AA "Chooses" to us the FMLA act as it's source for it's attendance policy, but it then allows for " FULL " benefits for domestic partners. This is a double standard.
What Unity?
Flight Attendant Sick Calls
- Thread starter AAStew
- Start date
What Unity?
Garfield1966
Veteran
Not sure I followed the statement but had it been a union environment I would have thought the company would not have been able to show "good will" because it would have been considered favoritism. The same policy must be applied to those who abuse as well as those who do not abuse. Correct? In my office some get treated better than others. Sometimes it works in my favor sometimes it does not. If the same policies had to applied to all with out deviation I would come out on the loosing end more often than not.
Garfield1966
Veteran
Do you honestly think AA would expose it's self to a discrimination law suit by openly denying a person FMLA because of domestic partner with out having the full backing of the law? I realize you think AA is run by a bunch of dolts (and there is a very strong argument for that) but to think the legal department would not be all over that like white on rice is absurd.
I live by the credo that "just because I am paranoid does not mean that the world is not out to get me" but it sounds to me you are way out in left field on this one and SOL till this country slaps the christian right into a corner and grants equal rights to gays. I would venture to say it will happen with in the next 10-20 years. It took women well over 100 years to achieve the status that you are seeking and unfortunately there are still a few areas where that equality is lacking.
In the mean time, stop blaming the waiter for the quality of the food.
You too are another one of those who love to discriminate...i sure hope your loved one isnt lying on their deathbed ,and u get terminated from your job while trying to care for them...Again you show your true colors!
Telling you that the law is not on your side and that your suit will go nowhere, because it has no legal basis, does not mean that we love to discriminate.
Garfield1966
Veteran
Apparently you are to busy lugging around that chip on your shoulder to figure out I was supporting your position in terms of morality but that the law has not caught up with you yet. By all means continue to think everyone is against you. I honestly could not care less.
I happen to have more gay friends than straight and the ones who I showed your post to were laughing their ass off at you. You cannot see the forest for the trees.
Garfield is correct. He is not trying to discriminate, he is just stating fact, as far as the law is concerned. Until there is a domestic partner law, where that partner is granted all the same rights as well as the same liabilities as married couples, you can forget about seeing any changes. Perhaps you should direct your energies towards changing this. Even though I am one of the dreaded "Christian Right" that Garfield warns against, I am all for domestic partner laws where they are fully recognized as equal to a marriage partner, who cares what word we use to describe the union?
If anybody is curious as I started this thread, I was placed on 2nd written warning. This means I can only be absent two more times within the next 2 years before I get a pre-termination letter. I really don't care as I know the company does not have a leg to stand on, plus I did not want to take unpaid time off to have a union rep sit in on this. My new supervisor is okay though, he saw how preposterous it was and changed the date to 12/08 untill I return to self-management. I realize he has to cover his butt and justify his job. This company is a joke with the pressures they put on the supervisory level. Case in point, I had a flight where the front entry exit carpets were soaked in MSY. This is an FAR prohibition. Simply means change the carpet, it's dangerous in an evacuation, or don't take the plane out. We were in a down base so I agreed to wait until LGA to change it. When we got to LGA I was advised I could ground the airplane myself and cancel the flight as they did not have a replacement. I argued with the maintenance supervisor for about 10 minutes and told him to ground the airplane....them I saw his face. I completely understood. This guys job was on the line, he is not given sufficient equipment or manpower or supplies, but he is expected to get the plane out at the risk of his livlihood. I just looked at him and said, "I see your face, I understand, but I don't agree." It is sad that AA places their employees and their passengers in such situations. Alot of people are comparing AA to Eastern....sounds like they know what they are talking about.
If anybody is curious as I started this thread, I was placed on 2nd written warning. This means I can only be absent two more times within the next 2 years before I get a pre-termination letter. I really don't care as I know the company does not have a leg to stand on, plus I did not want to take unpaid time off to have a union rep sit in on this. My new supervisor is okay though, he saw how preposterous it was and changed the date to 12/08 untill I return to self-management. I realize he has to cover his butt and justify his job. This company is a joke with the pressures they put on the supervisory level. Case in point, I had a flight where the front entry exit carpets were soaked in MSY. This is an FAR prohibition. Simply means change the carpet, it's dangerous in an evacuation, or don't take the plane out. We were in a down base so I agreed to wait until LGA to change it. When we got to LGA I was advised I could ground the airplane myself and cancel the flight as they did not have a replacement. I argued with the maintenance supervisor for about 10 minutes and told him to ground the airplane....them I saw his face. I completely understood. This guys job was on the line, he is not given sufficient equipment or manpower or supplies, but he is expected to get the plane out at the risk of his livlihood. I just looked at him and said, "I see your face, I understand, but I don't agree." It is sad that AA places their employees and their passengers in such situations. Alot of people are comparing AA to Eastern....sounds like they know what they are talking about.
