JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[gulfcoast1]

Uh that was a pretty precise list of the things you'd vote no for there gulfcoast?

How about 50% raise with Status and Station protection DOS?

Anyway sign a deal with the Devil and he may burn ya.

This I would definitely think about, but it would not matter because I think we all would agree it would pass.

 

[gulfcoast1]

I do want Ograc to know I am serious about Scope. I realize it is very important even to the hubs. As we all know most displaced workers do not quit, they go to the hubs.

 

[NYer]

No it is not. I was just saying that if the company wants to bring up the frozen pension, the TWU will want to bring up the prefunding issue. I have heard that once the bankruptcy is finalized as in completely finished with no more Chapter 11-13, 11-14, etc., the TWU will go back to the Arbirtrator for resolution because that was what the Arbitrator said to do. Once it becomes certain that AA will not complete Chapter 11-14, it might change the decision. I think it is doubtful AA will try to file an 11-14 for the retirees, but they are waiting as long as they can to delay closure and the possible repayment of the match.

That came from Koziatek from what I heard. It makes sense to me.

Can't file an 1114 at this point.

This issue would need to be pursued in an Adversarial Proceeding but there has been no action in that case since 2014.

 

[gulfcoast1]

Can't come an 1114 at this point.

This issue would need to be pursued in an Adversarial Proceeding but there has been no action in that case since 2014.

I think you are right about that, but I was told that after the bankruptcy is officially ended they will make another try and there might be a more favorable outcome. I think the possibility of an adversarial hearing is the hold up. Kind of like we have to wait on the equity case until the last appeal has run out.

 

[WeAAsles]

This I would definitely think about, but it would not matter because I think we all would agree it would pass.

Just pointing out and have pointed this out before that we all have a price and we're FOS if we pretend we don't.

How much to cut an enemies throat?
How much to cut a friends throat?
How much to cut your brother's throat?
Mother?

 

[NYer]

I think you are right about that, but I was told that after the bankruptcy is officially ended they will make another try and there might be a more favorable outcome. I think the possibility of an adversarial hearing is the hold up. Kind of like we have to wait on the equity case until the last appeal has run out.

Doubtful.

 

[gulfcoast1]

Just pointing out and have pointed this out before that we all have a price and we're FOS if we pretend we don't.

How much to cut an enemies throat?
How much to cut a friends throat?
How much to cut your brother's throat?
Mother?

I cannot imagine any of that unless it was self defense. What good is any amount of money if you have to live with that on your conscience for the rest of your life.

 

[WeAAsles]

I cannot imagine any of that unless it was self defense. What good is any amount of money if you have to live with that on your conscience for the rest of your life.

Some people have little regard for any conscience.

 

[Deleted member 14439]

How many jobs would be affected if FSC lost deicing?

 

[AANOTOK]

There wouldn't be any job loss as the these are clerks pulled from different areas. The quality of work would obviously be the concern who wants a vendor doing such safety related work. Like AA wanting to outsource jobs who maintain and keep our aircraft in the sky...totally absurd.

 

[cltrat]

AANOTOK, I don't think anyone ever answered you but in CLT ( not that we need it that often ) the city does deicing . I can't speak for anywhere else

 

[CremaDiLimone]

deicing produces seasonal shifts..opens things up a bit. lots of OT.

in some cities that have bad weather and full-blown deicing operations, it's clear that deicing is critical to safety and the efficiency of the deicers/equipment is paramount to getting trips out 5-10 minutes late and not 45-60 minutes late. as the day progresses, it's always a game of catch-up.

i know aa will pay big bucks to a vendor...hundreds of thousands of dollars for 1 deicing truck isn't paying a vendor $15/hr to hire an $11/hr cabin cleaner. the issue here is how much will the deicing vendor pay it's employees to entice them to come to work every day, on time...in bad weather?

if the deicers will get paid $13/hr with no benefits, good luck. aa will have to use plan B, which is cancel flights and then will push for a city vendor/deicing pad or come back to the twu for deicing work.

 

[Traymark]

I agree but I wanted to clarify the contribution vs. a match. I think 3% is a significant amount for a contribution, it's more than half of the current LAA match, but I would still vote no. Although the increased 401k contribution is about the only thing I see that I can say I like.

Lets be clear here: 3% Contribution is piss poor when compared to what the pilots and flight attendants got 3 years ago when the companies financial position was not nearly as strong as it is today.
Current financial position is everything when you are negotiating and we need to take advantage of that on this issue for sure.
Pilots = 16% Contribution
FA's = 9.9% Contribution for over age 55 for 5 years

There needs to be a contribution only, not a match, of at least 12% with no sunset.
That would take away the argument that not everyone puts into their 401K, let the company put it in for them, just like they do for the Pilots and FA's. Why are we the stepchildren of the airline?

 

[Albert]

They likely don't. Letters like that are the Labor version of the shock doctrine.

It's like needing $20, asking your parents for $50, watching them freak out, and then "settling" for $25.

Doesn't that normally happen in the beginning of negotiations

 

[gulfcoast1]

Lets be clear here: 3% Contribution is piss poor when compared to what the pilots and flight attendants got 3 years ago when the companies financial position was not nearly as strong as it is today.
Current financial position is everything when you are negotiating and we need to take advantage of that on this issue for sure.
Pilots = 16% Contribution
FA's = 9.9% Contribution for over age 55 for 5 years

There needs to be a contribution only, not a match, of at least 12% with no sunset.
That would take away the argument that not everyone puts into their 401K, let the company put it in of them, just like they do for the Pilots and FA's. Why are we the stepchildren of the airline?

I don't disagree with you. I was only clarifying that even employees who did not contribute themselves would get some contribution from the company because the email briefing made it sound like they would not. I really had to look to find anything in the company proposal that I liked, and this was about it as it is a sizable increase from the match now, but I agree it should be at least what the Flight Attendants got. I think the negotiators are probably pushing for at least that and we have a good argument for it at least for LAA or employees who are not part of the IAMPF. I am with you in that I do not want to be forced into it and everything I have seen recently indicates LAA will not be forced.