CLT Local F/A Meeting.... and questions for Crew Schd.

[flybynite]

How about addressing what the heck is up with all those worthless Allnighters. With what they are paying, it isn't worth the trouble wasting my time putting on The Costume or making a run to Aeropuerto. Comprehende! And they need to RELAX the TIMES ON etb trips for RESERVES. Many BHs put stuff on the Board for the junior folks to pick up but that BS 1000/1800 nonsesnse interferes. IF YOU are OFF, You should be OFF. Period. (The junior people are carrying a financial burden like No OTHERS.......I don't want to fly 90hours but many times I can't get rid of the crap)

I agree about what alot of what you are saying. I think the ETB is broken. It's become too restrictive.
I think it should be pay & credit and that alone would free up scheduling from having to reschedule the whole bloody
airline every day. It would be more fluid. And you'd be able to get rid of your trips.

As for the 24/7 issue. Maybe we can get the company to waive that at a "f/a's request". It seems to me I read that United allows that. I could be wrong. Don't hold me to it.

:unsure:

 

[EMBFA]

24/7 is an FAA rule that cannot be waived.

 

[jbragg476]

Well I for one would like to know if the FAA considers us an being on-dut when we are on call, the what's up with being on call for 24hrs a day. Technically if I am on-duty @ midnight.. and I can only be schedule for up to a 15 hr duty day...then my day reguardless of what trip I may get from daily should be over by 5pm.

Lets see the FAA enforce that like they do the 24/7. We should have shifts for rsv like every other airline. And if we need to use the FAA to do it.. I don't mind sending them a letter.

 

[Travelpro72]

The purpose of asking scheduling questions is pointless. The company is NOT going to change anything that is in the contract or one of our thousands of side letters unless it something THEY want to change. They have no reason to nor any legal obligation to explore any change. We have a broken system and are stuck with it. I wish they would do this in PHL. At least ONE base has their heads together.

 

[EMBFA]

From FAR 91.1957

Reserve Status means that status in which a flight crewmember, by arrangement with the program manager: Holds himself or herself fit to fly to the extent that is within the control of the flight crewmember; remains within a reasonable response time of the aircraft as agreed between the flight crewmember and the program manager; and maintains a ready means whereby the flight crewmember may be contacted by the program manager. Reserve status is not part of any duty period or rest period.
---------

Reserve is not actual duty, but it is also not to be considered rest. Interesting....

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Rest period means a period of time required pursuant to this subpart that is free of all responsibility for work or duty prior to the commencement of, or following completion of, a duty period, and which the flight crewmember or flight attendant cannot be required to receive contact from the program manager. A rest period does not include any time during which the program manager imposes on a flight crewmember or flight attendant any duty or restraint, including any actual work or present responsibility for work should the occasion arise.
-------------

I bold this part because this, in my opinion kills the "more than 24 hour layover equals 24 in 7 rest" philosophy. You are not free from restraint and duty on a layover. You could be reassigned, delayed, cancelled, and are to be contactable.

91.1062 Duty Periods and rest requiremments: Flight Attendants is worth a read too.

Our flight attendants, in my opinion, are notoriously bad at seeing the big picture. It saddens me to see these F/As fighting for the ability to not have a government mandated rest period, or relaxation of ETB rules- for the ability to work more on thier days off! For what? You should not have to work on your off day to simply get by. When was that idea beaten out of you?

Fight for better pay and conditions, not to deteriorate the few human dignities your employer is forced to abide by per law.

 

[N109UW]

I will hand it to CLT AFA for following the bylaws in holding a meeting before the AFA Annual BOD meeting. They gave notice to the members and allowed the people wanting to attend to bid accordingly. They extended an invite to John Petronzi who will be able to answer many many questions.

Don't get too impressed yet. This is the first real meeting we have had since Flores went to the MECp position. We'll have to see how it goes. Stay tuned.

 

[N109UW]

Well I for one would like to know if the FAA considers us an being on-dut when we are on call, the what's up with being on call for 24hrs a day. Technically if I am on-duty @ midnight.. and I can only be schedule for up to a 15 hr duty day...then my day reguardless of what trip I may get from daily should be over by 5pm.

Lets see the FAA enforce that like they do the 24/7. We should have shifts for rsv like every other airline. And if we need to use the FAA to do it.. I don't mind sending them a letter.

Write the FAA about it. Quit bitching about this and write. I posted the address to the FAA and who to contact earlier. It's easy too #### on here, but have some real b*lls and write the FAA. Yes, we should have a break during the 24 hours on duty, but the FAA has to approve it, just like the pilots.

 

[Zarah]

---

I bold this part because this, in my opinion kills the "more than 24 hour layover equals 24 in 7 rest" philosophy. You are not free from restraint and duty on a layover. You could be reassigned, delayed, cancelled, and are to be contactable.



