JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[WeAAsles]

Because the accrual could start at the point of signature, not January 1st, as proposed.

Ok so let's ask you the same question I've asked Tim then.

How do you know that they haven't already signed?

And let's just interject a little bit of common sense into this conversation. Let's say that they haven't signed and you're correct that the accumulations don't start until the day a signature is put in ink on a piece of paper?

Our negotiations stall all the way till the end of the year. So they don't get the PS put into contractual language and they finally sign the agreement at the end of the 4th quarter of this year. Everyone else signed on day one it was offered like the APFA needed to put out publicly and they all get those accumulations.

Well March 1 comes and all of us Association members are informed by the company that "Sorry no check for you this year, blame your Unions" Ok yea many people (20,000) are going to be very very pissed off at the Association but who do you REALLY think they're going to wind up taking their anger out on? Where do they have daily access? 

You don't think there's going to wind up being a ton of broken coffee pot's, water valves, indicator lights, missed bags, aircraft delays, out of service equipment?

Again can we put just a little bit of common sense into this conversation please?

 

[WeAAsles]

Because the accrual could start at the point of signature, not January 1st, as proposed.

One more question you may know the answer to? The CWA/IBT voted in an agreement with the agents on November 30. The US side had PS in their agreement up to that date. Did the company deduct that last month of 2015 from their PS payout?

If they did I haven't heard anything about it? And one would think their FB pages would have lit up like a Christmas tree if that had happened? Again not saying that it didn't but I never heard anything about it?

Would anyone like to try and verify?

 

[psa8979]

The 2 "Black Swans" bantering on AF. FYI . NO ! profit sharing scheme for AAL F/S Association . Events will drive these JCBA . Let the 20% do their work based on facts , numbers, and knowledge for ALL .  Real change could happen after Nov. ???  VOTE !

 

[WeAAsles]

The 2 "Black Swans" bantering on AF. FYI . NO ! profit sharing scheme for AAL F/S Association . Events will drive these JCBA . Let the 20% do their work based on facts , numbers, and knowledge for ALL .  Real change could happen after Nov. ???  VOTE !

National politics conversations are up in the Water Cooler. But yes I will be voting in November.

 

[WeAAsles]

When asked what surprised him about humanity the most, the Dalai Lama replied:
 
“Man. Because he sacrifices his health in order to make money. Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health. And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived.”




“The mind is like a parachute. It works best when it’s open.”

 

[AANOTOK]

Can't wait to here from the Arbitrator. In most cases, it takes a few months if not years to decide on a case or render a decision. Curious to see how long this will take. Is this just a side job for him and does he have other cases sitting in front of him. I believe there are other items the Association cannot say they completely agree upon. Will they get those arbitrated as well...Again, it was stated when the Association was formed that it was a bad idea, nothing has happened to change my mind. As a matter of fact, considering they are now speaking of arbitration between the two unions, makes it worse than even I thought it would be. Stay tuned!!
 
Wonder how Gary Peterson will feel if he and his members are screwed out of their seniority??
Love to here Bob Owens take on it as well.

 

[WeAAsles]

Can't wait to here from the Arbitrator. In most cases, it takes a few months if not years to decide on a case or render a decision. Curious to see how long this will take. Is this just a side job for him and does he have other cases sitting in front of him. I believe there are other items the Association cannot say they completely agree upon. Will they get those arbitrated as well...Again, it was stated when the Association was formed that it was a bad idea, nothing has happened to change my mind. As a matter of fact, considering they are now speaking of arbitration between the two unions, makes it worse than even I thought it would be. Stay tuned!!
 
Wonder how Gary Peterson will feel if he and his members are screwed out of their seniority??
Love to here Bob Owens take on it as well.

Again probably the best time and expected to get a mediator/arbitrator involved. I haven't heard of any fist fights developing between the two sides on any issues about the seniority integration. Again probably strong opinions and debates more so because we're each used to our way of doing things and people don't like change.

Yea sure if there had never been an Association in the first place and we had had one Union or the other maybe there would have been no concern about how the minority would have felt and they would have been steamrolled. But then you and I both know the lawsuits would have started flying and maybe even a few field fights. That's the thing the Association is/was supposed to try and prevent as much as possible.

But on these boards we're assuming that there's been more negative than positive? That the two sides are in a constant state of War. I'm always "hoping" that there are more reasonable minds then rigid ones?

I said this awhile back. I hope when we get a JCBA that I don't see more favoritism for one sides language over another? If I do then yes I'm going to say that the Association really is a failure. And I may even vote no (Money aside) just to send their arses back to the table until they can learn to play nice together just like you do when children can't figure it out.

