Or could it be that the AWA MEC is unwilling to change their views because they followed the rules, had a legally binding arbitration, and are accepting the results. That is what honorable people do. As for those who want to argue "redo" every time they don't like the results of a fair process that they agreed to, well just read your own posts and see how small you look . . .
Nothing wrong with the Nicalou
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nostradamus
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AWA320 Quote
"I need to check my UAL contacts to make sure they on board with praters actions because if not we can say bye bye to him now..."
Nostradamus asks
What does United contacts have to do with anything? How would this make it more right or wrong? How would UAL opinion have anything to do with Capt. Praters' future?
AWA320
"I see you know nothing of union politics, better stick to predicting the future nos!!"
Nostradamus asks, "can you answer my question specifically please? My question did not ask your appraisal of my knowledge of union politics. "
I will try again.
"AWA320,What does your United contacts have to do with anything? How would this make it more right or wrong? How would UAL opinion have anything to do with Capt. Praters' future?
"I need to check my UAL contacts to make sure they on board with praters actions because if not we can say bye bye to him now..."
Nostradamus asks
What does United contacts have to do with anything? How would this make it more right or wrong? How would UAL opinion have anything to do with Capt. Praters' future?
AWA320
"I see you know nothing of union politics, better stick to predicting the future nos!!"
Nostradamus asks, "can you answer my question specifically please? My question did not ask your appraisal of my knowledge of union politics. "
I will try again.
"AWA320,What does your United contacts have to do with anything? How would this make it more right or wrong? How would UAL opinion have anything to do with Capt. Praters' future?
OP
AWA320
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- #63
Easy question Nos. This union is all political and UAL carries a great deal of say. Now since UAL is really responsible for the outstanding merger policy we have today. Now if UAL tells national to back off that's almost 8000 pilots votes. They could very easily walk away from ALPA. Now since UAL is or could be the next in line for a merger under this policy it would be the last propety ALPA would want to chance leaving.
I hope that's clear, UNION POLITICS 101 follow the money.
Hawkhunter
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- Jul 11, 2005
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[ Can you point me to where this supposed windfall is?? I have been looking all over and can't seem to find it? Just where the hell is it.
Then take your head out of your a$$ and take a look "Broken Record Man"
Then take your head out of your a$$ and take a look "Broken Record Man"
nostradamus
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Thank you for your help in explaining my point.
767jetz
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- Aug 20, 2002
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Your assessment is somewhat accurate, but incomplete. It actually goes much deeper than that. Let me explain...
During the last election, Prater's predecessor Duane Worthe tried to "buy" the UA MEC's votes by putting UA's Master Chairman, Mark Bathurst on the ticket as his #2 guy. This would have given UA a VERY strong voice within ALPA's political system. The LEC Chairmen mulled this idea, but realized that the UA pilots had grown tired of Worth. In the end they put aside their temptation to put one of our own in a top position, and cast their vote for Prater instead. This is what gave the win to Prater as the the new President of ALPA.
Prater is well aware that he owes his success to the UAL pilots, and has voiced this directly to the MEC after his win. Without UA's support (ie: their votes) he would have lost to Worthe.
This is why UA's MEC has Prater's ear when they want it. That is not to say that UA is getting involved with the Nicolau award. But it is safe to say that IF the UA MEC decides to voice an opinion about it, (on or off the record) Prater will hear us.
Here is an interesting letter sent out to us last week by the UAL-MEC Merger Committee:
June 2007
The arbitrated seniority list decision between the America West and US Airways pilots was issued on May 3, 2007. After extensive study and information gathering, your UAL-MEC Merger Committee is in the process of putting together an in-depth report concerning this arbitration.
As you might suspect, any speculation about this decision by your Merger Committee might be used against us in a future negotiation, mediation or arbitration involving any seniority integration. The UAL-MEC Merger Committee will be giving an oral report at the upcoming special UAL-MEC meeting in Chicago on June 14th and 15th. The PowerPoint presentation and written report we will use at this meeting will be placed on the Merger Committee page of the UAL-MEC webpage shortly after the meeting adjourns.
One lesson that stands out concerning the arbitrated seniority integration decision involving US Airways and America West is that by failing to negotiate a solution, the pilots placed their collective futures in the hands of a third party. While sometimes that cannot be avoided, it is always a risk. That fact has clearly been underscored by the Alaska Airlines compensation arbitration a few years ago which dealt a substantial pay decrease to the pilots of Alaska. In the US Airways-America West case, the pilots who are most unhappy with the decision undoubtedly are asking themselves whether a little more flexibility in the earlier stages of the proceedings might have served them better.
