BALLS of STEEL check in

[odie01]

With contract negotiations comming up in a few weeks, are you prepared to strike if need be? I don't think they can find enough qualified mechanics to replace us. It's a gamble I'm willing to take, we did our part to allow AA to take their profits and pay down debt, buy airplanes ect. Enough is enough!

 

[TWU informer]

With contract negotiations comming up in a few weeks, are you prepared to strike if need be? I don't think they can find enough qualified mechanics to replace us. It's a gamble I'm willing to take, we did our part to allow AA to take their profits and pay down debt, buy airplanes ect. Enough is enough!

What's the Strike issue?

Line GEO Pay?

Outsourced O/H?

7 Day Coverage in TUL?

New AMT Classification?

Do really want or think everyone should blindly say, "Yeah I will risk everything" without even knowing the Table Position of the Union or the Company? If yes, you're nothing more than a chest pounder running or pure emotion and ZERO facts.

Tell me what impasse issue is then I will anser your question.

I will tell you one thing, I am NOT going to follow some emotional fool off a cliff like a lemming.

 

[odie01]

Wrong thread Informer! This is "BALLS of STEEL" not "OVARIES of BRASS". What happens if the company tells us to "go pack sand" ? Are you with us?

 

[TWU informer]

Wrong thread Informer! This is "BALLS of STEEL" not "OVARIES of BRASS". What happens if the company tells us to "go pack sand" ? Are you with us?

NO Im am not following you! There are some I would give my life for and I can tell you aren't one of them.

What part of that don't you understand?

Now go take some Prozac and mellow out before you hurt yourself or someone else.

 

[odie01]

NO Im am not following you! There are some I would give my life for and I can tell you aren't one of them.

What part of that don't you understand?

Now go take some Prozac and mellow out before you hurt yourself or someone else.

Hey, I don't want to argue with you, I just wanted to know if your going to stand behind Bob, Larry, and the rest of the negotiating team if things go South. I now know your position. And what do you mean when you say, " I'm not going to follow you?" I won't be the only guy walking the picket line, but it sounds like you might be the only one crossing.

 

[TWU informer]

Hey, I don't want to argue with you, I just wanted to know if your going to stand behind Bob, Larry, and the rest of the negotiating team if things go South. I now know your position.

When they tell me what we are asking for and then after we get the company response, I will decide.

But I am not going to use an internet forum as I tool to make myself feel better better about the corner the TWU backed themselves into. It is these type of false threats and bluffs that got us in this position to begin with. And now you want to pile on with more of the same.

Let me just say this.

Whatever action I take to get my point across and support the negotiators will not be openly posted on the internet.
Get it?

 

[odie01]

When they tell me what we are asking for and then after we get the company response, I will decide.

But I am not going to use an internet forum as I tool to make myself feel better better about the corner the TWU backed themselves into. It is these type of false threats and bluffs that got us in this position to begin with. And now you want to pile on with more of the same.

Let me just say this.

Whatever action I take to get my point across and support the negotiators will not be openly posted on the internet.
Get it?

Your right, false threats and bluffs used by the twu, directed towards its membership, did get us backed into this corner! It was a simple question, Would you walk with us if negotiations fell through? If you elect to stay in your foxhole, thats ok, we'll fight for ya.

 

[Hackman]

When they tell me what we are asking for and then after we get the company response, I will decide.

But I am not going to use an internet forum as I tool to make myself feel better better about the corner the TWU backed themselves into. It is these type of false threats and bluffs that got us in this position to begin with. And now you want to pile on with more of the same.

Let me just say this.

Whatever action I take to get my point across and support the negotiators will not be openly posted on the internet.
Get it?

If I may interject. I surmise with your former post Informer of you voting YES for more concessions on the latest TWu sellout that you are done with the fight against the continued AA management greed and lies. That's fine if your are, but don't dismiss those who are not yet finished.

I don't regard Odie's post a "false threat or bluff". That time has come and went, about the same time the last concessionary TWu T/A was voted down this summer. I took the vote very seriously, as serious as when I voted NO in 2003 for the life altering concessions we are still suffering under 8 years later.

