JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[AANOTOK]

I agree Port. I too felt it would go quicker seeing the non-union folk get there bank accounts inflated as well as the pilots and flight attendants getting done so quickly (and before 700 or W pops in here and says they had mediation staring them in the face, I KNOW)
Also, a mistake, but listening to the company and Doug say they wanted it done yesterday gave me a little hope as well.
Now realization has set in. The company lied. The Association was NOT prepared given the time they had to do so, and Doug and his boys are  wanting concessions. $1000 looks great and I could definitely use it, but not when it requires a concession, any concession. Sorry, that's just me and I'm just one vote. I vote for the Association to withhold anything that is concessionary.
If this company wants concessions in this environment, what will they want back in the tough times.

 

[ograc]

With this latest update, it has now been five months since negotiations have started. They have agreed to I believe 20 T/A's to date with the approximately 40 to round out the agreement. So, looking at it reasonably, being half way there, yet none of the "most important" articles even being discussed (and of course a battle possibly looming with the outsourcing), smart money says there will be no agreement by September. Some of that money even says January (12 months) at the earliest.
Many folks I have spoken with in the past couple of months actually thought June, and July at the latest were the months. I cringed when they would say that.

 
Wishful thinking by those who thought that everything taken would just be given back. Based on recent history and updates that will not be the case. This is trying to negotiate improvements from two bankrupt carriers who have grown accustomed to concessions from their below wing employees.
If Parker meant what he says at town hall meetings this thing would have and could have been close to being done. Instead, behind closed doors, the company throws up resistance to every union proposal. If they counter at all. Based on the current posture of the company in negotiations... my money is maybe January 2017.  We are going to have to be patient. Obviously, this future JCBA, will have to be fought for. "Earned; Never Given." USMC

 

[Worldport]

I agree Port. I too felt it would go quicker seeing the non-union folk get there bank accounts inflated as well as the pilots and flight attendants getting done so quickly (and before 700 or W pops in here and says they had mediation staring them in the face, I KNOW)
Also, a mistake, but listening to the company and Doug say they wanted it done yesterday gave me a little hope as well.
Now realization has set in. The company lied. The Association was NOT prepared given the time they had to do so, and Doug and his boys are  wanting concessions. $1000 looks great and I could definitely use it, but not when it requires a concession, any concession. Sorry, that's just me and I'm just one vote. I vote for the Association to withhold anything that is concessionary.
If this company wants concessions in this environment, what will they want back in the tough times.

So you are willing to wait until possibly   2018 -2019 if need be? It could very well happen. I'm not sure if the airfreight and catering rumors are true and since they are already outsourced here and in most stations I could guess what the majority will say. I truly believe the company got everything they needed in the bankruptcies  but we shall see. Has Bob walked past you yet?

 

[AANOTOK]

A. Yes, willing to wait...
B. Yes, the rumors are true, but it's more than just those two.
C. I know exactly what the masses will say...unfortunately $$$
D. Don't know, with close to 3000 clerks/agents, probably has but wouldn't notice.

 

[Worldport]

A. Yes, willing to wait...
B. Yes, the rumors are true, but it's more than just those two.
C. I know exactly what the masses will say...unfortunately $$$
D. Don't know, with close to 3000 clerks/agents, probably has but wouldn't notice.
 
 

delete

 

[700UW]

They didn't have mediation, they had binding arbitration, huge difference.

And the APFA ended up in binding arbitration for certain items, and they lost.

And the APA are not happy with their agreement and the CWA gave concessions.

 

[AANOTOK]

They didn't have mediation, they had binding arbitration, huge difference.

And the APFA ended up in binding arbitration for certain items, and they lost.

And the APA are not happy with their agreement and the CWA gave concessions.

Huge difference, I agree, my bad.
To the rest of your post I agree, and I hope the Association gets it right.
Like I stated, regardless of time.

 

[ograc]

Huge difference, I agree, my bad.
To the rest of your post I agree, and I hope the Association gets it right.
Like I stated, regardless of time.

 
It will get done eventually. Let's remember the JCBA will dictate the working conditions, wages and benefits for years to come. Let's get it right! Regardless of how long that may take. Let's remember the JCBA represents a seamless operation below wing for the company. They have an interest in an agreement as well.

