August 2013 Pilot Discussion

[Claxon]

I was serious, it was a good recap. An actual thoughtful post. Better than the usual chest beating from others, both sides included. RR

Agreed. Callaway from the start of the MOU discussion had an excellent grasp of what it did and did not do with the seniority battle. Specifically Nicolau and ripeness.

 

[Phoenix]

Here is my humble and uncomplicated view. The trial will go forward in less than a month. USAPA will lose. They will then appeal to the 9th. By the time the circuit court renders a decision, the merger will either be history or history, depending on your definition. If the merger fails, we are back to where we were, arguing ripeness but with a watchful eye on the company's DJ appeal. If they win the appeal, things get complicated. If they lose, we are still parked, under injunction and things get complicated. If the merger goes forward and USAPA submits one list using DOH with C/Rs, the west pilots are forever locked in their position on the LCC list and I believe this triggers harm/ripeness and things get complicated. If USAPA submits two lists and the west represents it's own class, there is certainly risk but less complicated.

Hope that helps the discussion.

'84

Ok, so Article III isn't important. Fiat is important....why not?.. why should fiat be the sole purview of the treasury. What remedy will Silver provide? A new union by fiat? A new negotiating position via fiat? She is a lose cannon, no disrespect intended. She contradicts herself and has no compunction of doing so. Who can know if it is better to strap your seat belt on hard or would you be better off being thrown from the vehicle before she flings it all over the cliff.

 

[Reed Richards]

Ok, so Article III isn't important. Fiat is important. What remedy will Silver provide? A new union by fiat? A new negotiating position via fiat? She is a lose cannon, no disrespect intended. She contradicts herself and has no compunction of doing so. Who can know if it is better to strap your seat belt on hard or would you be better off being thrown from the vehicle before she flings it all over the cliff.

I picture one of the 4-500 West Class members who have never joined any union. The poor pilot wakes up one morning to find some judge has "assigned" him a new bargaining agent. No vote, no nothing...and said agent will bargain for his seniority. Let the lawsuits continue. RR

 

[mrbreeze]

She is a lose cannon, no disrespect intended. She contradicts herself and has no compunction of doing so.

Maybe this is the reason for her demotion. breeze

 

[mrbreeze]

Sorry, but she sure sounds a lot like my bi-polar ex-wife.

 

[Phoenix]

I picture one of the 4-500 West Class members who have never joined any union. The poor pilot wakes up one morning to find some judge has "assigned" him a new bargaining agent. No vote, no nothing...and said agent will bargain for his seniority. Let the lawsuits continue. RR

I should have been a lawyer. I mean Nic, Fodase, RezJud, Clear, etc. etc. etc. have told me (by association) that I have the character for it. But I'm think being a judge would be better. 😀

 

[Phoenix]

Maybe this is the reason for her demotion. breeze

Word. This.

 

[Reed Richards]

Maybe this is the reason for her recent demotion. breeze

I think she was just sitting in for the poor judge that was killed. There may be politics involved in who was assigned to the permanent position, but we probably owe Silver a thanks for taking on the extra workload that was hers following the tragic event. Her "demotion" will actually occur if she continues down the path she is on. Guess we just have to wait and see. She is almost totally unpredictable. RR

 

[Phoenix]

I think she was just sitting in for the poor judge that was killed. There may be politics involved in who was assigned to the permanent position, but we probably owe Silver a thanks for taking on the extra workload that was hers following the tragic event. Her "demotion" will actually occur if she continues down the path she is on. Guess we just have to wait and see. She is almost totally unpredictable. RR

She is unpredictable, and the 9th's willingness to allow her to continue without Article III jurisdiction is very strange (unpredictable too). Someone got a late night call telling them the DOJ will drop everything by mid October, or their cat showed up dead on the doorstep, maybe. Even if the DOJ capitulates fully the trial Silver is adventuring still lacks Article III jurisdiction (the DOJ just made it more obvious).

