August 2013 Pilot Discussion

[snapthis]

Sorry, have to throw the 'loaded question' flag on that one. Also known as logical fallacy. Are you going to ask if I still beat my wife next?

We're not trying to cheat a process. We're trying to dismantle and depose a flawed and unfair process which, in addition, no longer governs us.

You only found flaws after the award came out. Why is that?

If it was flawed then you should not have participated in the process and you should have brought another arbitrator to the table.

Nic was your arbitrator. You gambled, you lost. I have no sympathy for crybabies.

 

[electricjet98]

We're not trying to cheat a process. We're trying to dismantle and depose a flawed and unfair process which, in addition, no longer governs us.

You don't agree with the decision of a neutral body that you previously agreed to accept and now wish to replace it with a product designed solely by your fellow east pilots for the sole benefit of east pilots. Get of your sanctimonious high-horse KV...you're smarter than that.

 

[nevergiveup]

You don't agree with the decision of a neutral body that you previously agreed to accept and now wish to replace it with a product designed solely by your fellow east pilots for the sole benefit of east pilots. Get of your sanctimonious high-horse KV...you're smarter than that.

The award had to be fair enough that it would allow us to get a contract. The majority felt it was not. This is why things are the way they are. Snap can whine all day long, but it won't change things.

 

[Freighterguynow]

By trying to cheat a process.

The only group cheating is the West..

Separate Ops - Joint Contract - Membership Ratification - No timeline.

West ideology - circumvent agreed to process by attempting collusion with Management, file grievances, sue, get judge to impose, BPR motions.

A thousand NIC monkeys at a thousand typewriters.

Though, I must say the epic West fail ( specifically talking about the merger not the others ) has been quite entertaining and well worth the cost of admission - yours.

 

[traderjake]

You have a third grade education. There's a fundamental law called "supply and demand". Deal with it.

In our case it's a function of no leverage, I'd think a union founder would understand that.

 

[traderjake]

You do realize you've just included yourself in your own insult ?

Yes I realize I don't have a "real airline career", breeze doesn't understand that point and claims the West is envious.

 

[traderjake]

Not the same thing. Both sides are defending their legal rights.

Only one side reneged on a mutually agreed upon arbitration process.

 

[snapthis]

The award had to be fair enough that it would allow us to get a contract. The majority felt it was not. This is why things are the way they are. Snap can whine all day long, but it won't change things.

I'd call the founding of USAPA the ultimate whine. If y'all were dissatisfied with ALPA why did you not form the association prior to the arbitration?

 

[Portly Dorman]

From the bpr notes-

On the August 6th notice of the West Recall of 66 pilots, the Company is now saying there will only be 5 pilots per class, and the next class will be in January 2014. Dave also mentioned the West Section 22 Protest, and a group of pilot protesting the July 2013 list is not correct. Basically, Grievance will say they do not dispute the Company's position that the list is correct.

So has it been filed? And rejected??

Seems no on both counts, any 'insider' got better info than the GC??

 

[traderjake]

We're trying to dismantle and depose a flawed and unfair process which, in addition, no longer governs us.

If anything was flawed it was the DOH/LOS strategy the MEC forced the Merger Committee to adopt.

Your claim that it no longer governs us is a little premature.

 

[Portly Dorman]

More from the bpr notes-

Dave continued his briefing with some facts on 2 East, and 1 West Termination Cases. He also briefed the Board on the Company's renewed attempt to collect money from former MDA pilots. The alleged over-payments range from hundreds to thousands of dollars per pilot, according to the Company. In the Company’s latest letters they have applied different standards to our pilots depending on their domicile. For the pilots that are based in CLT, they have notified the pilot that they have to choose a re-payment option or face a deduction from the payroll check beginning next month. For pilots based in the other domiciles (DCA & PHL) the Company has threatened the pilots with passing the alleged debt to a Collections Agency if they don’t choose a re-payment option.
USAPA does not believe the monies the Company seeks to collect are overpayments, and likewise, USAPA does not believe that the Company’s collection of the monies was contemplated within Arbitrator Wallin’s Award (MEC 07-05-05). Additionally, there is no contractual guidance in the East Agreement for the Company to collect said monies. Grievance will have direction and guidance to offer these pilots soon.
Amazing how Perella can make an agreement to have money deducted from the west with no fight ad yet the east pilots the get the full force of the GC.
So much for equal representation.

 

[nevergiveup]

I'd call the founding of USAPA the ultimate whine. If y'all were dissatisfied with ALPA why did you not form the association prior to the arbitration?

Attemps had previously been made. Next.

 

[snapthis]

Attemps had previously been made. Next.

Did you wear yellow lanyards?

 

[Phoenix]

Only one side reneged on a mutually agreed upon arbitration process.

I recommend sue for damages.

 

[767one]

Plausible. I could see it backfiring though. Have we seen the last of Bethune?

One never knows about Bethune. My son sent me a link to an interview of Bethune upon his departure from Continental in....2004? The article gave great insight into his understanding of employee/employer relationships and the consequences of pissing off your employees. I can't find the link now but perhaps somone more computer savvy could dig it up and send it to Doug......or perhaps just urinate in a wet suit and get a warm feeling because Doug does not care or understand about those things.

Bob