Fight for better pay and conditions, not to deteriorate the few human dignities your employer is forced to abide by per law.

You are not required to answer your cell phone, jetway phone, or hotel phone while on a trip. If the company wants you they can go through the flight deck to reach you or meet you at the jetway door.

 

[EMBFA]

Different carriers (or unions really) intepret this the other way.

It's giving permission. If you allow your 24 hours layover on an ETB trip to count as your one day of rest, you are setting a precedence. How about the company flying you six days straight, then leaving you in a hotel for 24 hours 'rest' before launching you on another six days? We are our own worst enemies.

 

[Zarah]

Different carriers (or unions really) intepret this the other way.

It's giving permission. If you allow your 24 hours layover on an ETB trip to count as your one day of rest, you are setting a precedence. How about the company flying you six days straight, then leaving you in a hotel for 24 hours 'rest' before launching you on another six days? We are our own worst enemies.

Not sure if the you were directing that at me... if you were, I would never agree to allow the company to hold me responsible for being available for contact by cell phone (they do not pay my cell phone bill) while on duty or be held prisnor in my hotel room for fear of a no contact.

If the company wants me they can reach me through the flight deck or meet me at the gate.

If you want the company to count a layover as rest, if you don't want the company to count a layover as rest, or if you want it to be the FAs option to count or not count a layover then work with the union to change the language to what you find acceptable.

Myself, I rarely do ETB trip and the few I have done are 1 day trips.

It doesn't matter to me if the company counts a layover as a rest period or not. I would support what the group wants so long as I am not held accountable for being avilable for contact by scheduling during my layover or while on duty except if contacted via the flight deck.

That is a ball of stress I do not need.

 

[N109UW]

Different carriers (or unions really) intepret this the other way.

It's giving permission. If you allow your 24 hours layover on an ETB trip to count as your one day of rest, you are setting a precedence. How about the company flying you six days straight, then leaving you in a hotel for 24 hours 'rest' before launching you on another six days? We are our own worst enemies.

East side used to have it so the 24 hour break had to be in base, but Mike Flores gave that up after the 24 hour rule went into effect. BH's were having trouble doubleing up, but this screwed RSV's. So, you see were again, RSV's feel jerked. He should have asked the membership if they wanted this or not.

 

[EMBFA]

By 'you' I mean the entire group. I cringe when I hear F/As crying about 'the 24 hours rule' because they see the inability to work extra on thier off day as food from thier mouths. If they would stand back and look at what they are saying, theyare accepting thier horrible conditions, and asking for more of the same. They should be seeking acceptable pay, work rules, and credit for all time worked instead of trying to renegotiate what is in actuality a horrible deal. It's like a prisoner trying to negotiate with a guard to serve him butter sandwiches instead of margerine instead of devising a plan to get out of the jail.

I understand when scheduling can and not call a F/A, but that is not what I'm referring to with the FAR. Maybe I'm not explaining clearly.The FAR does not specifically state that your 24 hours rest needs to be in your domicile- that is a contract issue, not a federal one. Many companies and unions do not view being on a layover as 'free from duty and restaint'. It is generally understood at US that your 24 hours is completely off, in your domicile. F/As begging for layovers to be counted are introducing the idea that we are willing to accept this as practice. That could turn a reserves life into a three week trek with one suitcase, never seeing thier domicile, just three 24 hour stints in a hotel.

As for me personally, I certainly do more than waffle on on forums, I do try to change things through the avenues avialable to me. In reality it takes an interested, aware, and united work group acting in the interest of all F/As to improve our lot in life. Our overall acceptance and even encouragement of current conditions as a group is puzzling.

 

[Zarah]

Gotcha.

For some reason I wasn't grasping what stance you were taking. I blame my toddler who kept me up all night for my foggy brain.

 

[songbirdstew]

CLT Local is having a union meeting on the 30th of the month. The director of Crew Scheduling is suppose to be there to answer questions. Also there is to be a reserve section to this meeting where questions can be asked...

So, not just for Charlotte... but any Reserves and any base..... Got some questions you want answered??

Throw them out and I will pass along to the proper peeps.

(I'm sure it will only be a dog and pony in the end.... but you never know)

Only two quick calls per month per RSV unless they make themselves AVL for it....kind of like being ASG OPR 2x per month.

We have bottom RSVs who come in off a four day and because they are most JR on call, they can be sent out again the next day while those who haven't even flown sit around.....please pass that on.

 

[Zarah]

I guess the question I would want answered is.......

Why do I see a trip in open time at 7 p.m. with a departure time of 5:30 a.m. and Crew Scheduling does not cover it until 11 p.m.?