 

[Talos]

I agree Port. I too felt it would go quicker seeing the non-union folk get there bank accounts inflated as well as the pilots and flight attendants getting done so quickly (and before 700 or W pops in here and says they had mediation staring them in the face, I KNOW)
Also, a mistake, but listening to the company and Doug say they wanted it done yesterday gave me a little hope as well.
Now realization has set in. The company lied. The Association was NOT prepared given the time they had to do so, and Doug and his boys are  wanting concessions. $1000 looks great and I could definitely use it, but not when it requires a concession, any concession. Sorry, that's just me and I'm just one vote. I vote for the Association to withhold anything that is concessionary.
If this company wants concessions in this environment, what will they want back in the tough times.

The corporate greed factor here is astonishing. On a scale of !-!0 it's a 10. All the town hall remarks were just a smoke screen used to placate workers who had to sit and watch other large carriers step up and pay their people. I understand that it's not easy putting a contract together for 2 different groups which complicates it, but the real problem IMO  is the greed. Both sides know the cost situation with the other carriers so it should not require a genius to put a lot of stuff together. We'll see how it goes, but the lack of initiative by the company says a lot.

 

[Worldport]

The corporate greed factor here is astonishing. On a scale of !-!0 it's a 10. All the town hall remarks were just a smoke screen used to placate workers who had to sit and watch other large carriers step up and pay their people. I understand that it's not easy putting a contract together for 2 different groups which complicates it, but the real problem IMO  is the greed. Both sides know the cost situation with the other carriers so it should not require a genius to put a lot of stuff together. We'll see how it goes, but the lack of initiative by the company says a lot.

Except the other groups got theirs. And 700 I know about the arbitration. I don't know what it is, I think the association must have pissed them off somehow

 

[Worldport]

The corporate greed factor here is astonishing. On a scale of !-!0 it's a 10. All the town hall remarks were just a smoke screen used to placate workers who had to sit and watch other large carriers step up and pay their people. I understand that it's not easy putting a contract together for 2 different groups which complicates it, but the real problem IMO  is the greed. Both sides know the cost situation with the other carriers so it should not require a genius to put a lot of stuff together. We'll see how it goes, but the lack of initiative by the company says a lot.

Not greed more like retaliation for not playing the way they wanted. "I'll take my ball and go home" In this case they make us wait for the money.

 

[Talos]

I don't see how the association could have pissed mgmt off. The difficulty of getting together to even get to the table played into the mgmts hand. The other carriers stepping up and paying people did not, This turned into a bad dream for mgmt, who could have had what is now a below market deal if they acted earlier. The longer it takes the more they save and make us pay for our own contract with our lost wages. They are making us wait for sure. I don't know, maybe you are right, but mgmt seems like a bunch of mizers.

 

[ograc]

I don't see how the association could have pissed mgmt off. The difficulty of getting together to even get to the table played into the mgmts hand. The other carriers stepping up and paying people did not, This turned into a bad dream for mgmt, who could have had what is now a below market deal if they acted earlier. The longer it takes the more they save and make us pay for our own contract with our lost wages. They are making us wait for sure. I don't know, maybe you are right, but mgmt seems like a bunch of mizers.

 
Misers indeed! This is going to take awhile folks! Forget what you have heard at Town Hall Meetings. They continue to negotiate with a "cost neutral" mentality. The same mentality that was applied when negotiating contracts under the protection of bankruptcy. The posture remains the same in negotiations. Regardless, of what Senior Officers say at Town Hall Meetings. COST NEUTRAL is all this company is offering at the table.
 

 

[robbedagain]

i think what some may be forgetting is that each the TWU and the IAM had their different set of ways  and the Association has to get everything together by way of taking the best of both contract and meshing into the TAs that currently they have now  20 out of 40   and that is definitely one reason why its taking long  But also I believe the Association is in a position to not bring back an offer to the membership that is concessionary    I know the CWA is or has given up  some things  but I really hope our Association sees that and does not bring it to us bec in this day and age  with the company making Billions in profits  we should not sacrifice a dam thing   Eventually we will get a deal  may be sooner than we know   or may be later  who knows  

 

[WeAAsles]

Misers indeed! This is going to take awhile folks! Forget what you have heard at Town Hall Meetings. They continue to negotiate with a "cost neutral" mentality. The same mentality that was applied when negotiating contracts under the protection of bankruptcy. The posture remains the same in negotiations. Regardless, of what Senior Officers say at Town Hall Meetings. COST NEUTRAL is all this company is offering at the table.

Is someone feeding this to you or is this your personal take on things? Just because the company doesn't want to give us the Moon doesn't mean cost neutral in any way, shape or form.

Everyone who's gotten a deal in the last year or two in our industry has seen dramatic gains against any type of contractual exchanges. But I guess that fact is not to be for old sad sack us?

Improvements on at least 17 out of 20 Articles so far is all fluff I guess?