Delta & United Merger ?

[nostradamus]

FALSE ALARM

"A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on."
Winston Churchill

 

[hp_fa]

I don't see DL and UA getting approved by the SEC without significant and meaningful shedding of significant assets to the point that I think this is DOA. Remember, neither can claim they are in BK. They had their trips recently and have both completed the odessy.

 

[Jetsetter2Ord]

Anybody but UA and NW will spell real trouble for AFA senority.

We might all get stapled.

Hurry up with the contract so we can be where we want to be before we get fenced in and/or furloughed.

Interesting to hear of this recent merger speculation...I would feel sorry for those FAs over at DL, no contract, no union...I can hear the Big Stapler now..too bad that when AWA AFA66 proposed a fair merger integration policy that made sense for all those involved...too bad that AFA voted it down....it would be better for all those in AFA to have voted it in for situations that the future seems to be bringing us when it comes to mergers.

 

[night-ice]

Interesting to hear of this recent merger speculation...I would feel sorry for those FAs over at DL, no contract, no union...I can hear the Big Stapler now..too bad that when AWA AFA66 proposed a fair merger integration policy that made sense for all those involved...too bad that AFA voted it down....it would be better for all those in AFA to have voted it in for situations that the future seems to be bringing us when it comes to mergers.

Mention of NWA as a Possibility

 

[North by Northwest]

The PHL doomsdayer's don't' seem to understand the facts of the situation. One of the biggest gems in any route system now and especially after March, is Trans-Atlantic to Europe and Eastern Asia. PHL is at least 200nm closer to virtually all destinations in that region than is DTW. With fuel prices continuing to rise and plague the profitability of airlines, that distance can make a huge difference in annual route yields. NW has said many times they are at a disadvantage without an East Coast hub. You can have the greatest airport in the world (like PIT), but if it doesn't fit your ideal profile it's not very useful. DTW's principal advantage is as a Western Asia polar route and sub-polar route gateway - which it performs very well. Further, DTW is at an even more disadvantage when it comes to the Caribbean - winter routes which are needed to offset winter Europe and Asian shortfalls. CLT is at an even greater disadvantage for Trans-Atlantic, but obviously at an advantage for southern routes, which typically generate far less yields than TA even in high winter months. It really all depends on who is the acquiring entity of a US/NW merger and its management team. I would not be surprised at all if DTW was reduced to Asia only and PHL essentially retained as is (the principal European/Eastern Asia gateway)- without China. DTW could also relieve some of the current domestic East Coast traffic flow away from PHL. A problem with eliminating too much NE corridor connecting traffic, however, is that even with all the delay complaints, I can almost guarantee business flyers would have a hard time adapting to DTW and the lack of alternate transportation therefrom.

DTW is within 1- 1 1/2 hour flight time from the largest pop. centers in North America (most centrally located of any large metro in relation to the largest pop. segment in N. America). Moreover, DTW lies on the great circle route (which NW pioneered) therefore allowing it to eclispe all other cities with the shortest distance to Asia from the USA.

High yield traffic does not lie in vacation destinations. The future of high yield revenue lies in Asia, large cities in US...Europe is over saturated with highly established, ferociously competitive native carriers. NW alliances allows it to max. revenue through it's partners thereby blanketing Europe with out the high overhead of doing it independently. NW/KLM joint revenue is approaching 1.5 Billion.(maybe larger)

DTW:

6 runways 150 Gates.

35,985,867 pax.

Passenger Rank (ACI) - 2006 ..10th in North America , 19th in the World

Ranked number 2 in pax satis. JD Power 2006 (USA)

 

[dariencc]

He couldn't help but to take a parting shot at the big D, however,

The "big D?" Who talks like that? No one at Delta that I know. You are one embarrassing little fellow. Back to the ALPA board for you!

In a dig at Delta's resistance to the US Airways takeover bid, Parker said everybody would be better off had the effort succeeded. "We offered $11 billion for a company now worth $7.5 billion. People are upset about it," he said. Also, the merger has reduced industry capacity by 4%.

The hedge fund wants a payout. Since the bogus rumor was shot down today by Anderson, the 7.5 billion valuation for the "big D" :blink: will soon be heading lower. Next step for Pardus will be from the FL Group template at American. A press for asset spin-offs to enhance shareholder returns.

We'll soon find out how much Pardus cares about what Lee Moak thinks.

 

[dariencc]

DTW is within 1- 1 1/2 hour flight time from the largest pop. centers in North America (most centrally located of any large metro in relation to the largest pop. segment in N. America).

The flaw in your theory is that much of that population would need to be backhauled to connect to Europe through DTW.

Moreover, DTW lies on the great circle route (which NW pioneered) therefore allowing it to eclispe all other cities with the shortest distance to Asia from the USA.

This statement is absurd and shows that you really don't understand the concept of a great circle route. Show your post to your pioneer pilots and watch them laugh.

6 runways 150 Gates.

Passenger Rank (ACI) - 2006 ..10th in North America , 19th in the World

DTW is a good airport and NW's terminal is outstanding, no doubt. Unfortunately, Detroit has just about the worst economy of any metro area in the country. The long term trends don't look positive, either, unless you expect the automakers to become world beaters again. Let's face it, the city is an unlivable dump and it's not going to get better.