AA is one of the few "generous" that even offer domestic partner benefits. This is one area that my beloved TWA would not tread. I was surprised to see that the "good old boys" airline was so forward thinking. However, when my son had his accident, (he was 21 and on my insurance with COBRA), I tried to have him returned as a dependent because of a "life changing" even, (paralyzed) and the Company said no. I even argued that 1, we had a relationship over 6 months 2. we were in a committed relationship (is there any more than mother-son?). The only area we didn't meet was the "sex" and how can the Company prove anyone meets that standard..lol It was a good try but no cigar. Lucky for him that his mother was well versed in Workers Comp and I was able to secure those benefits.
There is a difference between company offered and federally mandated. As much as I believe you should have full rights, you will have no leg to stand on with this issue.
I am really sorry to hear about your son's accident. It's a good thing that you were able to help him through your tenacity and familiarity with Workman's Comp.
I would like to comment on one item in your post. Before we had domestic partner benefits at AA, my partner (we have been together for over 18 years now) was a "non-entity" as far as the company was concerned. In other words, our relationship was not recognized on any level. He could not even pass ride because D3s were strictly allotted to siblings, their spouses, and their children. Fed up with the blatant discrimination, I spearheaded a petition drive requesting domestic partner benefits (DPB). With the help of my friends, this petition was circulated in Honolulu, San Juan, Seattle....everywhere we had crew bases at the time. Over 6,000 signatures were collected from flight attendants, cabin service personnel, agents, mechanics, a couple pilots, and even some flight service managers. After I submitted the petition to Human Resources at AMR, the request was denied. AA had no interest in extending such benefits to its employees.
Shortly thereafter, the great city of San Francisco passed a law that required all businesses employing over a certain number of people and who do business directly with the city to offer DPB. This little law was to have astounding ramifications throughout the airline industry in the United States. When United Airlines sought to renew its lease on the hangars at the SFO airport, the city agreed to do so only after the airline complied with the new law. UAL balked at the demands and filed a lawsuit...along with American Arlines and the ATA. Once AA understood it was engaged in a losing battle and that the publicity was causing more harm than good (despite ongoing threats of boycotts from the Christian right if the company offered DPB), the company caved in and decided to offer DPB. There was absolutely nothing altruistic about it.
I just wanted to clear up any confusion regarding this matter. Furthermore, we still have a looong way to go before we attain equality. On the federal level, we are still taxed on our partners' insurance, pass riding, etc. We have no legal recourse for immigration or social security benefits, etc. For example, my aunt lost her partner of 40 years to a stroke and she receives nothing from her partner's social security or pension. Whether one agrees with same-sex unions or not, this country is ultimately going to recognize them. If Spain, France and Canada can do it, so can we. We simply have to shed a bit of our puritanical mindset if we truly wish to accord equality to all of our citizens.
Peace.
Art in Miami
Thank you for the AA history lesson. I always wondered how you all managed to get benefits. TWA would never budge. I think we were making progress when the acquisition transpired. Considering that I live in the State of Missouri where the thought of domestic partners can get you hanged, we're lucky to see any Company offer benefits.
Keep up the activism. Change takes time but is oh so sweet when finally accomplished.
Garfield1966
Veteran
Not to turn this into a political thread (OK too late) but these decisions are made in the federal court with lawsuites brought from lower levels (usually) so if you want to see advancements in civil and personal rights, get your butt to the voting booth and maybe we can prevent the courts from swinging even more to the right than they already have.
Now Garfield, finally something we agree upon!!!
Nor'Easta
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Do you have 504 paid productive hours? You have to reach this threshold before they will approve the FMLA. Deadheading does not count towards the 504 and you have to add up what you actually flew not what you got paid.
Garfield1966
Veteran
[quote name='Nor'Easta' post='574591' date='Feb 20 2008, 11:40 PM']Do you have 504 paid productive hours? You have to reach this threshold before they will approve the FMLA. Deadheading does not count towards the 504 and you have to add up what you actually flew not what you got paid.[/quote]
I do not believe his hours were ever in question. What he was applying for apparently does not qualify for FMLA so his hours are a moot issue.
I do not believe his hours were ever in question. What he was applying for apparently does not qualify for FMLA so his hours are a moot issue.
Nor'Easta
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Did you ask if they were? Some people don't know they need 504 paid productive hours to qualify. If I was turned down for it, that would be the first thing I would check. This is the biggest reason f/a's get turned down for FMLA.
