Remember seniority is a creature of contract right? so how can it be forever?, and you are right usapa's own attorney has said that you will never overturn the award, you have a "chance" at signing a contract that will give you doh, but then it won't apply to any other mergers, Nic. would be controlling.
NMB Speaks: We Have an Election! ALPA/USAPA Topic for 2/19-26
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Remember seniority is a creature of contract right? so how can it be forever?, and you are right usapa's own attorney has said that you will never overturn the award, you have a "chance" at signing a contract that will give you doh, but then it won't apply to any other mergers, Nic. would be controlling.
That's what I am wondering. This CAN NOT be real. If so, USAPA is in deeper doo-doo than I (one of the biggest USAPA skeptics) ever thought.
If it is real, even I, for the first time, actually feel bad for the East pilots. I cannot believe lawyers would be this stupid and/or irresponsible enough to take advantage of clients like this.
If this post were made, say, last May or June, well, OK, maybe. But were these words really said in FEBRUARY 2008?!?!
Tell me it isn't so.
sharktooth
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Actually, what would be controlling is the current list at the time of merger implementation date, whatever that turns out to be. That would be the list, in its entirety, that would apply.
The worst that would happen would be that US would be integrated into ALPA, if a USAPA/ALPA merger, and all the pilots would then get assessed fees for resulting lawsuits.
sharktooth
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I don't think it says what your wishful thinking might make it into.
Elevation
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If USAPA wants to force a contract on the west they will have to get out of the Transition Agreement, because both sides have to agree on a new contract to bring it to a vote. Getting out of the TA may be possible but the big deal is that the only thing stopping the Nic Award from being implemented is the TA!
N924PS
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Does the T/A address fleet size? Or is that under LOA 93?
Oh you guys are really getting your hopes up, but as I said: As soon as End of ALPA or Nostradomas gets on here they will be able to shed some light. I only post it so as to head off any future debate. My first clue that it is not genuine is that it was removed from the WebBoard. I did not even think this was possible. I am just now joining this debate and have some catching up to do. Being on leave sometimes means being in the dark, but it does not mean I will bite on everything that is emailed to me. I use this board to ground-truth a small fraction of the stuff that gets sent to me.
On the one hand, you just can not believe that our lawyers would let something like this out, but on the other hand it does raise some interesting questions. I am told that the cost neutral idea is in the Road Show videos, but I am still looking.
In any case...USAPA can handle this too. ALPA will soon be gone. We are sick of the ineptitude, and throwing ALPA Aeromedical in our face as the only reason to keep ALPA is not going to cut it. You argue that we are emotionally locked up with our ears closed, but it is you that will awake to a new reality on April 17th.
On the one hand, you just can not believe that our lawyers would let something like this out, but on the other hand it does raise some interesting questions. I am told that the cost neutral idea is in the Road Show videos, but I am still looking.
In any case...USAPA can handle this too. ALPA will soon be gone. We are sick of the ineptitude, and throwing ALPA Aeromedical in our face as the only reason to keep ALPA is not going to cut it. You argue that we are emotionally locked up with our ears closed, but it is you that will awake to a new reality on April 17th.
The west lawyers say they can't get out of the TA, The TA doesn't specify separate ratification, alpa rules do. usapa claims that alpa rules cease to exist, while the west lawyers claim that the tA was based on alpa rules, and as such all precoditions remain in effect until a single agreement is ratified, it will be the first lawsuit is my guess.
I told, I spoke with the west mec chairman and they already knew about it last week, there is nothing new in that post, just look at usapa's videos, you can't overturn the award, ever, and if the wests claims for separate ratification wins the day, what then?
nostradamus
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It is near impossible to overturn an arbitrated award, everyone knew this from day one. I am not one of the brave originators of USAPA, but I support them 100 percent. Below are my goals.
plan a
Get rid of alpa. Joint negotiated contract that makes the nic award impotent for 10 years.
plan b
If no USAPA, alpa joint negotiated contract that makes the nic award impotent for 10 years.
plan c
Make sure that future pilots and management never allow such an Alzheimer induced decision to ever happen again. Use you imagination on how this will be accomplished.
plan a
Get rid of alpa. Joint negotiated contract that makes the nic award impotent for 10 years.
plan b
If no USAPA, alpa joint negotiated contract that makes the nic award impotent for 10 years.
plan c
Make sure that future pilots and management never allow such an Alzheimer induced decision to ever happen again. Use you imagination on how this will be accomplished.
So the new merger law won't apply to future mergers?
velocitymanager
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BoeingBoy
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That only means that you don't have to belong to the union to work, but paying the administrative fee can still be required of non-members.
Speaking of precedent, however, wasn't there a thread several months ago with a series of posts about how no US pilot had been fired for non-payment? I think even Sharktooth was saying that the "pay or be fired" threat was a farce......
Jim
Not sure of your point. State "right to work" laws are only applicable to NLRA-covered employees, not RLA-covered ones (which includes airline employees).
Phoenix
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Some of you military pukes remember going through survival training. How could you forget it! 
One thing that really stands out in your memory of survival training is the Rabbit! You know what I am talking about... the live, cute, furry, rabbit that they gave us after we hadn't eaten in a week. The wittle, floppy eared.... DINNER!
You remember how they taught us to hang the rabbit upside down by holding the rabbit's back legs in our left hand. The rabbit would kick and squeal for awhile and we were told not to kill it then because the meat would be tough. We were supposed to wait a few minutes for the rabbit to calm down a little and then we were instructed to softly pet the rabbit with our right hand until his floppy ears relaxed... then... bang! We would use the same hand that did the petting to whack it in the back of the neck to finish it off for dinner.
If you find yourself upside down... and somebody keeps sending you letters trying to pet your neck. Don't relax. Bite. Bite harder. And bite again until they can't hold you anymore.
A fellow rabbit. 😀
One thing that really stands out in your memory of survival training is the Rabbit! You know what I am talking about... the live, cute, furry, rabbit that they gave us after we hadn't eaten in a week. The wittle, floppy eared.... DINNER!
You remember how they taught us to hang the rabbit upside down by holding the rabbit's back legs in our left hand. The rabbit would kick and squeal for awhile and we were told not to kill it then because the meat would be tough. We were supposed to wait a few minutes for the rabbit to calm down a little and then we were instructed to softly pet the rabbit with our right hand until his floppy ears relaxed... then... bang! We would use the same hand that did the petting to whack it in the back of the neck to finish it off for dinner.
If you find yourself upside down... and somebody keeps sending you letters trying to pet your neck. Don't relax. Bite. Bite harder. And bite again until they can't hold you anymore.
A fellow rabbit. 😀
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