JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[WeAAsles]

What started here in DFW, is when it's a shift change, and a plane is at the gate, the MOD uses the camera to see if the afternoon crew is ALL outside to be ready for the turn-over. If a delay happens, crew chief gets a CR-1. This happened 2 weeks ago to our chief. This practice is coming to all stations eventually.

Well when I was there many times we would come to work have 5 minutes to get to our work area and have to walk out and take the handoff from the morning crew who was then getting off in 5 minutes.

Just another of the many things I hated about working in DFW. Some days even going to take a lousy pee became a PITA.

6.5 even once 7 flights done in a shift. Oh yea working there was a really blast. NOT!!!!!!

 

[CremaDiLimone]

I wouldn't concern myself with people who are no longer on that list. If they're not with us anymore they obviously won't be bidding will they.

this is very true. a fsc with 42-43 years seniority punched in for work and later punched out of life at his encoding station last month. his name is still on javits' 'fair and equitable' list. rip.

 

[WeAAsles]

this is very true. a fsc with 42-43 years seniority punched in for work and later punched out of life at his encoding station last month. his name is still on javits' 'fair and equitable' list. rip.

That really stinks man. Not somewhere I'd like to be found dead even if dead is dead.

Even if before I retire I have the seniority to bid an encoder station I'd prefer to avoid it like the plague if I physically can.

Always got to keep yourself moving and lifting to keep that blood flowing.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

Then exactly what is the purpose of the IAM, TWU, or the powerful Association??

well, i can tell you that looking out for the seniority/well-being of 30 year dues payers is not high on the twu's list of purposes.

now it remains to be seen if those with laa 'company seniority' will still bid vc or have profit sharing positively affected (if time is in the formula) by that company seniority.

 

[robbedagain]

thanks WeAA Bob I'm currently in BWI yes we are surely understaffed I cannot even tell you how bad it is couple in the fact our belt loaders well lets just say we need few more using one on 1 plane... today for example just 3 agents plus lead for 2 different AB aircraft one a 321 n the other 319 only reason the on time... pilot released brakes despite loading cart of bags Bob we are clearly not overstaffed we handle both mainline and express and I cannot even tell u that its bad on a good day when we have 3 or 4 coming at 1 time 2 express and 2 mainline and often 1 of those if express and a mainline are utilized by the same ground crew some of us myself included only do 1 flight at a time and however long it takes just as long as it gets done is how long itll be yesterday not much snow on the ground at bwi but having multiple planes with same crew me and my crew having 3 planes at same time.. id be willing to bet the pax were not happy waiting over 50 min for their bags from the DFW and PHX trips.... so tell me again HOW THE HELL ARE WE OVERSTAFFED bob its easy for you to say since ur in a hub and don't handle express planes we have on average 28 flights when combining mainline and express a day sometimes the flex flights to CLT and PHX makes it 30 so again bob tell me how are we overstaffed.....

 

[WeAAsles]

well, i can tell you that looking out for the seniority/well-being of 30 year dues payers is not high on the twu's list of purposes.

now it remains to be seen if those with laa 'company seniority' will still bid vc or have profit sharing positively affected (if time is in the formula) by that company seniority.

Why do you say that? What do you feel they've done or is doing to them?

 

[CremaDiLimone]

That really stinks man. Not somewhere I'd like to be found dead even if dead is dead.

Even if before I retire I have the seniority to bid an encoder station I'd prefer to avoid it like the plague if I physically can.

Always got to keep yourself moving and lifting to keep that blood flowing.

yes, i agree about staying active. i'm not so sure about handling intl. bags, loading or dumping. every fsc is a wedged bag + extra effort from blowing out their shoulder.

the poor guy must have been gone before he hit the floor. 2 other encoders close to him, but no visual contact from other belts and infrastructure. they didn't know anything. discovered after his belt jammed and facility maintenance looked at a camera.

 

[WeAAsles]

thanks WeAA Bob I'm currently in BWI yes we are surely understaffed I cannot even tell you how bad it is couple in the fact our belt loaders well lets just say we need few more using one on 1 plane... today for example just 3 agents plus lead for 2 different AB aircraft one a 321 n the other 319 only reason the on time... pilot released brakes despite loading cart of bags Bob we are clearly not overstaffed we handle both mainline and express and I cannot even tell u that its bad on a good day when we have 3 or 4 coming at 1 time 2 express and 2 mainline and often 1 of those if express and a mainline are utilized by the same ground crew some of us myself included only do 1 flight at a time and however long it takes just as long as it gets done is how long itll be yesterday not much snow on the ground at bwi but having multiple planes with same crew me and my crew having 3 planes at same time.. id be willing to bet the pax were not happy waiting over 50 min for their bags from the DFW and PHX trips.... so tell me again HOW THE HELL ARE WE OVERSTAFFED bob its easy for you to say since ur in a hub and don't handle express planes we have on average 28 flights when combining mainline and express a day sometimes the flex flights to CLT and PHX makes it 30 so again bob tell me how are we overstaffed.....

I think my Alzheimer's is finally coming in? Thought you were in PHX.

And no Bob should never claim that any Station he doesn't work in is overstaffed. I never sent in Bobs resume to Centerport to become their new corporate bean counter so he's still out there like the rest of us slugging those bags to pay those bills.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

Why do you say that? What do you feel they've done or is doing to them?

the way i understand it...

lus guys got to keep x-amount of seniority through years of lus M & A - and that seniority is now applied to the blended list. this was not the case at laa, except for air cal, the reason being is that air cal clerks were also represented by the twu.

reno air? no dice. fueler prior to 1991? no dice. simmons/eagle? no dice. amr? no dice. building cleaners? no dice...etc....etc.

unless, i've been told wrong, it appears that lus clerks were able to acquire seniority in ways that laa clerks could not.

