American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[2ndGENAMT]

Up is not an association member.

Neither are any of us "Revenue Streams" Association members!

I used to refer to us as Dues Generators but switched recently as Revenue Streams is more in line when referring to a for Profit organization.

 

[WeAAsles]

Diminishing Returns is what I define as 30 years of TWU Dues!

Have you ever thought about starting a Card Drive for a different Union perhaps?

 

[WeAAsles]

Neither are any of us "Revenue Streams" Association members!

I used to refer to us as Dues Generators but switched recently as Revenue Streams is more in line when referring to a for Profit organization.

“The mean annual wage for aviation maintenance technicians was reported as $61,190 in the year 2016, according to BLS. The lowest 10% of aviation maintenance technicians earned a salary of less than $35,960, while the highest 10% earned more than $87,880 annually.Sep 5, 2017”

Aren’t you currently near $20,000 per year over that posted salary above? That also doesn’t count your 401k match (5.5% is above the Corporate average BTW) and your Medical Benefits either.

Now I know you’re going to twist the raise from 2016 to the negative but I will say that it was the Association that “Signed off” on getting you that money.

 

[WeAAsles]

Neither are any of us "Revenue Streams" Association members!

I used to refer to us as Dues Generators but switched recently as Revenue Streams is more in line when referring to a for Profit organization.

That terrible Association. Those absolute BASTARDS!!!!!

 

[1AA]

mike757 we are included in the buyout but they want the majority of us to go away in time.we are such a small group they pay very little attention to us and it is hard to get much info from either side.

Congratulations, you just realized that the entire M&E group are as you described. Everytime there is a card drive to separate ourselves from the majority and for us to become the majority title 2 guys decide to stay with fleet service. Title 2 guys are like title 1 guys. They biitch and complain like old ladies and when someone steps up to better ourselves they do nothing but become defensive and believe the TWU lies. If title 2 enjoys being the minority then you'll be treated as such. Aircraft maintenance is no different. The current negotiations is a perfect example.

 

[WeAAsles]

Congratulations, you just realized that the entire M&E group are as you described. Everytime there is a card drive to separate ourselves from the majority and for us to become the majority title 2 guys decide to stay with fleet service. Title 2 guys are like title 1 guys. They biitch and complain like old ladies and when someone steps up to better ourselves they do nothing but become defensive and believe the TWU lies. If title 2 enjoys being the minority then you'll be treated as such. Aircraft maintenance is no different. The current negotiations is a perfect example.

This individual is a full blown liar.

More focus has been given to “Aircraft Maintenance” from the Association and particularly and especially BY FAR the TWU than Fleet or any other “and Related” groups.

No Newspaper articles, leaflets, media focus, billboards, banner ads, NYC Times Square, Wrigley Field, or Airport protests for the plight of the outsourced Fleet Service Clerk.

So THAT makes you a full blown liar. Pinnochio.

EDIT: Forgot to add the former director of Homeland Security’s Tom Ridge report. (That was for outsourced AMT work)

 

[texasreb]

There is a thing called diminishing returns. The union will not get a better deal than they can get right now. Every day will results in you folks getting less not more. As others have mentioned an economic downturn is very likely (overdue) and that weakens your negotiating position substantially. You should be demanding the union go to the company and ask for one last final offer (hopefully close to the pulled one) and the union should guarantee the company it goes to an immediate R&F vote.

Welcome to the TWU. We always wait for a worse deal.

 

[1AA]

Welcome to the TWU. We always wait for a worse deal.

Yes sir, here it comes.
Three years of negotiations and now we are entering Section 6. Then if that doesn't get a T/A for all groups a mediator will step in. Section 6 can take a while. Mediated negotiations is no quick trip to the grocery store. The association has three groups that might end up under mediation. No one really knows how that process will work as far as a time frame. With the association all groups have to have a T/A in place before any vote takes place. If this drags on for years, the APA will have a T/A to vote on before we get our first contract after BK. The dues keep flowing and the company keeps making money. What's the big rush to settle?

 

[Tim Nelson]

View attachment 13347

“The mean annual wage for aviation maintenance technicians was reported as $61,190 in the year 2016, according to BLS. The lowest 10% of aviation maintenance technicians earned a salary of less than $35,960, while the highest 10% earned more than $87,880 annually.Sep 5, 2017”

Aren’t you currently near $20,000 per year over that posted salary above? That also doesn’t count your 401k match (5.5% is above the Corporate average BTW) and your Medical Benefits either.

Now I know you’re going to twist the raise from 2016 to the negative but I will say that it was the Association that “Signed off” on getting you that money.

according to bls a pilot makes about $130,000. BLS stats arent reflective of mainline jobs.

 

[Tim Nelson]

i

So you’re ok with giving up in Contractual language even more work after we gave at the office in 2003 and in the BK?

