More cities cut from PIT

[Itestwell]

ooooohhhh, and make them serve hot breakfasts on them....

Yes, but we would ONLY serve the breakfast to the commuting employees, not the revenue passengers. After all, these people need to get to PHL.

On second thought, hourly A330 service might prove more convenient for the commuters; they could watch TV on the way with breakfast. Effective immediately, FCO, CDG, LGW, and FRA will be canceled to accommodate this employee shuttle.

:mf_boff:

 

[EMBFA]

You can bet the farm, WN will be adding more flights soon. Especially in the Florida market. From past experience, US gives its markets to WN on a silver platter.

Wow, I'm glad US cutting some leftover RJ flights from the Burgh to nowhere has opened this opportunity for Southwest.

An airport authority that is begging for service, an entire concourse worth of empty gates, a huge amount of available experienced airline employees, a barely focus city for a network carrier being pulled down... kinda makes you think if WN wanted to expand Burgh service they would have.

But oh yeah, its the center of the world. We're giving it away on a silver platter. "And its such a nice airport."

 

[Itestwell]

Wow, I'm glad US cutting some leftover RJ flights from the Burgh to nowhere has opened this opportunity for Southwest.

An airport authority that is begging for service, an entire concourse worth of empty gates, a huge amount of available experienced airline employees, a barely focus city for a network carrier being pulled down... kinda makes you think if WN wanted to expand Burgh service they would have.

But oh yeah, its the center of the world. We're giving it away on a silver platter. "And its such a nice airport."

Please, don't confuse them with logic.

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

Colodny chose to run over dealing with a potential firestorm, like it or not.

It must have been one hell of a potential meltdown to throw away $300/400 million plus all the draw down expenses. The avoidance of those issues caught up with US.

 

[Itestwell]

It must have been one hell of a potential meltdown to throw away $300/400 million plus all the draw down expenses. The avoidance of those issues caught up with US.

RIght, but USAir did not just decide, one morning, to "pull down" the West Coast or BWI, and simply hand it to Southwest because they didn't "feel" like competing. The issue was cost, plain and simple.

 

[ClueByFour]

I read somewhere( I apologize for not having a definitive source so take it for what it is worth) that SWA had no immediate plans for further expansion there.

The last time they said that they promptly threw 3x/day down to BWI and added a frequency to PHL. Southwest does not generally tip their hand on expansion until you read it in the newspaper.

In other news:

I repeat--US, in a post-BK world, can't make it go at PIT to BWI and PHL. BWI I guess I can understand. PHL?

This business of "moving to profitable flying" did not work in California, nor did it work at BWI, nor in Florida. The run and hide routine has never worked.

The funny thing about all of this is two little things which are often overlooked:

1. PIT's O&D is greater than CLTs, and climbing (it's higher than it ever was during the US hub days). By the looks of the airport when I go thru (which I don't all that often anymore since I don't live up there), O&D has gone up a lot.

2. When US East was printing money, PIT had 500 flights/day. That's with labor costs that were not artificially lowered by BK, BTW.

You have to connect people somewhere. If nobody goes to PIT, even fewer go to CLT. And PHL is a shithole for connections (and nothing will ever change that).

But hey--I'm sure the US' customer base will continue to come back meltdown after meltdown in PHL. Or having to fly LGA-IND via CLT to ensure their luggage (and them) actually make it.

 

[zethya]

What if PIT thru a party for all the true LCCs and nobody showed up?
I read somewhere... that SWA had no immediate plans for further expansion there... If someone from SWA who reads this can help out w/ some info. I think they had other cities to go to first.
Thanks

Last week WN's CEO stated they are considering starting international service from PHL, either themselves or in partnership with ATA, and are waiting impatietly for the promised 4 additional gates this Fall. I'd speculate WN will likely redefine a portion of their route structure to feed those flights since relying on PHL (internatonal) O&D with US and several others already in the game is probably quite risky. If WN thought PIT had significant potential, I'd think they would have considered it instead of PHL purely from a competitive position - i.e., PIT has No internatonal competitors.

 

[LD3]

1. PIT's O&D is greater than CLTs, and climbing (it's higher than it ever was during the US hub days). By the looks of the airport when I go thru (which I don't all that often anymore since I don't live up there), O&D has gone up a lot.
Does anyone know the O & D numbers between these two cities? Also, what does it cost U to operate out of PIT, it is alot more than operating out of CLT..

 

[EMBFA]

).

But hey--I'm sure the US' customer base will continue to come back meltdown after meltdown in PHL. Or having to fly LGA-IND via CLT to ensure their luggage (and them) actually make it.