I know what it means to say....."no more". I don't like it, but sometimes a taking a stand isn't any fun.

From what I have heard (rumor), the contract proposal is going start from what we lost in 2003, and go from there. I say that's the minimum.

If management can continue to reward themselves for losing billions year over year, then we can expect the same. Shared Sacrifice....or die trying.

 

[Frank Szabo]

Hey, I don't want to argue with you, I just wanted to know if your going to stand behind Bob, Larry, and the rest of the negotiating team if things go South. I now know your position. And what do you mean when you say, " I'm not going to follow you?" I won't be the only guy walking the picket line, but it sounds like you might be the only one crossing.

Odie, I've got a question for you - or anyone else that'd care to answer.

A number of people seem to be quite willing to send the TWu packing, replacing 'it' with AMP. Considering the TWu's continual failures to the company's favor over the years, it is more than understandable a group of slackers such as that would be tossed to the street.

What I fail to understand is why, on one hand, some are trying to replace them yet on the other hand that same group is willing to follow them out on a strike, knowing full well the TWu "leadership" would not have been given "authorization" to call a strike unless it played into their owners' plans. From all accounts, the initial "for show" request for release from mediation to the NMB has been withdrawn by Little Jimmy.

So - if we collectively trust the TWu enough (with our jobs) to follow a possible call to to strike the company, why is there a drive on attempting to replace them?

If, on the other hand, we don't trust them at all why would any of us be willing to listen to any of the TWu's directives, obviously being the product of a bought-and-paid-for corporate mouthpiece maneuvering its membership for the maximum advantage of its true master?

 

[TWU informer]

Because the original post was not based on logic but rather a desire to talk tough on the internet to "scare" AA Mangement into an agreement.....ROFL.

There is no need to be discussing a strike anyway.

Local 514 has already started the manipulation to accept a deal that is coming.

http://twu514.org/blog/2010/11/30/agreement-side-by-side-%e2%80%93-key-provisions/#more-1715

There will soon be another T/A.
There will not be a Local President calling poeple Cave Men and telling them to shut their Pie Hole.
There will not be seperate informational meetings to explain the new T/A.

There will be a large meeting, with company provided Power Point Presentatiion explaining the next should be a YES VOTE. Basically explaining that before a Strike we would end up in a PEB and the company would simply show the CO Agreement as the Industry Standard and show that in many aspects we already have it better than that recently ratified T/A at CO. GAME OVER

And then the next T/A will pass.

 

[odie01]

Odie, I've got a question for you - or anyone else that'd care to answer.

A number of people seem to be quite willing to send the TWu packing, replacing 'it' with AMP. Considering the TWu's continual failures to the company's favor over the years, it is more than understandable a group of slackers such as that would be tossed to the street.

What I fail to understand is why, on one hand, some are trying to replace them yet on the other hand that same group is willing to follow them out on a strike, knowing full well the TWu "leadership" would not have been given "authorization" to call a strike unless it played into their owners' plans. From all accounts, the initial "for show" request for release from mediation to the NMB has been withdrawn by Little Jimmy.

So - if we collectively trust the TWu enough (with our jobs) to follow a possible call to to strike the company, why is there a drive on attempting to replace them?

If, on the other hand, we don't trust them at all why would any of us be willing to listen to any of the TWu's directives, obviously being the product of a bought-and-paid-for corporate mouthpiece maneuvering its membership for the maximum advantage of its true master?

Their is a drive to replace the twu because we shouldn't even be here to begin with, we are caught between a twu and a hard place. What do we do Frank? What happens if the company doesn't go for the minimum 2001 contract, and tells us to go play in traffic? Do we put on our red snake shirts and go hisss, hisss? Its out of our hands, everyone should sign an AMP card to put pressure on the company/twu int., and the international needs to realize they need to stay out of our business or they WILL be replaced.

 

[Bob Owens]

Because the original post was not based on logic but rather a desire to talk tough on the internet to "scare" AA Mangement into an agreement.....ROFL.

