Dec 2012 / Jan 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[EastUS1]

You are casting a pretty wide net there.

Agreed Pi. My post was very poorly constructed, and not at all intended to universally target all who've evaluated the available information and document thoroughly, and then found it acceptable. I'll submit that my incomplete and inadequate post but further demonstrates that any supposed intent, versus contained and specific language, is indeed a potential issue within any document. 😉

 

[nevergiveup]

More money, better contract, no LOA93 - works for me. And didn't we want to TWA the west as well?

Didn't the west want to TWA the east? Kind of like incest...it's all relative!

 

[EastUS1]

What's their reason(s) for so suddenly, now wanting ANY agreement at all?

Management didn’t divide the pilot group; that was all a result of the east pilots refusing to accept the results of binding arbitration (a process that that is designed to be “binding” so as to eliminate disputes and compel all parties abide by the results without equivocation). The east pilots alone bastardized the very process that was intended to bring unity out of division and thus have left all pilots without a chance of getting a new contract or having any form of wage improvements over the past six years.

Management has always wanted a JCBA but the east-controlled USAPA would have no part in engaging in good-faith negotiations. Management went from saying “cost-neutral” in 2005 to offering the Kirby with $120M in annual improvements. What has USAPA done to show they are willing to come to a reasonable negotiated solution on a new CBA? Oh they did come to terms on a MOU which has only served to further divide the east pilots into an even more fractured group. So now we have west pilots as a one group; east pilots favoring a recall in another group, east pilots favoring no recalls in another group and then those who support the MOU and those who don’t despite a unanimous recommendation from the BPR and other top officials in USAPA to approve it.

East pilots and USAPA know nothing of unity and as long as there is no unity there will be no new contract. A merger and a dethroning of the east pilot majority is the only way wage improvements will come to this group. LOA93 must be a comfortable safety blanket for you all since you destroy any and all efforts to leave it behind for something that actually improves your own financial situations.

Is there supposedly even the slightest semblance of ANY answer to my simple and very direct question to be found ANYWHERE within that entire mountain range of childish and self righteous BS? If you believe so; perhaps you could at least supply some GPS coordinates with which to at least start a proper search for it. = What's their reason(s) for so suddenly, now wanting ANY agreement at all?

 

[dca319]

Man jj. Did you go through rehab or the anger management course they wanted for you?
Can t believe you didn't t call him hair pi like you used to.

So Courtney, you have nothing better to do now that your CLT reps are going to get recalled and this MOU is going to pass? One would think, reading you're ate, that you're the angry one. Is this how you're going to deal with the events that are not going to,go hit way?

 

[dca319]

Didn't the west want to TWA the east? Kind of like incest...it's all relative!

So there's really no need to complain about it then. Everyone would try to do what they could get away with.

 

[traderjake]

Do you REALLY think post-merger we will be all one happy pilot family?

No, but I think we'll be better off than if we don't merge.

 

[dca319]

What's their reason(s) for so suddenly, now wanting ANY agreement at all?



Is there supposedly even the slightest semblance of ANY answer to my simple and very direct question to be found ANYWHERE in that entire mountain range of childish and self righteous BS? = What's their reason(s) for so suddenly, now wanting ANY agreement at all?

And speaking of BS, I haven't found any semblance of an answer amid all your complaining regarding your plan to move forward if the company doesn't renegade us after we vote down the MoU.

 

[EastUS1]

And speaking of BS, I haven't found any semblance of an answer amid all your complaining regarding your plan to move forward if the company doesn't renegade us after we vote down the MoU.

There are no guarantees here or to found anywhere in life. What I do believe to be true is that the company would further negotiate were this offering to be rejected. Are either of those concepts so truly difficult to process?

 

[traderjake]

So Courtney, you have nothing better to do now that your CLT reps are going to get recalled and this MOU is going to pass?

I'd hold off on counting those Recall chickens just yet.

 

[Black Swan]

Management didn’t divide the pilot group; that was all a result of the east pilots refusing to accept the results of binding arbitration (a process that that is designed to be “binding” so as to eliminate disputes and compel all parties abide by the results without equivocation). The east pilots alone bastardized the very process that was intended to bring unity out of division and thus have left all pilots without a chance of getting a new contract or having any form of wage improvements over the past six years.

Management has always wanted a JCBA but the east-controlled USAPA would have no part in engaging in good-faith negotiations. Management went from saying “cost-neutral” in 2005 to offering the Kirby with $120M in annual improvements. What has USAPA done to show they are willing to come to a reasonable negotiated solution on a new CBA? Oh they did come to terms on a MOU which has only served to further divide the east pilots into an even more fractured group. So now we have west pilots as a one group; east pilots favoring a recall in another group, east pilots favoring no recalls in another group and then those who support the MOU and those who don’t despite a unanimous recommendation from the BPR and other top officials in USAPA to approve it.

East pilots and USAPA know nothing of unity and as long as there is no unity there will be no new contract. A merger and a dethroning of the east pilot majority is the only way wage improvements will come to this group. LOA93 must be a comfortable safety blanket for you all since you destroy any and all efforts to leave it behind for something that actually improves your own financial situations.

So the problem was East pilots REFUSING TO ACCEPT BINDING ARBITRATION......
Think about that statement. If it is binding, as you always state.......then why can East pilots refuse to accept it?Hope you didn't contribute to Marty, cause he don't get it either.
By the way, the MOU rates of pay are not correct. Here comes the first betrayal.

 

[dca319]

There are no guarantees, nor do I assume anything of the sort to be true. What I do believe to be true is that the company would further negotiate were this offering to be rejected. Are either of those concepts so truly difficult to process?

Yes because you offer no reason or examples of leverage. And you fail to acknowledge the fact that we, not the company, asked for an MoU.

 

[dca319]

I'd hold off on counting those Recall chickens just yet.

If this first attempt fails, there is enough cause to rerun the recall because of the PICs violation of comm policy.

 

[EastUS1]

Yes because you offer no reason or examples of leverage. And you fail to acknowledge the fact that we, not the company, asked for an MoU.

I do, very clearly understand that you obviously see "we" to be nothing more than underserving beggars, but feebly and pathetically scratching at the mighty company's door. We differ in our estimations of the current conditions.

 

[Phoenix]

What's their reason(s) for so suddenly, now wanting ANY agreement at all?



Is there supposedly even the slightest semblance of ANY answer to my simple and very direct question to be found ANYWHERE within that entire mountain range of childish and self righteous BS? If you believe so; perhaps you could at least supply some GPS coordinates with which to at least start a proper search for it. = What's their reason(s) for so suddenly, now wanting ANY agreement at all?

i thought you already reminded us...
Paying labor more "is just the right thing to do!"

 

[EastUS1]

i thought you already reminded us...
Paying labor more "is just the right thing to do!"

That was indeed spoken by the CEO in a recorded exchange with some pilots...how could it not be true? 😉