 

[freedom]

While we might be the smallest legacy carrier , we ARE the strongest , why ? Because deep down, our workers CARE and are actually INTERESTED in this company . Coming from America West Airlines I’m used to the underdog status , for me this is simply status quo . My advice to everyone outside of us airways , don’t start digging us a grave just yet …


Believe in US

 

[sharktooth]

While we might be the smallest legacy carrier , we ARE the strongest , why ? Because deep down, our workers CARE and are actually INTERESTED in this company . Coming from America West Airlines I’m used to the underdog status , for me this is simply status quo . My advice to everyone outside of us airways , don’t start digging us a grave just yet …

We aren't digging. We are trying to fill in the hole PHX keeps digging. Tell those sandbox clowns to quit digging.

 

[North by Northwest]

No..the FLAW in your theory is that people from the mid west/Canada would want to use PHL. vs. DTW to get to Europe. Besides, we have whats called Gateways from NY/EWR, BOS, D.C which serve our non stops to Europe.

And acutually NO, most of the that pop. is not just centered on the East coast., ever heard of the Mid West/Canada? So NO they don't have to backtrack.

My bad on the shortest path...I should have said shortest in the Mid West and East. as it is. ( The flight paths over the northern lands of the Pacific are among the busiest in the world, not only during the holiday season, but all year. Each day more than 200 flights transporting about 20,000 people pass overhead en route between the Americas and Far Eastern regions of Russia, China, South Korea, Japan, Indonesia, and Australia. Ninety-three percent of all cargo flights between Asia and the U.S., plus one from the North Pole, fly over these lands along the "great circle route" or the shortest distance between Asia and the U.S.). http://www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1014

unless you know something that the rest of the world doesn't.

Hey, the city of Detroit might be a dump...but it still boasts some of the wealthiest counties in the entire country. It serves NW just fine.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Actually, DTW is better positioned geographically than PHL for Asian service, with the exception being to/from the large cities near PHL. For example, DTW is on/near the great circle from the entire SE of the U.S. to PEK while PHL is not. Even in the NE, by the time you get to BOS there's little difference in distance between going thru PHL or DTW to get to PEK. Plus, PHL - Asia is further than DTW - Asia (about 200nm further to PEK, for example).

For the other half of the country - the western half - DTW would be less out-of-the-way than PHL since it's further west. But while DTW is better, neither PHL nor DTW is really competitive with west coast connections once you get out west.

And NxNW, the reason that the northern Pacific islands have so many overflights is because most of the U.S.-Asia flights are to/from the western U.S. - that puts the great circle route over the northern pacific. From the central/east U.S. the great circle route moves close to/over the pole.

Jim

 

[Doc]

BURN YOUR MILES!!!!!!!

WISH YOU WOULD

 

[delta777]

The "big D?" Who talks like that? No one at Delta that I know. You are one embarrassing little fellow. Back to the ALPA board for you!



The hedge fund wants a payout. Since the bogus rumor was shot down today by Anderson, the 7.5 billion valuation for the "big D" :blink: will soon be heading lower. Next step for Pardus will be from the FL Group template at American. A press for asset spin-offs to enhance shareholder returns.

We'll soon find out how much Pardus cares about what Lee Moak thinks.

Are you serious dariencc??? This coming from someone who took the words of ralphcramden as gospel as it were related to the failed LCC takeover attempt of Delta last year. You have a hard on for Delta. Boo-hoo.

 

[dariencc]

No..the FLAW in your theory is that people from the mid west/Canada would want to use PHL. vs. DTW to get to Europe. Besides, we have whats called Gateways from NY/EWR, BOS, D.C which serve our non stops to Europe.

I never actually stated any theory at all about PHL, merely pointed out the FACT that much of the population in the eastern half of the US would have to backhaul to connect to Europe through Detroit. That simple fact is not changed by your irrelevant "Gateway" reference. By the way, the codeshare alliances you referenced are the norm at every legacy carrier, and have been for some time. Are you an employee or a student?

My bad on the shortest path...I should have said shortest in the Mid West and East. as it is.

Your bad again. Your own headquarters city of MSP is closer to Asia than DTW. Keep trying.

Ninety-three percent of all cargo flights between Asia and the U.S., plus one from the North Pole, fly over these lands along the
"great circle route" or the shortest distance between Asia and the U.S.). http://www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1014

unless you know something that the rest of the world doesn't.

You idiotically stated that "Moreover, DTW lies on the great circle route (which NW pioneered) therefore allowing it to eclispe all other cities with the shortest distance to Asia from the USA," and now you're trying to give me a tutorial on the concept? Let's start with the basics. When you fly the shortest distance between any two points on the globe, you fly a great circle, get it? Their is nothing unique about Detroit or any other city in that respect. To say that "DTW lies on the Great Circle... " gives away your complete ignorance. By the way, aircraft do not even fly true great circles on long haul routes, but modified ones.

To review our lesson plan, DTW is farther from Asia than places like SEA and SFO, as well as MSP. End of story. I did not bring PHL into the US-Asia discussion, seems like your trying to change the subject.

Hey, the city of Detroit might be a dump...but it still boasts some of the wealthiest counties in the entire country. It serves NW just fine.

Perhaps I should have been a bit more clear, especially since the LCC posters on this forum are generally pretty forthright about our workforce problems in Philly. Well, according to my friends at NW, the same problems exist at your DTW operation. They hate going through there and say the work ethic of the employees is pathetic. Operationally, they consider the place to be a giant pain in the***. Detroit sucks and is getting worse. I'll guess you didn't read that in the company news rag.

Feel free to resume bragging.

 

[EMBFA]

If this is true, and it's allowed, US is screwed. Northwest and Continental will pair up, American might skim a bit off of each. Check mate, game over. No place for indentity-confused, barbell map, no international worth mentioning, craptastic America West as US Airways.

I wouldn't want to merge with us either.