How many jobs do you feel “contractually” is ok?

Is it ok to give up all those Facilities Maintenance jobs all over the Country?

Now what about the wage offer? Only 3% above ?. How much is the percentage yearly they want to offer us after that? 1%? 2%? per year?

What happens if that wage makes us fall behind our peers in the life of the Contract with no look back? Are you ok with that?

Does a $3000.00 Bonus over a minimum 5 year deal entice you?

Do you want the Buyout?

dont think anyone is comfortable with what the company has said is offered, but the reality is that its a cost positive offer of over $120 million a year for fleet (about $10,000 more each). And i guess we can get greedy and expand fleet job and keep pressing for $40 and lus health but its likely that the offer will go far less...not more.

 

[2ndGENAMT]

mike757 we are included in the buyout but they want the majority of us to go away in time.we are such a small group they pay very little attention to us and it is hard to get much info from either side.

That terrible Association. Those absolute BASTARDS!!!!!

View attachment 13348

WeAAz, all the Association did to get that raise was sign a document!!
Doug threw that out and they jumped on it like starving dogs without even evaluating how it would impact negotiations.

 

[WeAAsles]

Yes sir, here it comes.
Three years of negotiations and now we are entering Section 6. Then if that doesn't get a T/A for all groups a mediator will step in. Section 6 can take a while. Mediated negotiations is no quick trip to the grocery store. The association has three groups that might end up under mediation. No one really knows how that process will work as far as a time frame. With the association all groups have to have a T/A in place before any vote takes place. If this drags on for years, the APA will have a T/A to vote on before we get our first contract after BK. The dues keep flowing and the company keeps making money. What's the big rush to settle?

Hey if you look down the road you might notice that your AMT counterparts at SWA represented by AMFA passed 6 (SIX) years now. And it looks like they’re going to vote down their last offer so maybe many more years are going to pass before they’re ever satisfied?

Kind of makes it hard for your drive if the group you once loved sucks big Donkey balls.

according to bls a pilot makes about $130,000. BLS stats arent reflective of mainline jobs.

The BLS takes into account all individuals employed in a particular “profession.”

Just because we’re all “LUCKY” enough to have made it to the Major League is irrelevant.

You could easily still be toiling away at Piedmont earning $14.00 per hour (The BLS average for Baggage Porter)

 

[WeAAsles]

WeAAz, all the Association did to get that raise was sign a document!!
Doug threw that out and they jumped on it like starving dogs without even evaluating how it would impact negotiations.

Uh maybe if you guys hadn’t been engaging in your eh eh eh “By the Book” initiative the Company wouldn’t have felt compelled to ask the Association what they could do to “settle it down”?

It was actually you guys who were the starving dogs unfortunately.

But c’mon seriously. Are you really going to complain about the money you’ve been making the last two years or would you REALLY prefer we were still waiting?

 

[Tim Nelson]

Hey if you look down the road you might notice that your AMT counterparts at SWA represented by AMFA passed 6 (SIX) years now. And it looks like they’re going to vote down their last offer so maybe many more years are going to pass before they’re ever satisfied?

Kind of makes it hard for your drive if the group you once loved sucks big Donkey balls.



The BLS takes into account all individuals employed in a particular “profession.”

Just because we’re all “LUCKY” enough to have made it to the Major League is irrelevant.

You could easily still be toiling away at Piedmont earning $14.00 per hour (The BLS average for Baggage Porter)

it includes McGee air, swissport etc. I was making $17.88 non union with piedmont in 1994. Then our section 6 took us 5 years and we traded $17.88 to get $20.08 in 1998 but we agreed that the company can nab all 82 stations with less than 15 flights.

In 2003, we took a $47 million concession to get the lesser pension and cashed in all non hub pay down to $15 so the hubs could make $17.
So from 1994 to 2008 I actually took a pay cut. Toss in a loss of $800 more for dues.

 

[title 2]

Congratulations, you just realized that the entire M&E group are as you described. Everytime there is a card drive to separate ourselves from the majority and for us to become the majority title 2 guys decide to stay with fleet service. Title 2 guys are like title 1 guys. They biitch and complain like old ladies and when someone steps up to better ourselves they do nothing but become defensive and believe the TWU lies. If title 2 enjoys being the minority then you'll be treated as such. Aircraft maintenance is no different. The current negotiations is a perfect example.

Be careful what you say i have filed a card for every card drive since 1990 even though many of my title 1 brothers wanted to contract my job out in the 2003 negotiations .I think we need a different union but being a minority i plan on being sacrificed by the majority doesn't matter who it is.i've been here for over 30 years I'm still waiting for this place to get better ain't gonna happen when we work for AMERICA WEST AIRLINES.