I guess the days of working the line them moving to management are over within US Airways all of the new mangement are outsiders the latest supervisor being a former assistant manger at Starbucks. What happened to the ones like Peter P in PHL who knew what it was to be a flight attendant and work the line. Also all of the part time instructors are back on the line no more real world experience.
Inflight Services
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SparrowHawk
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Disclaimer: I don't agree with one word of what I'm about to write. Instead my intent is offer some insight into modern MBA thinking and corporate culture in general.
Current management thinking is that supervision of people is yet another metric to be measured. Therefore logic would dictate that if you've supervised 30 to 40 people at a fast food establishment then handling an equal number of rampers, agents, flight attendents would not be dissimilar.
Same with Training. The theory goes that a good trainer does not have to me a "SME" (Subject Matter Expert) in order to deliver effective training. Instead they merely have to be competent trainers willing to learn the material to be taught as thoroughly as possible in order to gain credibility and manage the class.
beachboy
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When you go from paying less to your supervisors than the people they are supervising, in our case 10-20k less- all the good people leave. PP is the best and no fool, plus a great flight attendant. They are not about to pay anyone good money to use common sense. When AW came in is when you saw in-flight just sink into stupidity.
Whatnow?
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Whatnow?
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And don't forget lack of experience and knowledge in Inflight!! Spot on Beachboy!!!!!!!!!
LOL...technical errors........but it was soo bad I had to say it twice!
AlleghenyVista
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Glucose Intolerant
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Put the F/As back 40 years. And the Flight Attendant's help them do it.
Tempe's vision of the F/As:
A nuisance labor cost mandated by the EVIL and OPPRESSIVE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. Should be compensated at minimum wage and with no benefits besides they get to travel for free 23-26 days a month.
"We can outsource the (baggage) to the F/A group because SKYLAR the intern's spreadsheet presentation clearly shows F/As "are now more cost effective" than having Ramp Agents and a Belt Loader load baggage. We decimated their wages in BK, now we have them cleaning the planes, and it looks like we have just about achieved having them load the bags (charging for it). NOW if we can only get them to CATER the planes....oh yeah we did that at AWA .....Excellent."
"Come up with a heritage pin for "CROSS UTILIZATION"
"Who care if it kills the F/As and the Agents, we won't have to have as many RAMP AGENTS or equipment? Besides with all the incurred delays we can just PAD the flight times and achieve better on-time performance. Even though we still keep posting yearly losses (that we can blame on everyone and everything but ourselves) we can STILL give ourselves BONUSES for OTP PERFORMANCE."
Sounds more like a master plan of a criminal than a business plan......oh that's right we don't have people interested in running a good operation or an airline :down:
We now have "Banksters" 😛h34r:
The same ones that didn't staff or plan for a WINTER STORM(S) in DECEMBER.....ON THE EAST COAST..... we don't have them in PHX, who would have known that? :blink:
That's OK we can blame it on the crews calling in sick and a pilot feud.
As far as Adler goes - judge him on what he has done - not what he says he "will do".
Same litmus test for politicians - should be the same for management.
One year and counting - what has he (or they) done?
Hired more management - That's exactly what the F/A group needed. Spot On!
Eliminated Observation Rides - Instituted Punitive Check Rides
Procured monogrammed trash bags from Costco (that still suck) Truly Brilliant.
One word: BISCOTTI
Has the F/As now wrestling bags during boarding and cleaning on deplaning - at the lowest rate in the industry.
Let his underlings completely screw up the vacation matrix so half the airline was on VAC after the XMAS operational meltdown (EAST AND WEST).
Yeah - seems about par from the Gang out West.
Time to look up from your Sudoku puzzle people before you become the brunt of the joke..... "Did you hear the one about the F/A?" :blink:
PP were in training together, we are friends, and I have known him for over 20 years (and three bases).
This company doesn't deserve people the caliber of Peter - which is pretty evident now in management.
beachboy
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Like her or not if C. Lindvey were brough back into PHL Inflight she would have half those supervisors in a choke hold with her designer Prada scarf. I remember walking through PIT and always checking my uniform in the restroom- you did not walk by those offices looking like you just got shot out of a cannon into the terminal.
SS255
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I don't think that you need to have worked the front lines in order to be an Inflight Manager. You just need to take the time to understand all facets of the job in order to make good business decisions. You need to engage those who are actually doing the job, and listen to them. Take off your "management" hat, get your hands dirty, and then prioritize your battles with your senior management. And you had better have good communication skills, too, because that will really set you apart.
I'll bet if you polled the FA's at US, you would find that the vast majority of them have no interest or desire in joining the management ranks. They love being on the front lines, and once you go into management you become "one of them."
But.......wouldn't it be great to have a manager who actually "gets it," no matter what their prior experience?Being a good manager requires a certain personality type, and the sad fact is that most managers are not good managers.......and tend to also hire bad managers to work under them. What you end up with is layers and layers of bad management........and a beaten down work force which does not trust their management.
SparrowHawk
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ss255,
You realize that if you worked for US and did anything remotely ressembling what you describe in Paragraph one you'd be fired?
The reason for your dismissal is covered in Paragraph three
You realize that if you worked for US and did anything remotely ressembling what you describe in Paragraph one you'd be fired?
The reason for your dismissal is covered in Paragraph three
FlightChic
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I can't speak for the other bases but in CLT the three new supervisors were flight attendants for US. As for the instructors, the eight full time ones they just hired were flight attendants and part time instructors. So I'm sure they "get it". Let's just hope they keep it real and don't forget where they came from. I agree that they should hire US flight attendants if possible because otherwise a supervisor or manager who hasn't walked in our shoes, especially with this LTO crap and more work for less pay BS, will never get what we go through and deal with on a daily basis.
The problem with finding flight attendants who want to cross over to the "dark side" aka mgmt is that they will have to take a pay cut in order to do so. Imagine making more money while flying, even with our BS concessionary contract, than if you were working as mgmt. That is wrong! As far as PHL which is a big commuter base, I can't imagine that many flight attendants who would even want to be a supervisor there. You know? I guess you get what you pay for!
SS255
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The problem with finding flight attendants who want to cross over to the "dark side" aka mgmt is that they will have to take a pay cut in order to do so. Imagine making more money while flying, even with our BS concessionary contract, than if you were working as mgmt. That is wrong! As far as PHL which is a big commuter base, I can't imagine that many flight attendants who would even want to be a supervisor there. You know? I guess you get what you pay for!
That happened to me, in a sense: When I started in my management role, the unionized employees under me made more than twice my salary, because they must get paid union scale. That was 13 1/2 years ago, and some of them who make above scale still make more than I do. Had my company hired a union employee to do my job, they would have had to shell out alot more $$$, because who would take a 50% pay cut to deal with the kinds of headaches I have to deal with? Plus, they get a pension, and going into management would entail losing the pension contributions. The only reason why I took the job is because for me it was a step up from being a glorified secretary, and would position me to advance. And it was highly unusual for someone to be plucked from the secretarial ranks to run a department.
Note to management: If you want to attract the right people, you have got to pay them more than the people who report to them, and make it worth their while. It's not a very difficult concept to grasp.