The way things have been going I'm starting to think the answers are shaped in the political shadows and brought forward by black robed couriers, with a little letter head and a bailiff standing by to keep up appearances..... And nobody should be comfortable about where that "Plinko Game" goes.


Judge Silver's secret assistant:

 

[Pi brat]

She is unpredictable, and the 9th's willingness to allow her to continue without Article III jurisdiction is very strange (unpredictable too). Someone got a late night call telling them the DOJ will drop everything by mid October, or their cat showed up dead on the doorstep, maybe. Even if the DOJ capitulates fully the trial Silver is adventuring still lacks Article III jurisdiction (the DOJ just made it more obvious).

The way things have been going I'm starting to think the answers are shaped in the political shadows and brought forward by black robed couriers, with a little letter head and a bailiff standing by to keep up appearances..... And nobody should be comfortable about where that "Plinko Game" goes.

I don't know. Maybe the 9th ruling is the equivalent of captain's authority. Judge Silver's case isn't going to kill anyone, so they don't want to step in before she rules. They mentioned that Mandamus was "extraordinary." She has said things before, leading people to believe one thing, only to rule, in the end, another way. Maybe this is their version of "not ripe", we have to see how she rules.

 

[Reed Richards]

She is unpredictable, and the 9th's willingness to allow her to continue without Article III jurisdiction is very strange (unpredictable too). Someone got a late night call telling them the DOJ will drop everything by mid October, or their cat showed up dead on the doorstep, maybe. Even if the DOJ capitulates fully the trial Silver is adventuring still lacks Article III jurisdiction (the DOJ just made it more obvious).

The way things have been going I'm starting to think the answers are shaped in the political shadows and brought forward by black robed couriers, with a little letter head and a bailiff standing by to keep up appearances..... And nobody should be comfortable about where that "Plinko Game" goes.


Judge Silver's secret assistant:

I guess we all have our outhouse lawyer opinions (and so sorry if you are actually a lawyer!) The Ninth could have ended this quickly, but I can only guess they want others to do their dirty work. The Ninth has to know they will see this again. They might as well wait and hope for the best from Silver. Maybe they will dodge having to make a major overturn of a sitting Federal judge. RR

 

[Phoenix]

I guess we all have our outhouse lawyer opinions (and so sorry if you are actually a lawyer!) The Ninth could have ended this quickly, but I can only guess they want others to do their dirty work. The Ninth has to know they will see this again. They might as well wait and hope for the best from Silver. Maybe they will dodge having to make a major overturn of a sitting Federal judge. RR

Yes, it could be just a case of hoping to save face for a colleague.

But the fact remains not one single judge anywhere has provided a defense of the attack on their Article III jurisdiction (and not USAPA's attack by the way). Silver undermined herself in open court by adjudging that harm isn't something that is asserted until after she holds the trial, the plaintiff makes its claim (that doesn't include harm), and then the defense makes its case (to prove they are innocent, of an unknown harm, according to an unknown standard, by reason of LUP ).

I haven't read the case the 9th cited.... perhaps it was a precedent setting case to never intervene during a three ring circus until after the elephants have dropped their load.

 

[Res Judicata]

I don't know. Maybe the 9th ruling is the equivalent of captain's authority. Judge Silver's case isn't going to kill anyone, so they don't want to step in before she rules. They mentioned that Mandamus was "extraordinary." She has said things before, leading people to believe one thing, only to rule, in the end, another way. Maybe this is their version of "not ripe", we have to see how she rules.

Yeah, that's it,....OR....everybody is sick to death of your scab antics and the z9th spanked the #### out of you. Any of those names on the order look familiar?

 

[Res Judicata]

I don't think any east pilot thinks we will prevail in Arizona. Silver will take care of the west just like Wake. I can't wait to see the creative writing session in late October. As soon as she issues her advisory opinion we fly west to the 9th again.

Hate

You already did, they they just said "FK off"

 

[dca319]

Maybe this is the reason for her demotion. breeze

Demoted? A minute or two on Google and you'd know she never had any intention of permanently assuming those duties of the murdered Judge Rol. She took senior status.