Why not just fly direct LGA-IND?

 

[flyJOE]

If WN thought PIT had significant potential, I'd think they would have considered it instead of PHL purely from a competitive position - i.e., PIT has No internatonal competitors.

If WN is so in love with PIT as all the Burgh supporters say, why hasn't this turned into a huge focus city? PIT would make room & supply plenty of gates for WN to grow. The only near term growth we'll likely see from WN out of PIT are to the same old places like TPA, MCO, MDW, BNA and maybe a PHX or LAS trip. I can't see the growth to places like LAX, OAK, DEN, HOU, MSY, etc... the Airport Authority is expecting of their knight in shining armor.

 

[flyJOE]

Isn't PIT-LNS also getting cut? Why is LNS an EAS airport anyway? MDT is only 20 minutes away and 1/2 the population on LNS is Amish. Bring in some RJ's into RDG, closet nearby airport is at least 1 hour.

I think a year or so ago, LNS was to lose EAS funding because of it's mileage distance from PHL, but Sen. Arlen argued the mileage test didn't work because the driving time was longer because they weren't interstate roads. So Air Midwest was able to get another EAS grant.

I just can't see US running RJs from RDG-CLT, instead forcing you to make the drive to PHL or even ABE/MDT depending on where you live.

 

[JS]

I think a year or so ago, LNS was to lose EAS funding because of it's mileage distance from PHL, but Sen. Arlen argued the mileage test didn't work because the driving time was longer because they weren't interstate roads. So Air Midwest was able to get another EAS grant.

I just can't see US running RJs from RDG-CLT, instead forcing you to make the drive to PHL or even ABE/MDT depending on where you live.

US needs the RJ's to fly PIT-PHL.

Also, US doesn't open new markets. I wonder if Delta will start service to RDG. They've started flying to several airports recently that had little or no scheduled service (not always successful, like HKY) -- HKY, ISO, ILG, TTN, OAJ, MTH

 

[AstroLounge]

Are you serious? Maybe we should put hourly B767 service on PIT-PHL for employee convenience. :blink:

Airlines do not operate flights/ routes because of the amount of commuting personnel. Don't believe me? Talk to the LAX/SFO/SAN girls.

Sorry.

Agreed. IF an employee chooses to commute (and I did it for several years) it is a CHOICE that YOU (the employee) makes. Expecting the Company to make additional flights avail to accomodate YOUR schedule and travel nightmare is beyond ridiculous. The PSA folks have been doing the commute for years and are usually The Best to work with....the tales of the PIT-PHL gypsies gets REAL Old, IMO. (I hated commuting and made myself MAKE a Choice and NEVER looked back.....some people do it and rarely complain, others spend more time b*tching about IT, I just question WHY?

 

[flyJOE]

Also, US doesn't open new markets. I wonder if Delta will start service to RDG. They've started flying to several airports recently that had little or no scheduled service (not always successful, like HKY) -- HKY, ISO, ILG, TTN, OAJ, MTH

True, but DL opens new markets with all of the risk on the city themselves. HKY & ISO have been axed after all of the subsidies were used up. You would think OAJ & EWN may be strong enough to keep DL flights, but we'll see after the money runs if they and places like SOP, SLE, SBP, MTH keep their new services. I'd say ILG is safe because it's all marketing related to be the only carrier (with partner carriers) to fly to all 50 states.

US really needs to jump on some of the SCASD grants like DL & other carriers to do some growing, with reduced risk.

 

[Jimmy Neutron]

This business of "moving to profitable flying" did not work in California, nor did it work at BWI, nor in Florida. The run and hide routine has never worked.

The funny thing about all of this is two little things which are often overlooked:

1. PIT's O&D is greater than CLTs, and climbing (it's higher than it ever was during the US hub days). By the looks of the airport when I go thru (which I don't all that often anymore since I don't live up there), O&D has gone up a lot.

2. When US East was printing money, PIT had 500 flights/day. That's with labor costs that were not artificially lowered by BK, BTW.

You have to connect people somewhere. If nobody goes to PIT, even fewer go to CLT. And PHL is a shithole for connections (and nothing will ever change that).

But hey--I'm sure the US' customer base will continue to come back meltdown after meltdown in PHL. Or having to fly LGA-IND via CLT to ensure their luggage (and them) actually make it.

That pretty much says it all, but there are just too many company kool-aid drinkers here to understand it....

Too bad it will be another trip through BK and thousands of more layoffs when the kool-aid wears off....for them to realize that....While Parker and the boys leave with OUR boat-loads of $cash$....

Like another poster (on this board)

BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU WISH FOR