 

[WeAAsles]

the way i understand it...

lus guys got to keep x-amount of seniority through years of lus M & A - and that seniority is now applied to the blended list. this was not the case at laa, except for air cal, the reason being is that air cal clerks were also represented by the twu.

reno air? no dice. fueler prior to 1991? no dice. simmons/eagle? no dice. amr? no dice. building cleaners? no dice...etc....etc.

unless, i've been told wrong, it appears that lus clerks were able to acquire seniority in ways that laa clerks could not.

Perhaps. But that's the way things were written into their agreement and the Arbitrator (wisely IMO) didn't want to shake up the status quo which would have affected far more people if he had.

I guess for anyone who personally feels that for whatever reason they got screwed in the past, this decision is going to keep them feeling the same way till the end.

Some people were getting their hopes up there a little too much and had their heads in the clouds. For them I guess it was a hard fall back to Earth.

 

[WeAAsles]

yes, i agree about staying active. i'm not so sure about handling intl. bags, loading or dumping. every fsc is a wedged bag + extra effort from blowing out their shoulder.

the poor guy must have been gone before he hit the floor. 2 other encoders close to him, but no visual contact from other belts and infrastructure. they didn't know anything. discovered after his belt jammed and facility maintenance looked at a camera.

Encoder. Thanks but no thanks. Sounds like a horrible, lonely way to cash in ones chips.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

well, let's look at it this way..

fsc crandall was hired in 1985 as a fueler. twu job, paid dues. left fueling for title 3 fsc in 1989. been paying twu dues for 31 years. twu and javits say his seniority is 1989.

fsc parker was hired by piedmont in 1986, hired by us air in 1990. got to keep 1/2 seniority and was gifted 1988 seniority since 1990. iam and javits say his seniority is 1988. twu says, "ok, no problem, let's form an association".

fsc parker is now 400 spots ahead of fsc crandall system-wide and 75 spots ahead of him at the same station.

if this is true, i have a problem with this.

 

[AANOTOK]

thanks WeAA Bob I'm currently in BWI yes we are surely understaffed I cannot even tell you how bad it is couple in the fact our belt loaders well lets just say we need few more using one on 1 plane... today for example just 3 agents plus lead for 2 different AB aircraft one a 321 n the other 319 only reason the on time... pilot released brakes despite loading cart of bags Bob we are clearly not overstaffed we handle both mainline and express and I cannot even tell u that its bad on a good day when we have 3 or 4 coming at 1 time 2 express and 2 mainline and often 1 of those if express and a mainline are utilized by the same ground crew some of us myself included only do 1 flight at a time and however long it takes just as long as it gets done is how long itll be yesterday not much snow on the ground at bwi but having multiple planes with same crew me and my crew having 3 planes at same time.. id be willing to bet the pax were not happy waiting over 50 min for their bags from the DFW and PHX trips.... so tell me again HOW THE HELL ARE WE OVERSTAFFED bob its easy for you to say since ur in a hub and don't handle express planes we have on average 28 flights when combining mainline and express a day sometimes the flex flights to CLT and PHX makes it 30 so again bob tell me how are we overstaffed.....

Hey robbed, what is your solution? W says you show them who is boss. You tried that, I doubt it will get you very far. Keep doing what your doing and keep coming here to tell us how bad it is. You pay good money to a union to lodge your complaints and have them rectified. W and I see totally different on this.
If your dues collecting reps can't or won't correct the problem, sorry to say, nothing going to change.

 

[WeAAsles]

well, let's look at it this way..

fsc crandall was hired in 1985 as a fueler. twu job, paid dues. left fueling for title 3 fsc in 1989. been paying twu dues for 31 years. twu and javits say his seniority is 1989.

fsc parker was hired by piedmont in 1986, hired by us air in 1990. got to keep 1/2 seniority and was gifted 1988 seniority since 1990. iam and javits say his seniority is 1988. twu says, "ok, no problem, let's form an association".

fsc parker is now 400 spots ahead of fsc crandall system-wide and 75 spots ahead of him at the same station.

if this is true, i have a problem with this.

But again you have the right to have any problem with anything you want and that's why the Association went with a Nuetral Arbitrator to ultimately make the decision so members can't yell at each Union if they think one sold out to the other.

Javits gave a very detailed explanation as to why the decisions were made and again it all had to do with the language that was in place at the time the member made a move either through his own choice or unfortunately through choices beyond their control.

And if the can of worms was opened for any one particular group of people and not everyone else the bloody murder screaming would have been deafening.

Using myself say as the example. I hired in AA Fleet in May 1995. I went to DFW in 97 for Full Time. Layoff # 1 2001 bumped back to LGA (Still Full Time) Recalled. Layoff # 2 2003 bumped to MIA (Still Full Time)

Since 1997 when I went FT I never left Fleet and never went back to PT or hit the street. So I stayed in compliance with my contract to always protect my seniority and nothing changed on my seniority for this decision.

What I'm essentially saying is if this Arbitrator suddenly decided to change the rules now it becomes unfair to the moves and sacrifices I made in my career.

Obviously I'm satisfied with Arbitrator Javits decision.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

in regards to your moves & sacrifices and your satisfaction with javits' decision:

i guess you have no problem with lus clerks hired in 1998 who had time elsewhere and have now passed you up.

i don't blame javits. he is/was the last filter. the blame goes on the twu. it was explained to me that the twu agreed to this with the iam to form the association. this is what was explained to me.