers are close to correct, even at many of our stations in the South. I seriously doubt they are true in a NY union shop job. I have many friends in NY who work for AA, and all of them are very open about voting for Democrats. The one republican I knew even got so turned off after Bush and with the recession he voted for Obama. He did not like Hillary at all, as many others obviously did not either, but he voted for the Libertarian and is repulsed by trump.

Even here, the Democrats outnumber the gop at my location by far. There are many people from Puerto Rico who work for AA at Southern locations and in NYC also. That probably skews things to the Democrats because they are reliable blue votes for the most part. Many keep moving to MIA and MCO and will probably have a major effect on the vote in 2020.

Some of the republicans here are very defensive and vocal because they are often engaged due to their votes against our jobs, but even half the vocal ones say nothing now when anything about trump is on the news. Right after they were elected they said a lot. Now most of them avoid even talking about politics. Of course it does not help when trump separated children from their parents and refers to some racists as good people. Even if Democrats were not helping to fight for union jobs, I don't think I could ever support a party whose leader says that some racists are good people.

I could never support a candidate who thinks it's okay for a family to recieve welfare for 3 generations a candidate who tells me to walk in their shoes.I walk in my own shoes that I have bought working 6 days a week for the last 20 years

 

[Jester]

Would you like to argue with Government data when all branches of the Government and the SCOTUS are in the hands of Republicans?

https://www.bls.gov/news.release/union2.nr0.htm

View attachment 13051

Non-sequitur... the statistics speak for themselves-- 4 times more middle class people are non-union vs. those who are union members. Your link states a different point that being those who are unionized will typically have higher wages; however, wage differentials have been studied extensively by economists accounting for union status, experience, gender, age, race, job description, industry, human capital (skill/education set), etc. and yet, maybe 50% can be explained by those variables.

An additional and significant predictor has been the concept of "rent sharing" by which a firm earns an "extraordinary" rate of return that which is above the expect rate of return given the industry risk profile. Within our own industry, we have seen that first hand as my days with America West as a ramp agent, our union contract topped-out at $14/hour after 14 years of service. While at your days at American were far more generous starting at $10/hour and topping-out at over $20 with just 8 years of service? But why? We were once BOTH TWU, and both performing the same work? The difference should be obvious-- America West was teetering on bankruptcy any given year, while American had many profitable years and paying your higher wages for labor peace was part of the bargain, and a component in rent sharing.

So now here we are together (nearly) as one big happy work group enjoying industry consolidation and the elimination of a half dozen competitors. Industry record profits, as we bask in the glory of $31/hour wages, and the expectations of future wage increases much because of rent sharing.

Now please excuse me in removing my mortar board and gown, as I have a plane to load.

 

[ALUS78]

I would love to rejoin the Dems but they are as bad as the republicans, a lot worse actually. Sure the Dems support big labor unions when it affects the unions bottom line, but they could care less about the union members. All the Washington polatitions care about its money & votes. The biggest threat to the US middle class is not controlling the southern border, how can a person support a party with Maxine Waters as a party leader. Like him or not you have to admit that President Trump is doing exactly what he said he would do, show me another president in your lifetime that has done that

Maybe not a threat to you but a threat to others here on long island I pay 10k a year in taxes the most of which goes to school taxes I have no kids.A house a few blocks away the landlord pays the same 10k but he has 4 families living in illegally they have 14 kids going to my school the math you see doesnt work out.

 

[WeAAsles]

Maybe not a threat to you but a threat to others here on long island I pay 10k a year in taxes the most of which goes to school taxes I have no kids.A house a few blocks away the landlord pays the same 10k but he has 4 families living in illegally they have 14 kids going to my school the math you see doesnt work out.