OT as an example. I see items in both contracts I like. I don't like one sides language over the other. I want to see a blend of the two and I want both sides to support that against the company.

 

[NYer]

Ok so let's ask you the same question I've asked Tim then.How do you know that they haven't already signed?
And let's just interject a little bit of common sense into this conversation. Let's say that they haven't signed and you're correct that the accumulations don't start until the day a signature is put in ink on a piece of paper?
Our negotiations stall all the way till the end of the year. So they don't get the PS put into contractual language and they finally sign the agreement at the end of the 4th quarter of this year. Everyone else signed on day one it was offered like the APFA needed to put out publicly and they all get those accumulations.
Well March 1 comes and all of us Association members are informed by the company that "Sorry no check for you this year, blame your Unions" Ok yea many people (20,000) are going to be very very pissed off at the Association but who do you REALLY think they're going to wind up taking their anger out on? Where do they have daily access? 
You don't think there's going to wind up being a ton of broken coffee pot's, water valves, indicator lights, missed bags, aircraft delays, out of service equipment?
Again can we put just a little bit of common sense into this conversation please?

Holy cow. Answer a question and the situation goes into Def Con territory.

Have they signed off? Possibly, by verbally accepting the terms but like the other TA's, it hasn't been made public. By holding off an agreement, the consequences could mean a diminished return.

 

[WeAAsles]

Holy cow. Answer a question and the situation goes into Def Con territory.
Have they signed off? Possibly, by verbally accepting the terms but like the other TA's, it hasn't been made public. By holding off an agreement, the consequences could mean a diminished return.

Ok. But you see unlike little Timmie you can make a comment that maybe it has been agreed on already weeks ago.

Could? Sure. Personally doubt it though. Not worth the heartache for the company IMO.

 

[Kev3188]

The mind is like a parachute. It works best when its open.

Sage advice from our man in Dharamsala.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Yea right. What a load of malarkey again.

3/26/16
"PROFIT SHARING: During this past week in negotiations the company came to us and explained that they wanted to offer our group profit sharing for the 2016 year. While we don't have all the specifics at this time, I can tell you that they made it clear that they didn't expect anything from this offer, and that this wouldn't affect our negotiations as far as what we will be asking and expecting. This seems to be just a " good gesture " on the companies behalf and seems like a very good thing for our work group. The unions must sign off on this, and while it is not my call, I would assume we will as long as it ends up being what it appears to be. If anything changes on this, I will let you know."

[union negotiator, name withheld]

Since then, there is no indication to suggest otherwise.

 

[Kev3188]

The 2 "Black Swans" bantering on AF. FYI . NO ! profit sharing scheme for AAL F/S Association . Events will drive these JCBA . Let the 20% do their work based on facts , numbers, and knowledge for ALL .  Real change could happen after Nov. ???  VOTE !

Global events will definitely affect talks. Window may be closing? Knowledge always key. Informed workforce is an engaged workforce. Love the City by the Bay. Miss the Best Coast.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Can't wait to here from the Arbitrator. In most cases, it takes a few months if not years to decide on a case or render a decision. Curious to see how long this will take. Is this just a side job for him and does he have other cases sitting in front of him. I believe there are other items the Association cannot say they completely agree upon. Will they get those arbitrated as well...Again, it was stated when the Association was formed that it was a bad idea, nothing has happened to change my mind. As a matter of fact, considering they are now speaking of arbitration between the two unions, makes it worse than even I thought it would be. Stay tuned!!
 
Wonder how Gary Peterson will feel if he and his members are screwed out of their seniority??
Love to here Bob Owens take on it as well.

First off, the guy is an anti union Republican. I think he was appointed by George Bush to be chairman of the NMB. He isn't rendering a decision, he is offering a recommendation. He is a hired gun. He is NOT neutral and will do what the TWU/IAM pay him to do.

Remember, this is his paid services. This guy is a Republican at that. So, not sure why weasel likes him. His decisions, as the NMB chairman, hammered our group back in 1989 and ordered an election that through the Teamsters off the property.

Why the hell would the TWU/IAM align our seniority with a Republican???

He got paid $60,000 by the IAM to screw the folks at sUA who got their lead status hammered.

Anytime someone outside the group renders recommendations, especially arbitrators, they screw everything up.

Given the association letter, there is a lot undefined. It can not be fair to have DOH class when one group has been adjusted while the other group has not.

 

[700UW]

Wouldnt any President of any TWU/AA local know the status of the profit sharing between the Association and the company?

 

[Kev3188]

You would think so?