There is no need to be discussing a strike anyway.

Local 514 has already started the manipulation to accept a deal that is coming.

http://twu514.org/blog/2010/11/30/agreement-side-by-side-%e2%80%93-key-provisions/#more-1715

There will soon be another T/A.
There will not be a Local President calling poeple Cave Men and telling them to shut their Pie Hole.
There will not be seperate informational meetings to explain the new T/A.

There will be a large meeting, with company provided Power Point Presentatiion explaining the next should be a YES VOTE. Basically explaining that before a Strike we would end up in a PEB and the company would simply show the CO Agreement as the Industry Standard and show that in many aspects we already have it better than that recently ratified T/A at CO. GAME OVER

And then the next T/A will pass.

I think that was sent out by Don Videtich, hence my previously stated aprehensions.

First of all our contractual provisions do not cap outsourcing at 10%, thats the current rate, not the contractual one. So the very first box is wrong, the current 10% rate is not a contractual limit. AA sends out less because its cheaper to do it in house not because of our Scope language, if anything the current rate is that low because of Article 4, not Article 1. The data also includes foreign mechanics on AA payroll but not in the contract group. Since its total maintenance spending it would also include management, so every time they get a raise they could send out more union jobs.

I believe the Premedicare is wrong as well. Continental has a plan similar to SWA where they use 11 or 12 hours of their sick bank per month for coverage.

I believe they also have partial company paid LTD coverage.

Its really moot anyway, the agreement dissapears once the merger with UAL is completed. The UAL guys are pushing for a new union because they say the IBT has not delivered on any of their promises. (Reportedly they told the laid off workers they would get them their jobs back, that hasnt happened)Thats going to motivate the IBT to do considerably more with the UAL agreement. (I dont know how long those on layoff have recall rights) The UAL numbers are not clustered low cost areas. The OH they still have is in SFO and UAL guys tend to be more militant. They booted two unions in the last ten years. The IBT has to perform, they also have to explain to the UAL guys why they feel that $46.99 is not enough for UPS mechanics but UAL mechanics should not expect as much.

If we are going to compare contracts we should compare to a company that hasnt ever filed for BK and will actually still exist in 2012, SWA.

 

[MCI transplant]

Because the original post was not based on logic but rather a desire to talk tough on the internet to "scare" AA Mangement into an agreement.....ROFL.

There is no need to be discussing a strike anyway.

Local 514 has already started the manipulation to accept a deal that is coming.

http://twu514.org/blog/2010/11/30/agreement-side-by-side-%e2%80%93-key-provisions/#more-1715

There will soon be another T/A.
There will not be a Local President calling poeple Cave Men and telling them to shut their Pie Hole.
There will not be seperate informational meetings to explain the new T/A.

There will be a large meeting, with company provided Power Point Presentatiion explaining the next should be a YES VOTE. Basically explaining that before a Strike we would end up in a PEB and the company would simply show the CO Agreement as the Industry Standard and show that in many aspects we already have it better than that recently ratified T/A at CO. GAME OVER

And then the next T/A will pass.

Informer, I'm glad to see that you have your Crystal ball all polished up. And there's a good chance that it might turn out that way. But let me be the one to ask the hard question. -------Would you take such an adamant stance if your personal situation were different? ------ And I've got to say that, at this point in time, any one that doesn't prepare for the worst case, a strike, if it happens, or not, is a fool!

 

[odie01]

Informer, I'm glad to see that you have your Crystal ball all polished up. And there's a good chance that it might turn out that way. But let me be the one to ask the hard question. -------Would you take such an adamant stance if your personal situation were different? ------ And I've got to say that, at this point in time, any one that doesn't prepare for the worst case, a strike, if it happens, or not, is a fool!

That's my point, it's down to the nut cuttin. I don't think everyone understands what is about to happen.

 

[MCI transplant]

That's my point, it's down to the nut cuttin. I don't think everyone understands what is about to happen.

If that's the case, my apologies to Informer! The rest,------ stands!