The US Airways MEC and the America West MEC made presentations to the ALPA Executive Council on May 21, 2007. The Executive Council is considering the presentations at this time and will report back to both MECs in the near future. Clearly, ALPA realizes the impact mergers and acquisitions have on pilots from both airlines.
Make no mistake: having a divided pilot group is management’s best friend. Rumors of mergers or acquisitions contribute to taking our “eye off of the ball†in our attempt to get back what we lost during bankruptcy. Your UAL-MEC Merger Committee is paying very close attention to the US Airways – America West merger, as well as other industry developments going on around us.
The UAL-MEC is aware of the importance of keeping our pilot group unified and forward-looking. We all need to continue to be vigilant of industry and union happenings. Although there is no news with regard to consolidation that involves United, be assured that the UAL-MEC and the UAL-MEC Merger Committee are ready to act aggressively to defend your career no matter what events unfold. As always, we thank you for your support.
Just some food for thought...
Hawkhunter
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- Jul 11, 2005
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Many have explained it over and over, to the point of sounding like a broken record. Oh, wait thats you. As far as personal attacks take a look at your own post spanky.As far as easy for you what in the heck do you think you can do? What power do you think you have? So I am glad I make it easy for you because we can do many things all you can do is watch your left seat go into the sunset. You are all talk pal. You have no point.
USA320Pilot
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- May 18, 2003
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The vast majority of the US Airways pilots believe the Nicolau Award violated ALPA Merger Policy. If the East pilots believed the Award had complied with the Policy then they could accept the decision.
Regardless, if there is not a consensual agreement then there will be no joint contract and as the EC resolution states "the EC is acutely aware of the negative consequences that may result if the MECs fail to come together to explore consensual approaches that promote career protection and mutual success."
The more I read and hear from AWA pilots the more I believe the East pilots will become even more content to live under LOA 93, prevent the Nicolau Award from being implemented, prevent a joint contract, and lead the decertification of ALPA on this and possibly other properties. Through this process the company will continue to suffer, passengers will probably defect, and the carrier's financials will deteriorate.
The only way this can be stopped is for the AWA MEC to change their position on the EC's decision to seek to have the parties reach a consensual accord or something like Prater's desire to have "the MECs to immediately engage in a process to utilize the JNC and other parties to explore fences and other career progression provisions."
If not then the parties should seek a release from the Transition Agreement directed joint contract talks, go their separate ways, stop the two companies from fully integrating, and stop wasting each others time.
Regards,
USA320Pilot
Regardless, if there is not a consensual agreement then there will be no joint contract and as the EC resolution states "the EC is acutely aware of the negative consequences that may result if the MECs fail to come together to explore consensual approaches that promote career protection and mutual success."
The more I read and hear from AWA pilots the more I believe the East pilots will become even more content to live under LOA 93, prevent the Nicolau Award from being implemented, prevent a joint contract, and lead the decertification of ALPA on this and possibly other properties. Through this process the company will continue to suffer, passengers will probably defect, and the carrier's financials will deteriorate.
The only way this can be stopped is for the AWA MEC to change their position on the EC's decision to seek to have the parties reach a consensual accord or something like Prater's desire to have "the MECs to immediately engage in a process to utilize the JNC and other parties to explore fences and other career progression provisions."
If not then the parties should seek a release from the Transition Agreement directed joint contract talks, go their separate ways, stop the two companies from fully integrating, and stop wasting each others time.
Regards,
USA320Pilot
OP
AWA320
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- #70
Go back and find where I personally attacked anyone!!! You may not like what I say or my point of view but I don't resort to name calling unless I am attacked first. Now that doesn't make it right but we are all human.
Well as for my being able to effect change, maybe maybe not however I am able to get my points heard by my MEC and my EVP. Left seat?? it comes when it comes I not as hung up on that as you are. I am just as interested in making some real coin...
nostradamus
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AWA320
"I am just as interested in making some real coin..."
Nostradamus says
Amazing new concept, very original quest.
"I am just as interested in making some real coin..."
Nostradamus says
Amazing new concept, very original quest.
nostradamus
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- Dec 7, 2004
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.
What you want in life is no different than I want, except you want it sooner and without sweat on your brow, hence your pathetic desperate postings.
The fact remains you will have to live with me no matter what happens, you will choose the tone of our future relationship.
OP
AWA320
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- #74
Ok I can accept that and agree I do have to live with you. We both choose the tone of any realationship as it's never a one person show. Now with regards to the NIC award I disagree with you that it violated POLICY. Northwest didn't agree with you and I am sure other merger committees will put together an analysis that come to the same conslusion, that the award was fair.
You decide how we are going to be because I have no problem.
